And so it begins...

[Jupitus]

Perhaps for you, perhaps not for me.


Thanks. And I will do it if I can in a “safe” way. It’s not like I would abuse the game to 100% and not ever touch the key-board. Because that I don’t wont to.

AhoyHoy: I am with you on the issue that “cheating” ruins some parts of the game. Hey I wouldn’t like to have a free lvl 60 char when ever I like to. But if Blizzard or any company make it possible for you to “cheat” to skip some really boring parts like crafting (I haven’t tried WoW yet so I don’t know how there crafting system work) then I would do it.


Why not? If they have this “ybber” system to get people that don’t play the game like they think it was suppose to, then it shouldn’t matter if I give them my charnames/server/IP-address. But if they got holes in the system and I can make use of them then I will abuse them.

What Blizzard should do if they really would like to stop all the cheating and what you refer to as “hacking” is that they would add a reward system for the one that points out a “failure of deign” that make it possible to abuse something to gain some extra advantage. It don’t need to be something big. Can be an item, a nice looking cloak, or a free month, something that will encourage people to “help” with the game. It shouldn’t be something big, because then we would get a witch hunt in game.

Why don’t we see a system like this also? If they now are so willing to stop people for abusing it.

So in other words you are gonna exploit or cheat because Blizzard won't give you an uber sword for pointing the problems out to them? You complete tosser.

 

[Nilam]

So in other words you are gonna exploit or cheat because Blizzard won't give you an uber sword for pointing the problems out to them? You complete tosser.

... ofc not. But if they would like to have a game where no one can get advantage by exploiting the “designer bugs” then they should have a symbolic rewarding system.

Perhaps you don’t see my opinion in this issue; perhaps you don’t won’t to see it.

 

[Jupitus]

... ofc not. But if they would like to have a game where no one can get advantage by exploiting the “designer bugs” then they should have a symbolic rewarding system.

Perhaps you don’t see my opinion in this issue; perhaps you don’t won’t to see it.

The reward you get from not abusing the system, and discouraging others not to, and indeed reporting those you suspect or know are doing so is to have a playing environment where cheats and exploiters are the rare exception and in general everyone plays on a level playing field with respected fellow gamers. Looking for loopholes to gain an unfair advantage is pitiful.

 

[Belomar]

If I could rob a bank and not get caught... I would do it.

Complete retard alert. Very sad to see this kind of attitude, and I hope you get what's coming to you.

 

[Driwen]

What Blizzard should do if they really would like to stop all the cheating and what you refer to as “hacking” is that they would add a reward system for the one that points out a “failure of deign” that make it possible to abuse something to gain some extra advantage. It don’t need to be something big. Can be an item, a nice looking cloak, or a free month, something that will encourage people to “help” with the game. It shouldn’t be something big, because then we would get a witch hunt in game.

yes lets reward people for finding weaknesses in the game code. That would probably result in more cheat programs being created, as you could first run it for a month to "test" it and then tell Blizzard how your cheat works (which they probably already know).
The thing is allthough Blizzard(or any other game studio) might know the weaknesses in their game, they might not be able to fix it any time soon. Example is the door/windows in your house, it is the best way for a thief to get in. Doesnt mean you can just remove them though or have the money to spare to improve their design.

And I think you would steal a lolly of a 2 year old just because you would get away with it and thats also how pathetic most think you are.

 

[Nilam]

Yeah perhaps Jupitus. Perhaps. But I am sorry to say that it isn’t enough for me.

 

[Elenos]

This goes back to the, because people shouldn't steal from me i will leave my house open and it will be safe. except that you are on the retard end of it.

Saying that "if it were unpunishable you would steal from a bank" represents almost everything that is currently wrong with society. People with no moral or ethical values that should be locked up and permanently pelted with stones. The arsehole attitude of "people should give me things because i found a flaw in their system" is sickening. It should be considered a duty and a responsibility of everyone that if you find an in-game bug/exploit that you report it for the good of the game environment. If you enjoy the game then you will want it to be running for many years and the way to do this is to make sure it works properly - without people abusing it. I hope one day you are captured by a horde of rabid monkeys that form an alliance to shit in your mouth and castrate you with a rusty spoon. No other punishment is suitable for the scum of the world that you are.

P.S please excuse the WoW pun.
P.P.S you may tell that i have given up on the image of correcting people and now firmly beleive that crooks and criminals should be shot and then shot another 10 times just to make sure.

 

[FuzzyLogic]

Before we all carry on abusing Nilam with the more...descriptive attacks, take it down a notch (Don't take that as any endorsement to abuse him/her though because it'll fall on your head too ).

I don't agree with you either Nilam, with Blizzards zero tolerance policy on hacks or cheats, using them to your advantage simply because they wouldn't reward you with some material gain won't work and you'll only end up banned.

That said, I remember Mythic rewarding certain people lifetime subscriptions for being particularly helpful, think it was for reporting types of exploits without using them to their own advantage. So it's been done before, might still be again but as it is Blizzard don't offer any reward and comes with the added bonus of being banned if the exploit is used and the cheater wasting their money.

 

[Nilam]

Sorry for the cute and past when I quote you but in some way I do agree with some of your opinions.

And I think you would steal a lolly of a 2 year old just because you would get away with it and thats also how pathetic most think you are.

No I do not think it’s the same as stealing from a 2 year old...
Here just some questions to you Driwen to try and make you understand how I feel in the statement “because I can” Have you ever downloaded an .mp3 to whom you do not own an original? Have you ever recorded a movie from your TV to whom you not own the original? Have you ever installed a program on your computer to whom you do not own an original licence?
I am fairly sure you have, I have... If not you are a saint. But if you have violated this laws??? Why wouldn’t you abuse a game if you could? It isn’t like you breaking any laws like you did when you downloaded that .mp3.

Can you all try and not do personal attacks. Yes you are free to do them but it sort of drags down the discussion to a very low level. =/

 

[FuzzyLogic]

Comparing downloading mp3s to exploiting cheats in WoW are two very different things to me. If you download an mp3 from the Internet the likelyhood of being caught doing that is slim (depending on your location and where your grabbing the mp3 from) whereas the WoW servers are an enclosed medium.

Blizzard can be informed of and detect exploiters with relative ease and punish them duly with no immediate repercussions aside from possibly losing several customers (which for many other companies would be detrimental though Blizzards following is immense and the people banned are likely to buy the product again anyhow - That's me speculating btw ). Downloading an mp3 isn't unbalancing a 'fair' playing field that gives one person a distinct advantage over another in my eyes.

It's all about risk verses reward, are you really willing to exploit to gain an advantage even if the odds are heavily against you for being caught and banned?

 

[Nilam]

It's all about risk verses reward, are you really willing to exploit to gain an advantage even if the odds are heavily against you for being caught and banned?

No I think that I did state that.. perhaps I didn’t. But ofc there will be a calculation in the risks. That’s why I did the “.... not get caught” statement.

Downloading an mp3 isn't unbalancing a 'fair' playing field that gives one person a distinct advantage over another in my eyes.

No not perhaps but if we would take an .mp3 example again. (I like them =P)
To download an .mp3 will give you an unfair advantage against anyone that actually will go and buy the record/single. You didn’t play for it!

And this is in some way how I see on the abusing game cheats etc. If they are there and I can abuse them because blizzard would not change them (ok that it can be hard to fix.... but I do think that they can if they just took time and resources) and the risk that I get busted is minimal (like downloading a .mp3) then why shouldn’t I?


Sorry people if it now seems like I am leaving a sinking ship. Am not ^^
It’s just that I am going away a couple of days but I try to get online every now and then to keep this discussion alive =) I will be back in a couple of days anyhow ^^ so keep them coming =)

 

[FuzzyLogic]

No not perhaps but if we would take an .mp3 example again. (I like them =P)
To download an .mp3 will give you an unfair advantage against anyone that actually will go and buy the record/single. You didn’t play for it!

Very true, but if one person pays and the other doesn't, the one who didn't purchase the mp3 hasn't directly interfered with the person who did. In a game such as WoW, it can and does interfere. Indirect consequences such as the effect bots have on the economy would be moot since apparently the music industry is dying because of the scourge of MP3s and P2P

And this is in some way how I see on the abusing game cheats etc. If they are there and I can abuse them because blizzard would not change them (ok that it can be hard to fix.... but I do think that they can if they just took time and resources) and the risk that I get busted is minimal (like downloading a .mp3) then why shouldn’t I?

It's been mentioned before but it's correct, it's a moral and ethical decision. Just because an exploit can be used to gain an advantage doesn't mean it should, or that there is some obligation to use said exploit until it's closed. I agree Blizzard should probably put more resources into closing these loopholes. The point is though, they shouldn't have to.

Unfortunately it's happened all through history, people can and will exploit any advantage they can get to give themselves an edge, it's human nature. Although it simply has no place in a game with precisely defined rules and also its own set of laws governing conduct within the game.

Not entirely finished but i'm late for heading off to the cinema so i'm leaving it there

 

[Tharion]

Nilam:
I bet you used Radar in DAoC because you could.

 

[Driwen]

No I do not think it’s the same as stealing from a 2 year old...

you more or less said you would do anything if you could get away with it. So not caring for the consequences on others for your actions. Meaning if you could get away with stealing that candy and you wanted it, you would.

Here just some questions to you Driwen to try and make you understand how I feel in the statement “because I can” Have you ever downloaded an .mp3 to whom you do not own an original? Have you ever recorded a movie from your TV to whom you not own the original? Have you ever installed a program on your computer to whom you do not own an original licence?

first recording anything from your tv for own use is allowed actually. Dl'íng mp3's/software isnt and yes I have done those things, but there is a limit to when I will steal stuff. If I think it is good than I will buy it or if I think I should support that group.

And cheating in a game is different as others have pointed out. In a game is often a competition between the players, if one of them is cheating that means the competition is messed up and atleast the fun of competing with eachother is gone. Basically cheating means you are ruining the fun of the other players.