About high level grouping or the lack thereof and guilds..

[old.Kelmon]

This is both a rant and a opinion.

I have a lvl 46 healer on Midgard, Prydwen. Played him a lot, and he's great fun to play. Never had much problems to find a group to help out.

A disturbing trend I have noticed is the 'Guild only' grouping of the high level characters. In the last 8 or 9 days, every group I found was 'full' and/or 'guild only'. Somewhere along the line these people forgot what the game is about. It's not about their guild. It's about Midgard as a whole.. The other realms are quickly gaining in strength, and while we now have the overhand, we won't in two updates.

If you have a 'guild' group, and you do have space, be nice, and invite those that are looking for one. (I'm asking this for those that find themselves with the same problem as I.)

A shining example of how to do it right is Nemesis. This guild I've never had any trouble grouping with. (Thanks, Azal! And the others that I've grouped with, Kulgan, Cruz, Gro, et al.

End of rant. Take it as you will.

 

[old.Yomar]

I agree with you if your comment applies to grouping only. However, please note that there is something called "official guild raids" for members only. Often these raids are for practise, items, loot, donations to the guild, etcetera. Our guild organizes such a raid once a week - I'm not sure about other guilds.

In our case, it is possible to "tag along" with these raids, provided you have read our guild charter and have a good relationship with some of our guild members.

 

[SFXman]

I suppose I agree on thee fact that occasionally if someone has arrived alone into some empty place and there is on guild group with a free spot they could invite him. But then again if another guild member arrives he should be invited instead.
Of course guilds can have guild-only groups/raids or whatever...

 

[dozigden]

Kelmon,

I fully agree that guilds need to be open to the idea of grouping outside the guild. We (Savage Conclave) often have groups with 5 or 6 savages in and an assortment of other players. However once a week we have a guild event, and this is exactly what it says on the tin.

On our events we often get people asking to group up - and have to politely say no. Our events are a way for the guild to get to know everyone and to group out side of their normal level. They often end up being not very productive for the higher levels, and very productive for the lowers. This makes the groups very attractive to non guild people. But primarily were out to have fun.

These events are normally fairly distinguishable because there will be more than one group there - I should imagine the same applies for other guilds. In this situation people need to understand it is unlikely they will get into a group there.

 

[SFXman]

Exactly what I mean, guild may have special occasions or events planned much earlier which imho can be kept private. However if it is just a sudden idea to go to a dungeon with a group of guild members and space is available the occasional outsider may be invited.

 

[Olgark]

I have asked a few groups to join and gotten the guild only message back. This does not bother me as I know that guilds do have raids and events.

They need to have these events in my opinion to be able to work as a team and to get to know each other.

I play a runemaster as my main character and often group with a mate who plays a Troll Skald. I do the pulling and in my mind know that he will taunt them off me 90% of the time before they reach me. With this trust and the knowledge of how each of us play the character we have managed to take down reds with just the two of us.

And then there was the time he could not pull the agro from a angry Moss maiden off me . It was red to us both and I managed to solo it down to 5% of its health. Resisted the last root and I died. Oh well such is life.

 

[SFXman]

Originally posted by Olgark
I have asked a few groups to join and gotten the guild only message back. This does not bother me as I know that guilds do have raids and events.

They need to have these events in my opinion to be able to work as a team and to get to know each other.

Ah, finally a person who got this message agrees with the fact that it is in fact acceptable and understandable. I really do think that guild have the right to choose if they keep a group private or not.... if they want a nice circle of friends than sure, keep it guild only. Simple in my opinion.
They do need these events yes, since later on they might do raids as a guild and such. Teamwork is the key... if a group works, you can do wonders. I have been in a few groups where the people really clicked and damn we got experience pretty damn fast.

 

[old.sauna]

Since a while back Bulle has been setting times and places for the exp-parties each day, they almost every time get full. I hate to turn people from my own realm down on a spot but we want to be able to go on guildtrips to get items or perhaps go RvR in the near future and to do that most efficiently (fastest way) is by playing only with the guild. We in Bulle are allways saying that guild must come first, and almost everytime we go out we get inquiries on spot in group.
We've grouped alot with people from other guilds as well, the pro's about going only guild is that there is never any squabble about items or exp, we just kill stuff until people are too tired .
The con's is perhaps someone see's us as uncooperative, which I really do not, you'll prolly won't find a more helpful guild/people than most of us. I often hear that we have a nice guildspirit and we only have that because we try hard, when we first started out, not many guilds said "yes come along" when you asked for a spot.
I myself don't want to spend another hour on exp, but I do it to help my guildmates level so we can go do more fun things together and finally (some daaaay) never kill another mob.
We will always tell people they can come if there is a need or not hurting them nor their exp by joining. We're quite often 3 groups, 1 45-50, 1 38-44 and a very low group...the 2 first always get's full and by telling someone "sure you can come" and let them play with people 10-15 levels lower than you isn't fair.

So I hope noone is cross with us, we will always do what we can to help others out .

Cheers!

 

[Heish]

Originally posted by Kelmon
Somewhere along the line these people forgot what the game is about. It's not about their guild. It's about Midgard as a whole..

The thing is, it's the strong guilds that make up a strong realm so when you say it's about Midgard as a whole you're contradicting yourself since a single player doesn't get much done for their realm. A guild that has high leveled players and know each other and know their tactics on the other hand can make a huge difference. So if you want to help your realm you should join a guild and team up with them.

 

[SFXman]

Hmm, yes.... guild will have no arguments over items at all but usually in Keltoi for example no one argues about them in group. It is quite rare tbh, and the only thing that happens is that people hesitate to tell the stats of it or then don't mention that they got the item at all. Truth is that most people are sensible enough to give the for free to the person who needs it and in guilds this is always the case.
Also like sauna said already, in guilds exping can be quite fast, but then again some groups in dungeons just happen to work really well... in guilds this is more common of course.
Ahmond, true. Guilds make the difference in RvR for example. Organised guilds organised into an alliance is what makes a raid succesful. Sometimes a guild might do its own keep raid, I've watched at least one of these (from behind the back of the player irl) and they worked out very well.

 

[old.Nacholay]

Well how about a different perspective...

Guilds or not it seems we have a hard time saying NO to people we rather would not play with. I heard from many people that AFTER they agreed to invite somebody into the party that they actually did not like his company. Such things obviously should not happen within a guild but we dont have to like all players in our realm, do we ?. I actually found myself more than once not objecting to a new invite to a group and shortly thereafter leaving myself because the person who joined ruined my fun of the game. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying soem people are worse than others (maybe some are ), but we cant get along with everybody.
Apart from that Hibernia / Prydwen hardly ever has enough 40+ people to group with anyways, so that may be another reason for people willing to settle for 2nd best company.

 

[old.Elrond]

Ahem what about me Kel?

He's right you know, why exclude friends from groups just because they aren't in the same guild? bit petty really imo, especially when you know them. Nemesis groups will always take nemesis people first it has to be stressed, as there has to be some point to being in a guild but if there are spaces and we need more people they are always welcome, and I think groups who say no just because they aren't in the same guild are putting themselves at a disadvantage

 

[c0ngo]

There used to be a lot of Guild only XP groups in Albion but that stopped a while ago and most of the higher lvl XP ones now are just good working groups with people from a number of Guilds.

Could explain why so many people in Albion are hitting 50 atm

If the other Realms stick to Guild only groups, good luck to them

 

[old.Grizlas]

I must say that i'm surprised by the oppinions expressed here. A similar thread ran on the old forums and there many were dissatisfied with guild only groups. Perhaps the more sensible people have made the journey to these new "green pastures", in any case i'm pleased to see more thoughful views from people who see the bigger picture.

Big guilds are alot more affective than smaller guilds that is a fact. The reason for guild only groups is to boost morale and to strengthen cooperation and discipline. These "runs" as I like to call them are absolutely essential for Midgard.

On the flipside, big guilds are always disliked by the more selfish people that only think of their own advancement and not of the big picture. It is very easy to assume that a guilds thinks its superior if its big, but if you think about it before you judge, you will come to the conclusion that what you percieve reflects the size of the guild and not the vanity of its members. We in Eye of Óðin have experienced groups refusing to group with our members simply because they belong to the guild. Members get the response "no EoO" when asking for group.

Despite this adversity Eye of Óðin will continue with regular guild runs, and while we continue to grow bigger and more disliked by some, we refuse to be dragged into seclusion and we will keep trying to participate in everything that's going on in our realm wether you like it or not.

And to all the players who are blaming Eye of Óðin for the breakup of their guild I say this. If a player leaves a guild its his own choice. We do not aggressively recruit new members and we very much would like to see more of the smaller guilds surviving. The individual member of a smaller guild will have problems after reaching 40+ since the best xp places require large groups and those groups are usually guild only. Now is the time you ask yourself to either stick with your old guild and help them level so they can xp with you later, or ally with a guild of similar size so that you will have enough 40+ to do a run, or quit your guild and join one of the bigger guilds. I would prefer the two first options any day, but it requires sacrifice on behalf of the aspiring high level member and more often than not these are unwilling to put in the effort it takes to run a guild, great or small. So they take the easy way out and join a big guild and the old guild eventually dies.

Small guilds need to ally with other guilds of the same size, this will benefit all.

 

[old.Elrond]

Why not just think of Midgard as one big guild and build up teamwork and comradeship with lots of people?, as well as the ones in the same guild, at least then you have a pool of other people that when you need them, won't turn around to you and say "Your from X guild who didnt let me group, so bugger of if u think your getting my help"

There are many skilled players that would contribute well to other peoples guild groups and speed up the whole process of xp/drops, but aren't allowed. I know for a fact that I have been refused entry to certain guild groups even when I offered to turn off loot sharing and be a good boy, and that to me seems stupid.

I'm not having a go at any guild inparticular, just the whole principle of the thing. If someone can tell me why, for example, a nemesis group shouldn't let someone like kelmon join when he's one of our friends and we have need of his services, then I may better understand the other side of the arguement.

Oh grizlas, I personally have never said no to an EoO member if we needed one, I have friends in your guild, especially that twat snozrick But maybe people who say "No EoO" to your members are the ones who you've said "EoO Only" to....just a thought

 

[old.Grizlas]

There wont be any 1 big guild in midgard because there is always some who wont listen to reason and want to do their own thing. In some ways I'd like 1 big realm wide guild but then we'd loose the charm with many of the smaller guilds, different emblems, goals etc, makes the game more flavoured and enjoyable.

Elrond if you think it's stupid that you are denied access to guild only runs please state why, since I dont see anything stupid about it.

Every guild run I get about 4-5 requests for others to join in and I almost always say no and on the occasion that I have said yes, I have been punished for it later by others going "why you let him join then?!?!?!" and so on. So it has to be guild only or not be at all. Xp is always bad on our runs because we are 3 groups doing a 1½ group spot, that means that if you're a high level you come to help the lower people level. In other words, it's not a good gig for people that dont care about the xp gain of the other people in the groups. We have already had two high level members leaving because they didnt get enough xp on our guild runs.

As for it being the same people that arent accepted into our guild runs that refuse to group with us in normal groups, you're probably right. But tell me how that helps the realm?. Seems to me that people are only jealous for not being able to join our guild runs even though it benefits the realm. If you only care about your own advancement I can see why it would be annoying to be excluded, but if you want Midgard to grow stronger dont try to sabotage other peoples leveling. If you are having problems advancing then maybe it's time to stop getting cap xp and help your guildmates reach your heights so you can organize something together. Heck, you could even surprise everyone and start up some daily xp runs together with some of the other guilds. Now THAT would benefit the realm.

 

[old.Elrond]

I didn't say make midgard 1 big guild, but just treat it more like one, and anyway, why start this whole guild only thing in the first place if u want the realm to advance? surely it would be in everyones best interest if EoO had 3 groups on a 1.5 group spawn to take on more ppl and split in to 2 groups of 2 and do a different spot each, more xp for all.

"As for it being the same people that arent accepted into our guild runs that refuse to group with us in normal groups, you're probably right. But tell me how that helps the realm?."

Maybe it doesn't, but what goes around comes around as they say, besides the same situation can be applied in reverse to odin guild runs

I don't think anyone is jealous Griz that odin does daily guild runs and their guild doesn't, i think they just want some xp at the end of the day and feel offended when they are told they can't get any just cos they don't wear the right tag.

"Heck, you could even surprise everyone and start up some daily xp runs together with some of the other guilds. Now THAT would benefit the realm."

There is absolutely no difference between that situation and odin taking on say a few more non guild ppl and doing 2 spawn spots is there, if you say u get 5-6 requests a night I can't see this being a problem. You say odin xp is bad well I say let some other people help you and spread it out over malmo a little instead of cramming your whole guild into 1 spot and fighting the same mobs, depriving them the xp that could be gained if you split up a little and let other players in. If odin can get 4 groups together and do two spots then its understandable if ppl can't join cos the groups are full, but I don't think that people understand the current strategy you use, thats all.

 

[old.Zhildrua]

Grizlas,

I enjoyed your post very much. Long time since I last saw self-justification presented in such a patronising manner.

Originally posted by Grizlas
I must say that i'm surprised by the oppinions expressed here. A similar thread ran on the old forums and there many were dissatisfied with guild only groups. Perhaps the more sensible people have made the journey to these new "green pastures", in any case i'm pleased to see more thoughful views from people who see the bigger picture.

With this you not only insulted Kelmon, the threadopener, but also everyone who chose to disagree with your opinion on the GOA forum.

On the flipside, big guilds are always disliked by the more selfish people that only think of their own advancement and not of the big picture.

Another nice insult to anyone who dares to disagree with your stance on things. So far those people are immature and selfish. Let's see if there's more. But the funny thing is, you contradict yourself just a few sentences later:

The individual member of a smaller guild will have problems after reaching 40+ since the best xp places require large groups and those groups are usually guild only. Now is the time you ask yourself to either stick with your old guild and help them level so they can xp with you later, or ally with a guild of similar size so that you will have enough 40+ to do a run, or quit your guild and join one of the bigger guilds. I would prefer the two first options any day, but it requires sacrifice on behalf of the aspiring high level member and more often than not these are unwilling to put in the effort it takes to run a guild, great or small. So they take the easy way out and join a big guild and the old guild eventually dies.

Glad we got that out of the way. So, by your own words, big guilds are joined by selfish players, not disliked. Unselfish people stay with their guild, help guildmates, etc.

And to all the players who are blaming Eye of Óðin for the breakup of their guild I say this. If a player leaves a guild its his own choice. We do not aggressively recruit new members and we very much would like to see more of the smaller guilds surviving.

Either that's a blatant lie or you don't know what some of your members are doing. A guildmate was offered a place in a EoO 40+ group ONLY under the condition he joins EoO either now or right after hunt. If that's no agressive recruiting, I don't know what is. And you do know of the nickname EoO has? You're not called the Borg without a reason. "All your Highlevels are belong to us" could be your guild motto.

We in Eye of Óðin have experienced groups refusing to group with our members simply because they belong to the guild. Members get the response "no EoO" when asking for group.

You're not really surprised about that, are you?
Seems a reaction to the dubious methods of EoO.

Small guilds need to ally with other guilds of the same size, this will benefit all.

And who are you to tell what smaller guilds should or should not do?
They may have other goals in the game than you. And this patronising crap works the other way to: Large guilds should stop Highlevel-leeching from smaller guilds, so there are many strong guilds, this will benefit all.

Doesn't that sound wise too?

 

[old.dc.snoz]

elrond ur a noob tbh u have no right to say anything .. reason we wont have u in our groups has nothing to do with guild only its the fact u suck get people killed and are totally greedy.. guild only is a nice way of us saying u suck go away please

 

[Aeiedil]

watch it flame

in favour of the guild-only groups\events it doesent half look nice i remember the last CF guild event, about 30ish of us all in our emblems, certainly was more of us all together than id seen in a while, and such things do help boost morale, at least it did mine

just my 2cp

*passes on the *

 

[old.Elrond]

/me cries

 

[old.dc.snoz]

o and our runs to malm are guild only BEACAUSE its a guild EVENT, somthing that the guild does together. I'm sure some of the guilds dont do things like that .. but then only reason they are together is so they can whine about odin tbh. Lame

 

[Aeiedil]

awww look at the poor face

 

[old.Elrond]

hehe don't flatter yourself snoz

 

[old.dc.snoz]

Well Only time Odins groups are guild only is when we go to malm once night ... any other groups are open to anyone.

I get tired of other guilds whining about us ... nearly 100% of our members are totally polite and helpful to other guilds and we do not deserve the flaming that we seem to receive.

Its got to the point for me where i have said to grizlas that we should break all aliances and go totally alone. But then grizlas is alot more tolarating then i am.

Some people need to grow up and drop the jealousy tbh.

 

[old.Elrond]

It's not jealousy its just common sense. Besides, odin dont do any other high level groups except their malmo trips so....

 

[old.dc.snoz]

Well thats because tom theres not alot else to do is there ?

If you would like to know, the reason we began these events ... it was because we found other guilds doing the same thing.

Warders for one did alot of guild only exping, and Nemesis members would join a group with us then 5 minutes later

say " o soz i have to go my guild group needs me"

So I would say "can i join also ? "


.. and id be told no guild only.

So tbh most people have nothing to moan about.

 

[old.Thorgrimm]

Looks like this is going to be EoO against the rest of the world (aka Midgard) and some EoO like that.

I don´t think all EoO members like the "guild only" thing though. Here is my story:
I am in emaine, just looking around as I get a tell from someone to join in Malmo. I say sure, nothing else to do, i come. So I make my way to the meeting point in Gna Faste. Turns out it is a EoO group lacking a healer. I join a group with 7 EoO and we make our way to malmo to meet other EoO groups. As we arrive the EoO group organiser tells me that I can´t join since it is a guild only thing. Pointing out that I just got dragged from emaine doesn´t help, so I leave malmo again, angry. I get tells from my group members, asking what happened and as I told them they said <raidleader> is an idiot...

EoO is a self sufficient guild and will single out themselves from the community over time. It´s their decision. I just don´t think most members are happy with that, they just stay in EoO to be levelled to 50 and then will find their own way, just IMHO.

Peace out,

-Thor

 

[old.dc.snoz]

u clearly have no clue though ?

 

[old.dc.snoz]

and to add to that .................................. these said members should not have invited you in the first place ... its a guild execise so it should be guild only. We are not trying to separate ourselves from the "community", we are just laying the foundations for a damn fine guild, that can offer much to our members ?

what do u suggest guilds are for if not for helping members to gain levels and teach people to work as a team which will then come more into practice in rvr ? I think all this eoO is stuff is bullshit tbh .. and its just sour grapes ..

TBH if it was totally down to me every one person that talked bullshit about odin would go on a blacklist .. cause its not needed and we totally dont deserve it

oh and the bit about people leaving once at 50 ? why would that be ? cause ur guild or any other could offer them a better rvr experience ? i very much doubt that ..