1.59/1.60 for Sorcs. How will you spec?

[Adri]

After Apathy mentioning in another thread how he was gonna spec come 1.59/1.60, was wondering how the other excal sorcs will go?

Im currently 41body 34mind

Apathy mentioned 28matter 46mind, which to me seems the best spec giving you the best power regen, best self mezz resist buff, 2nd best grp mezz resist buff and best aoe mezz. best charm. aoe str/com debuff

With matter you'll get base dot, spec dot (weak), dd snare (weak). aoe dex/quick debuff, single dex/quick debuff

Alternative would be to 20matter 50mind or even stick with your existing spec.

Atm it seems sorcs wont get a respec for the changes.

Thankfully ive still got mine but i'll probably have to respec my RAs too to get rid of MoM and WP :/

How will everyone else go?

 

[Apathy]

I think going above 46 mind is not worth it. The 15% group chant is simply not worth those extra points that you can use to boost your already weakened secondary line.

46mind will be the best group sorc spec, I feel. Best mezz in the entire GAME after 1.60, constant PoT5 for everyone, very mezz resistant sorc (I've already ditched Purge. Mwahaha.), top AoE str/con debuff and so on.

Once you decide to go 46+ mind all you have to do is choose if you want body or matter. I chose matter because it adds an extra form of quasi-CC to my range of spells with the DD/snare. Matter resists are generally low too so compared to the 28 body nuke, it's not going to be much difference.

(L24) Constricting Jolt 3.0s/30s/0s Rng: 1500 -35%/88 d (Mttr) 15 power - a rather slow 35% snare with 88DD.

(L28) Lesser Mind Shriek 2.8s/0s/0s Rng: 1500 133 dmg (Body) 17 power - Slightly faster basic 133DD nuke on the Body damage table...you'll be lucky to get 133 after resists!

Pros - snare, less variance on DoT, extra DoT, even more DEX debuffs (Yeeehaw!)

Cons - greater variance on lifetaps, no 15% resist debuffs, no AoE root if the spec 20 root ever gets changed

A lot of people who are currently 34m/41b would do well to respec to 36m/40b so they can get the second best PoT and self-resist buff and not lose anything else at all. Assuming they don't want a drastic change to their char and therefore a new way of playing.

I'll be going on as many dragon raids as I can until I get three stones. Then I'll try full mind, then full body and then decide which I liked best. And if I don't like either, it's back to my old spec but with 36m/40b.

Ooooh...I love talking about sorcerers.

a.
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[Adri]

Agreed, above 46 mind is not worth it.

Id like to go matter just for the 2 dots to annoy casters.

Also i rarely use my aoe root so i wont miss it by speccing matter.

But these new changes will definately change how one currently plays their sorc.

With 41body 34mind youll be an average nuker.
Changing to 28matter 46mind will force me to rely on CC more, mezzing, demezzing, rooting where needed with the odd dot in group play rather than assisting in combat with nukes.

Hopefully these changes (new skills and playstyle) should help alb in rvr a bit.

From what ive read on the Sorc forum having aoe mezz at bolt range has totally levelled the rvr playing field.

Should be interesting!

 

[chuckas]

I agree that on a spell progression table 46 mind is the way to go. However as a 35 Sorc whose experience is in BG3 so far (and that has been fun and busy!) it seems to me that you should either go hard for the nuke spec or the cc spec. Personally i will go cc with high mind. However i also read on US forums that taking mind to 49 can help a lot in landing the mezz succcessfully without resists. Can anyone else comment ? I suspect it may help due to the ridiculous SC items maxing body on everyone out there. I do have a 47 Inf too, but don't get to see the resist effects so much with that except on poison, which btw seems to land OK most of the time although damage is more annoying than critically effective.

BTW I am lucky that I group with the same 8 guys twice a week and we keep our chars at the same level. So I know exactly how our group is balanced and plays. We have 1 pally, 1 minstrel, 1 earth wiz, 1 Fire wiz, 2 friars, 1 Theurg and me. So while we are not short of cc we have plenty of damage dealing too. I expect that in full on RvR this group will not change much if at all.

Rabid - 35 Sorc - mezzin their butts in BG3
Gillian - 47 inf

 

[Adri]

mezz resists i think is still a bit of a myth.

correct me anyone if im wrong but mezz resists are based on the level of the spell being cast and the level of the recipient.

therefore lvl44 aoe mezz would have less resists than the lvl34 one.

unsure if level of spec makes a difference.

however there is a bonus by having mind high - to get inherit bonus by having mind equal to your level

see i3ulleye's 2nd post

http://forums.crgaming.com/daocbb/viewtopic.php?t=3555&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

 

[Apathy]

I think the difference in resists between the 24 and 44 mez is something like 10%.

Higher mind spec and +mind doesn't help.

a.
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[Loth]

Currently at 48Body 24 Mind, will respec to 45 Body 29 Mind.

Best DD, crack 3, AoE root, nice debuffs,weaker AoE mez,green pets.

Sure the 44 mez is nice, but any spec mez can be purged and at that point I need that big root.

With the new 1875 range, I can chain cast the 24 aoe mez and catch any resists/misses/purges with the root .

Currently I see little difference resist-wise between the 34 mez (my old spec) and the 24 mez (current spec).

I live a *lot* longer than I used to and can actually help my team-mates by nuking instead of running off

It's a great spec and I'd recommend it. I know ppl will say 'You're a Sorc, you should mez' but IMO mez isn't as powerful as it used to be.

 

[Adri]

Loth do you use your aoe root much?

 

[Loth]

Yes, quite a lot - usually if I see Purge or GP.

Tanks I leave rooted for our tanks to fight.

If I catch a caster with it, I tend to single-target STR debuff them (to try and encumber) and then nuke the crap outta them

 

[old.Wildfire]

Well at the moment ptora is heading for a 34 mind / 41 matter spec, but looking at catacombs, a 44 mind / 31 matter spec looks quite attractive. I've always been an exponent of a class doing what it's "supposed" to do - ie. what other classes can't. So this will definitely be a step in the right direction for sorcs.

 

[Apathy]

I will REALLY miss AoE root...but when I think about it, I only ever seem to use it on one or two people at once. I could easily (Using my superleet skills and amazing reflexes.) single root them. It's one of those things I will need to wait and see, I guess.

Excited about 1.60. Woowoo.

a.
*

 

[Adri]

aye Apathy i rarely use aoe root and tbh im getting pretty bored of my sorc.
maybe the new spells in mind and change to matter might change the way the sorc needs to be played and make it a bit more fun.
seems alot of people in USA are enjoying matter.

wildfire - is the matter spec fun to play?

 

[hotrat]

Gonna go 44 mind 31 body myself, the 2nd best mezz reduction is still 40% and PoT 4 instead of 5 again will hardly be noticeable.
31 body gives the ae root and also the first debuffs which I think are far more useful than 15% shorter mezz reduction and very slightly faster power regen.
If they changed the lvl 20 root to ae then 49 mind 2x body would prolly be my spec.
Matter sounds interesting but lifetap is very useful sometimes, 31 spec 11 from items and around 5 from RR should reduce the variance a lot too.

 

[Glottis_Xanadu]

Will go 46 mind+11+rr
rest body I think, not yet decided. Sorcs nuke for crap anyway, so maybe snare would be nice. We will see.
I cannot wait to get some decent pets... that will make the game fun.
Regards, Glottis

 

[old.Zeikerd]

I think high body is a must, you still get a nice aoe root, and damage is king. Also teaming with a wizard and debuffing for them is very imporant. Even more so when hibs have that BAOD on in every encounter.

 

[Apathy]

I wouldn't call it a "must". It's just another viable spec.

~summons 1.60~

COME TO ME!

a.
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[old.CrazyMuppet]

Why do so many sorcs want to be heavy damage dealers instead of sacrificing their damage for utility?

Main problem of alb groups is that everyone wants to be the big damage dealer.

 

[Flimgoblin]

it's because as a robe caster you bite the dust very quickly...

they want to feel they've actually done something before they die

 

[Sol-]

if i still played it .... 24 mind 48 body

 

[Sol-]

Originally posted by old.CrazyMuppet
Why do so many sorcs want to be heavy damage dealers instead of sacrificing their damage for utility?

Main problem of alb groups is that everyone wants to be the big damage dealer.

fyi, body spec is not all about dmg..... EG meet a FG of hibs, insted of spamming mezz, AE root and wait for GP, if they GP you can still use primary CC to mezz. Debuffs in body spec, 50% debuff to cold heat matter... not just about dmg.



[edit: AE root is great for incoming through a MFG, spam AE root on gate until all nicely rooted inside the gate, then AE mezz]

 

[Loth]

Why do so many sorcs want to be heavy damage dealers instead of sacrificing their damage for utility?

I would say the utility of a Body Sorc is greater than that of a Mind Sorc .After the CCing is done, I can assist my team-mates with good fast damage,debuffs etc.

After the mez is broken, what does a Mind sorc have to offer?

Granted, 1.60 will change the role of a Mind sorc quite considerably but IMO Body has the greater utility.

 

[old.Wildfire]

"I think high body is a must, you still get a nice aoe root, and damage is king."

great quote

I'd rather have a snare on my nukes and a single-target root to get me out of trouble than the AE root and lifetaps ...to be honest, I never get a chance to look at my own health in fights, always far too busy concentrating on what I'm doing. Plus matter nukes DO out-damage body nukes, simply because of the resist line they're in. I also get stacking dots which are nice for levelling and milegate stand-offs.

 

[Wou]

At the moment I m 41 matter / 34 mind.

But will respec to 40 matter / 36 mind for the pot and mezz reduce.

After the mez is broken, what does a Mind sorc have to offer?

Not so much: pet, low damage, con/str debuff, supper AE mezz, self mezz resist.


What has Body sorc to offer a group?

Not so much: Damage( on body resist, and every one should have body capped), AE root, resist debuffs.


What has a 40 matter / 36 mind to offer a group

A bit of every thing: pet, med damage: dot & snare DD ( damage and CC in one spell, good to get tanks of running casters), good mezz, med con/str debuff, med self mezz resist.



But personaly I find 41 matter / 34 mind very hard to play becouse you have to make a lot choises: will I snare DD him or dot him( and CC imune), snare him or root him or mezz him,...
Also matter takes a ton power, so you will be oop very quick, and it sucks you can't use mcl in combad

 

[old.Wildfire]

erm wou just get a 50 matter/mind focus staff SC'd...

 

[Wou]

erm wou just get a 50 matter/mind focus staff SC'd...

Got one

But only use it in big battles, with the scepter of intelect I have 50 matter, with my staff only 49 ( made a mistake).
So will do less damage when I m holding my staff

Also a staff gives caster look.

 

[Apathy]

Wou, don't be silly. A body sorc has more to offer the group than a matter sorc. Yes, I know you think the matter sorc is better but...that's because it's your spec. Duh.

Matter gives a weakish spec DoT, the DD/snare, a dex/qui debuff.

Body gives the AoE root, the resist debuffs, the DD, better variance on lifetap, a dex/qui debuff.

Body gives more utility, point for point above 30, than matter. Less than 30 and it's a personal thing, though it's closer due to the resist debuffs being weaker and the nukes being poor.

Saying a body sorc has nothing to offer damage-wise because of capped resists is just trite; people will have cold, heat, spirit all above cap...should all theurgists cry and go full support with Earth? Should the wizards wail and go full matter-based Earth? No, of course not. Because a fire wizard still does some damage. And the body sorc will only serve to help such a wizard if they work together. It's not ideal, but simply going Matter instead because working with others is too much hard work is silly.

All specs are viable, but please don't trumpet your own spec over others when it really is not the case. Noone wants to feel like a gimp, but people need to get away from considering things gimped and things superior and realise the genuine merits of specific specs.

a.
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[Arnor]

Originally posted by old.CrazyMuppet
Why do so many sorcs want to be heavy damage dealers instead of sacrificing their damage for utility?

Main problem of alb groups is that everyone wants to be the big damage dealer.

Try a mid group

 

[Wou]

Wou, don't be silly. A body sorc has more to offer the group than a matter sorc. Yes, I know you think the matter sorc is better but...that's because it's your spec. Duh.

I don't say other spec's aren't good or not viable.
I said that with 2 spec lines you have a lot more utility but lower value, and with 1 spec you have high value in your spells but lower utility.

weakish spec DoT, the DD/snare

spec dot + base dot + con debuff = 100% dead caster, yep very weak. This is deadly in seiges.
Snare dot: you can save someone when at the same time you do damage. And damage is fine ( only a few people have high matter resists and is high in the buff lines to get matter resists).

AoE root, the resist debuffs, the DD, better variance on lifetap

AoE root, the resist debuffs are very nice.
Better variance on lifetap: with moc I killed a skalt while live tapping, is fine with 8 body.

damage-wise because of capped resists

Not every one can cap there resists, but if you don't have body caped you are a noob pure and simple. And here is a link with all resists, so you can figer out why you have to cap body first Apathy. Body is also assasin poisens. Every hib group with warden has +24 body risist, and it is low in healer buff line.

All specs are viable, but please don't trumpet your own spec over others when it really is not the case. Noone wants to feel like a gimp, but people need to get away from considering things gimped and things superior and realise the genuine merits of specific specs.

Lol where did I said my sec is best?
For me my spec is best becouse it fits my PLAYSTYLE, semi-suport and solo.

If you love to nuke everything you see, you sure have to take high body.
If you like to support your group all the time, high mezz is what you need.
If you like to do both, you have to spec 2 lines but less powerfull versions of spells.


I just wanted to point out that you could spec something else the high body or high mind ( where all posts where about in this topic), and still be very effective. But you didn't got that

 

[Apathy]

I don't say other spec's aren't good or not viable.
I said that with 2 spec lines you have a lot more utility but lower value, and with 1 spec you have high value in your spells but lower utility.

No, you said...

What has Body sorc to offer a group?

Not so much: Damage( on body resist, and every one should have body capped), AE root, resist debuffs.


What has a 40 matter / 36 mind to offer a group

A bit of every thing:

Tell me, how would someone reading that come to the conclusion that you feel matter is intrinsically better than body? Because...it's what you wrote.

spec dot + base dot + con debuff = 100% dead caster, yep very weak. This is deadly in seiges.
Snare dot: you can save someone when at the same time you do damage. And damage is fine ( only a few people have high matter resists and is high in the buff lines to get matter resists).

That would be a caster that has poor resists, that had poor items on and didn't get a single heal. I don't doubt that the DD/snare does reasonable damage and that the snare component is attractive, but if someone is speccing a sorc for nuking power, then the additional abilities given by a high body spec are too good to miss out on. Of course, making the most of those abilities would mean coordinating with someone or keeping an eye on as much of the battle of possible. Matter would be nice and simple, so I see why you would prefer that. Fire and forget.

AoE root, the resist debuffs are very nice.
Better variance on lifetap: with moc I killed a skalt while live tapping, is fine with 8 body.

Anyone can kill a badly played skald. Even me. Though I didn't use MoC...

Not every one can cap there resists, but if you don't have body caped you are a noob pure and simple. And here is a link with all resists, so you can figer out why you have to cap body first Apathy. Body is also assasin poisens. Every hib group with warden has +24 body risist, and it is low in healer buff line.

Most people know about Body. However, in my plain epic with some DF items, I have close to capped resists on almost every magic type. AoM pushes it up over 30 in some cases. It's easy. And as SC becomes more and more common, you'll see matter resists going up too.

Hibs have high resists in general. That's where a body sorc comes in very useful. But as I say so often, it takes coordination and teamplay.

If you love to nuke everything you see, you sure have to take high body.

Body spec isn't just about nuking. It's a perfectly viable support spec too.

I just wanted to point out that you could spec something else the high body or high mind ( where all posts where about in this topic), and still be very effective. But you didn't got that

Well, try not to slip snide comments about something offering "not so much" and something else offering "a bit of everything" when it is simply not true. See if that helps.

a.
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[- Fedaykin -]

If i get a respec stone im gonna go 46 mind rest i dont really care tbh

because : i like to mezz, i like usin heat debuffs (wizz0rs love me), i am going to love power regen and in a sticky situation life drain isn't to bad a DD, power costs are high but who cares i'm gonna have level 5 regen...