a genuine question to raid leaders

[old.Krogar_Thane]

this is to the albion and hib players who have led succesful raids on the thidranki keep.

ive led 2 succesful keep raids and 1 failed raid, i would like to ask my counterparts a genuine question, concerning organisation and CG.

lately, to my annoyance there seem to be a larger proportion of immature mids, who will
a) not listen to 1 blind thing on the CG,
b)spam it with rezz calls in unreachable places (repeated deaths im talking about)
c) possibly most annoying, personal flames and insults of the raid leaders competence as soon as they die, or there is a setback

my last raid had a certain healer screaming "WTF are you assholes doing?" after we had been struck from behind by a hib ambush while trying to put rams up (please dont ask me where our scouts were, because i was asking for scout reports on hib tk for the previous 10 minutes).

usually, i like to invite every1 in thid, into the cg, merely so that every1 can feel part of things, and i(or whoever else is raid leading) does not have to /yell constantly (you end up /yelling anyway so what the hey!)

my new idea is to make a focussed cg, with leader, ram group, healers and scouts only, in there, perhaps say 12 people in the cg max. the rabble and massed army would be controlled through /yells (with a pinch of luck).

anyway, i wanted to ask the alb and hib raid leaders how they dealt with the prickly subject of rude, ignorant, and idiotic spammers and dissenters who often disrupt the flow of a raid (and more often /pm you with insults of your incompetence even though you are trying your best).

I have had a 75% success rate in keep takes now (also took benowyc once with my main) so i think im doing something right, and i do kinda like the raid leader position, but sometimes, and more often of late, it almost wants to make you pull your hair out at the comments of the dumbasses.

step up to the soap box my enemy generals, how do you deal with raids? lets have an insight into your organisation.

/bow
/bow
/salute

legendary flames i have had so far

"stealthers cant lead raids, its impossible"
"maybe we like camping the tk" XXXXXXX was killed by a bowman

 

[hibtankman]

I lead a cg once, I dont think I'll be doing it again for a while.

Dont want any flames, and I certainly won't try to flame anyone here but...

It seems to me that people are just a little too eager to get in there and get on with the action. I'm not a chap that has 200RP, I think I've only got 80 or so, but I do try to stand back and take a look at the scene before I jump in. If there is a well organised cg, the action is so much better by virtue of the fact that it is organised. Isn't it here that we practice for keep raids a la big boys RvR?

These take immense planning by the looks of things, and I thought that the best way that it could function would be to only include group leaders and key personnel in the cg. The group leaders would then relay their part of the plan to their group. This is the way real armies work, the officers know the plan and the NCOs and soldiers know their part in the plan. Its all they need to know.

We should be organised for maximum fun. The reason I probably won't lead a group again is because there are too many people that want to jump in straight away, and then blame you for it. A well run army relies on discipline, there should be no reason why this is not the case here. The gung-ho members of an army will get their fight, put them in one group and get them to draw an enemy out. Maybe thats the way we should do it. Organise the grouping a bit better before embarking to the bridges or the keeps.

Anyway, I've said enough. Thanks for listening.

Ive not sorted my sig out yet but I am Hawthorne lvl22 BM. When I get it done it'll be there.

 

[Gabrial]

I've had same problems in there. Organised a raid, got around 20 people organised but people would routinely wander off and get killed then start asking for rezzes. Its chaos out there because although everyone wants to raid, noone wants to wait.

Let me know if anyone finds a solution! I guess the best ones would be guild-organised or maybe a group of RL friends.

 

[BlitheringIdiot]

How do you get all the people who refuse to sort out groups into one group?!
And you cant just leave them to their own devices or not long after you will hear "Who the f*ck just pulled the guards?!".

Ive never lead a keep raid but ive been on many succesful ones and the actions envolved are not hard at all, in fact its very simple, its just the good old sheep mentality that screws it all up and then you get casters meleeing the doors etc...

Anyway in hibbieland all are in the cg, the arses who think they are god tend to leave anyway after insulting everybody, just get them pissed off before you start and with a bit of luck they all log.

To be honest I think its more the luck of the draw, some days it works, some it doesnt.

 

[BlitheringIdiot]

Let me know if anyone finds a solution! I guess the best ones would be guild-organised or maybe a group of RL friends.

And yes the best raid Ive ever been on was when it was a guild only raid and 90% of the other members where all sitting together in a cyber cafe.

 

[old.Krogar_Thane]

you have hit the nail on the head

its true Xoz

some days you get a few really helpful souls, who take on loads of the burden.

some days you get little sods who remind you that they have RR5 alts on prydwen and proceed to

a) die by the tk guards repeatedly
b) flame you till your ears bleed because you pulled the army back to rest and didnt rezz them

how hum!
looking forward to this weekend, gonna be some blood spilt.

 

[old.Charonel]

ok, none of the thid raids i've been on have been perfect because nobody's there to just get the job done, everyone just wants to have a laugh doing it, which is great

the best one's i've been on were in midgard one time when we were getting DF back, everyone and i mean EVERYONE knew exactly what to do (let's face it, who doesnt? it's pretty straight forward once you've been on a few), there was no need to yell orders, nobody bitched, whined, complained etc... when the archers spawned they were slaughtered instantly, everything, no need to even yell about resting before hitting the lord, perfectly smooth. but even when they go wrong it's not like it's a big deal

basically i dont think it's the leaders who mess up thid raids, or the people there, it's thid itself, people dont go there to enroll in the hibby army they go there for a good laugh well done raids are like that too but if your only going there for ten mins of laughs, your not gonna bother about a keep raid so not everyone will be interested.

i wouldnt worry about it, but i'd just tell whiners, flamers etc.. to sod off, all thid raids i've been on there havent beeen ANY complaints, simply because even if we were wiped by accidents which could have easily been avoided, we all just had a laugh about it the chat group doesnt fill with flames, because everyone had a good chuckle over it all you must be getting some real gits in your playerbase over there that's all. doesnt seem to have gimped your realm none though

 

[darbey]

No magic solution for this im afraid and its the same on all realms. The smoothest keep raid i have done was with 12 people when it went like clockwork. The repsponsive helpful people are either more mature or they have mains that have been involved in mainline rvr. Other than that cant be giving you all our secrets away, dont want you having organised keep raids now do we.

 

[Slipurson]

Don't know if this been said... tired today.. can't read good

But the thing is that all the "highlvl" peeps (or most of them have had their fun in the BG's and now the "new" people are commin up that has no background of maybe even seen or heard about a keep raid and i find it that it is usualy those that are most eager to get in and kill that lord, not knowing/understanding.. that he is purp like hell to them...

This is not a flame to those newcomers in any way, hey we are in the BG's to learn but all u new ones have to do is to: learn to listen and w8 for orders....

I have lead one succesfull raid on the keep (ok it was pretty late at night, but still where some defenders ) and we also had constant rudeness, rezzyells, getting-to-close-to-TK'ers, those who just yell orders to the others without even knowing what is going on and the ones that as u also say just tell u that u suck cuz the keep was not taken in 5 minuters or so....

And after most raids there are only like 5% of the peeps that stay behind and upgrade/repair the doors, most just say: "ooh that was fun, good job... well i have to log now! cya"

Solution: I dont think we ever will get a solution to this as long as there are people comeing who are less experienced, and again NO dissrespect to them, they don't know the "routines".
And also in most "real" keepraids there are some leader that people know and have respect for, in the BG's people come and go alot, noone has the time to be able to get a respected name since everyone has so short time to be in the BG's (i mean 350 Rps can be donr pretty quick if u just stick to the battles for a few days).

As i said most of this is maybe posted here but i am to tired to read lost of words(hey haven't even read through this post )

Well thats my point of view.... back to sleeping at work again...will be back later and edit this for spelling and stuff

GOD i hate to work 6AM on a saturday, and the same thing on sunday .. plz cry some for me

 

[xyza]

I agree with most things being said here, there will always be inexperienced people. I know they want to go out there and kill everything and get that keep, too bad it aint just that, it requires some more planning and tactics. I've been a little inexperienced character myself during a Relic keep raid, we were more then 200 peeps, and guess if I was bored, I didn't want to listen to the 2 guys commanding the rest of 200 people... But after I've been helping and been organizing raids myself, it has hit me that those 2 leaders were damn good at it, i might be able to organize a 30-player raid, but 200 i don't know.

One of those leaders I talk about is Shade, big credits to you! (and to some other lvl 50 dude who I can't remember the name of, sorry)