50%+50% is not 100%!

Sorin

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Just had a chat with Xalin. Very nice guy indeed, he gave me some info others might find usefull. Read and learn:




You send, " Hey Xalin, Can i ask you a question?" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "You just did! But you may of course ask me as much as you like!"

You send, "hehe okay... Is there a CAP to how much magic damage you can resist?" to Xalin

Xalin sends, " That Depends. There is a softcap on how much magic resists you can have obviously. But if you're asking if there is a cap on how much damage you can resist no there isn't."

You send, "okay? when i use my fury "50%to all magic resist" I have more than 100% magic resist, but i can still take more than 100 damage in some cases" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "Well the question if there is a cap doesn't quite explain that. The question that is more relevant there is if the different bonuses stack and if they do in what way."
You send, "umm.. keep talking please" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "if you have max resists from armor and resist buffs you have 50% resist. The ability grants 50% magic resist but that doesn't mean you have 50% +50% now"

You send, "oh, okay. lets say i'm fully buffed with those resists and have AoM5 and my 15% class resist, thats 40% and that doesn't stack either?" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "I'm not entirely sure what stacks with what and in what order but having 100% resists to damage other than phaseshift is impossible. You will always take some damage."

You send, "so there is a hard cap on how much damage you can take?" to Xalin

You send, "like atleast 20% or something" to Xalin

Xalin sends, " Eh I do not understand how that is the conclusion of what i said hehe."

You send, "nahh, thats okay.. i don't think i understand you either..." to Xalin

You send ," but i will always take some damage no matter how high my resists is" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "Most important is that 50%+50% from another ability does NOT equal 100% resists. in the best case scenario resist 50% of the 50% that was left taking 25% damage although that isn't quite mathematically correct either."

Xalin sends, "Well if your base resists would be 100% you would not take damage but this is obviously impossible."

You send, "think i get it now. those two kinds of resist co-exist but don't stack.. now what is the point with it then?" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "Well they still work together to redice damage. Not stacking does not mean that they do not work together."

You send, "umm, okay" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "You take 100 damage. 50% resists so there is 50 left. Now you used that ability that does 50% extra resists so only 25 damage of that 50 actually hurts you."

You send, "thats more like it yes" to Xalin

Xalin sends, "I am not saying that is exactly how it works. The calculations are way to complicated for my little brain... but that is an example that points out how they can work together without stacking."


Its actually quite simple now that i read it. The magic damage is splitted into 2 parts. your base resist will take care of 1 part, and your bonus resist will take care of the leftovers.
 

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Davejohnson

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Jan 15, 2007
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fury adds to the secondary resists, which are checked after the initial damage is modified by your primary resists.

enemy A would nuke a lvl50 character without resists for 800 damage.
you have 50% resists.
enemy A nukes you for 400 damage.
you use fury (+50% secondary resists)
enemy A nukes you for 200 damage.

extra modified by heavytankresists, vamp resists, aom...

the only time you would take 0 damage is when your primary OR secondary resisttable is at 100%. it is possible to achieve only if baod stacks with fury or vampiirresists (which i dont know if they do).

also bear in mind that secondary resists cannot get debuffed by spells or procs.
 

Sorin

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May 23, 2005
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fury adds to the secondary resists, which are checked after the initial damage is modified by your primary resists.

enemy A would nuke a lvl50 character without resists for 800 damage.
you have 50% resists.
enemy A nukes you for 400 damage.
you use fury (+50% secondary resists)
enemy A nukes you for 200 damage.

extra modified by heavytankresists, vamp resists, aom...

the only time you would take 0 damage is when your primary OR secondary resisttable is at 100%. it is possible to achieve only if baod stacks with fury or vampiirresists (which i dont know).

also bear in mind that secondary resists cannot get debuffed by spells or procs.


Um. You repeated what i just wrote :p
 

Davejohnson

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äh. so you just wanted to enlighten the rest of us that resists are actually split into primary and secondary since a few years then?

... thanks i guess..
 

Flimgoblin

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Dec 24, 2003
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50%+50% = 75%!

or rather 0.5*0.5=0.25 which gives you a 75% reduction in damage ;)


Primary and secondary resists are combined multiplicatively, however all the resist bonuses in each category are combined additively...

so 26% from armour, 20% from avoidance of magic 5 + 50% from fury gives you 70% secondary resists and 26% primary resists combining to give a total of 78% resist.



(rather than 0.74*.5*0.8 = 0.30 = 70% resists if all of it was multiplicative ).


Edit: ninjar edit since resist buffs are primary not secondary :p so I changed it for AoM
 

Xalin

[GOA] English Servers GM
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So many typo's. :(

Next time you quote me run it through a spell checker please. ;)
 

Andrilyn

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so 26% from armour, 20% from avoidance of magic 5 + 50% from fury gives you 70% secondary resists and 26% primary resists combining to give a total of 78% resist.

You forgot to add EM3 and/or BAoD which could (on paper) give you 100% magic resists, don't know if it's actually possible but that should give 0 (-xxx) when nuked but it probably won't all stack or something :p
 

Flimgoblin

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You forgot to add EM3 and/or BAoD which could (on paper) give you 100% magic resists, don't know if it's actually possible but that should give 0 (-xxx) when nuked but it probably won't all stack or something :p

in theory bedazzling aura 3 + Aom5 gets you 60%

if empty mind stacks with bedazzling aura you get 90%

Fury would make it 140% (if it stacked on top)

Though I have a sneaky suspicion BAoD, Empty Mind and Fury won't stack with each other... worth a test or two though :)
 

Bahumat

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Multipliactive is the term they use i think?

Just incase some people did not know, classes like Cabalists with their 50% body reduction dont put you on -20% for example.

If your resists where like this
Tier 1 - Tier 2
30% --- 0%

The cabalist (think chanter and a few other classes too) debuff will be used on both Tier1 and Tier2, for example

Tier 1 - Tier 2
25% - 25%

Lets say the cabalist has a 25% body debuff, he would have this split equally (to the best of my knowledge) against both. So 25%/2 = 12.5% - Resists would be listed as the following after debuff

12.5% - 12.5%
 

Tesla Monkor

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so basically there are 2 types of resists, primary and secondary :)

For Slash, Crush, Thrust, Cold, Heat, Body, Spirit, Energy and Matter.

The big unknown here is Essence damage, which many of the ML abilities do, and which I theorize any weapon would do if they didn't have a damage type set.

Since it isn't shown in the resist window, it might have only one tier (primary) of resists available. You can get resists from Sojourner line and from one of the Mythirians. Buffs and Items generally only add to the Primary Tier of resistance. :)
 

Darzil

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Lets say the cabalist has a 25% body debuff, he would have this split equally (to the best of my knowledge) against both.

I think the debuffs are against items and buffs, rather than primary and secondary. I also think it now says how much in the delve of the spell.

Darzil
 

Bahumat

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I think the debuffs are against items and buffs, rather than primary and secondary. I also think it now says how much in the delve of the spell.

Darzil

Ahh I see. Been a long time since i last played so im all rusty haha
 

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