friar left bwhind again??

The patch note 1.69 gives more utility that dont need as much as a friar could use some real love in there rejuv line specially thinking on BDs cure mes to there pet (lthe could have fixed there insane lifetap first), higher dmg on NS magic (like a high rr ns aint good allready), better self buff to hunter that nobody will use anyway.

i think us friar could us some reall love else the class will be totally left behind (like thanes, but they atleast shield to make abit easier to solo), the staff dmg aint that good as it once was, our enha line only help our self exept the resist (alb allready got to many classes to have in a grp and therefor often skip the friar) and our rejuv sux big time (yea i know shamans do to but they atleast got disease, root and spec buff).
A thing i think there could help us if we got the shear buff spells, due to 2 reasons for he first we need some thing special to make us wanted, 2. it r on the main healing class (yes also main buffing class) and same count for hib with druid where they could have give it to warden, this will mean that the buff shearing spells r on the support heal class and not on the main healer class. Atm i c it as a huge advantage(sp?) for mid that they get buff shearing spell on there support class and not main healer class

Ya lets not forgot how insanely hard friars can hit on some classes, they just need det and thats it imo.

Mythic is looking at the role of all realms' secondary healer classes according to a poster on either drunken friar or VN. What will come out of that is far away in the future.

Lejemorder said:

The patch note 1.69 gives more utility that dont need as much as a friar could use some real love in there rejuv line specially thinking on BDs cure mes to there pet (lthe could have fixed there insane lifetap first), higher dmg on NS magic (like a high rr ns aint good allready), better self buff to hunter that nobody will use anyway.

i think us friar could us some reall love else the class will be totally left behind (like thanes, but they atleast shield to make abit easier to solo), the staff dmg aint that good as it once was, our enha line only help our self exept the resist (alb allready got to many classes to have in a grp and therefor often skip the friar) and our rejuv sux big time (yea i know shamans do to but they atleast got disease, root and spec buff).
A thing i think there could help us if we got the shear buff spells, due to 2 reasons for he first we need some thing special to make us wanted, 2. it r on the main healing class (yes also main buffing class) and same count for hib with druid where they could have give it to warden, this will mean that the buff shearing spells r on the support heal class and not on the main healer class. Atm i c it as a huge advantage(sp?) for mid that they get buff shearing spell on there support class and not main healer class

Click to expand...

your staff dont hit that hard? then raise it above 29!! jesus i can still solo reds without haste..what more do you want?

Elewyth(TLSOA) said:

your staff dont hit that hard? then raise it above 29!! jesus i can still solo reds without haste..what more do you want?

Click to expand...

be able to do some thing in RvR? and my staff spec is on 39 + 11 atm and yes friars dont hit that hard compared to other melee/hybrids

living said:

Ya lets not forgot how insanely hard friars can hit on some classes, they just need det and thats it imo.

Click to expand...

if u talk bout caster?? that count for all melee classes so i dont c u point maybe we can hit hard on ns's but how often does u face a ns solo?? (i hope not very often as friars not r meant to solo)

Elewyth(TLSOA) said:

your staff dont hit that hard? then raise it above 29!! jesus i can still solo reds without haste..what more do you want?

Click to expand...

ohh and btw u friar is lvl 44?? have u ever tried a friar in RvR in for the last month? or r u basing that u say on how friars was year ago?

^ this is what the edit button is for, boys and girls

can offer some swiss cheeeeeeese

Friars are 1 of the most solid alb class's there is. This was stated by mythic 2 and I have come to believe it, yes its weird there right.

A few things make friars Appear Below par really.

Buffbots is the first 1 I would imagine.

Before BB's Friars had the best Base buffs about < there + ench adds to the effectiveness of the buff afaik ?> but more importantly they were decked out in fully red spec buff's including base buff's, also having there own End regain so no need for a Paladin, while still having a huge Evade rate, thanks for there buffs and most Friars capping Qui and Then ofc The fact that they wear chain absorb armor when you add those buffs up, <minus a little Af thou >. Not forgeting parry btw.

Another Problem facing Friars, which is more of a common problem for all hybrids is Lack of Determination.

Before Determination Friars were 1 of the best tanks in alb, only 2nd to a merc when fully buffed. Due to Block penalty against guards thou and higher WS / Dmg etc. They used to hit for great damage and also hit really fast, capped qui is common, Not to mention ther 36% haste buff on a 3min recast. They were definalty the Zerkers of Albion for awhile, although for that time there were so few Friars so it never seemed like a big problem tbh. about 1.5/2 yrs ago my bro wanted to start daoc and on alb, I told him. Start a Friar, They seriously Kick arse and so few play them you cant be nerfed Directly. He did and for ages he did just that, but ofc the indirect nerfs came. Other class's getting love and The addition and normality of BB's etc. It's Just the way the cookie crumbles, with Frointers perhaps Friars and indeed Hybirds will be wanted / needed again.

I cant see Friars having a problem getting into any grp really, once froniters is here or Det is changed. Because They offer alot of utility to a grp.

magic Resist buffs, Most Friars have the all the 24% buffs.

Base buffs, With buff shearing this will be important.

Heals, yes agreed there shit but Never the less help.

Immune to Buff Shearing .

These are just a few reasons why to grp a Friar but thers many more i can think of, There damage is 1 that some laugh at but its no laughing matter. They swing at cap < or v v close> ever 3mins with a 2h and have access to a 8sec < 3rd chain > Stun. They also confuse Bad / Sleepy MA's.

So its not so bad mate, Try to look on the bright side ever once in a while. There's plently of other class's that need attention above Friars thats for sure.

well, mana mentalists have the best heals in game but nobody plays them either

sure friars have some nice abilities but they're not part of the "perfect" alb group

and sure they were nice before det and before buffbots became popular, but the game changes and a class has to change too or else it turns into unwanted, hence unpopular/gimped.

Vindicator said:

Friars are 1 of the most solid alb class's there is.

Click to expand...

and U sniff glue too? ... this statement must be like 1½ years old, now, Friars are PURE PvE whores.

Vindicator said:

Own End regain
Evade rate
Parry

Click to expand...

dunno if you have been reading the boards lately, but Friars hardly spec out of this template :
39 Staff
15 Reju
48 Enhanc
16 Parry

It's a problem. It only leads to a horde of useless Friars that are only viable in PvE. Friars evade ALOT, I agree with you on that ... and the End regen should be taken into consideration ... and only solo Friars spec in Parry

Vindicator said:

Another Problem facing Friars, which is more of a common problem for all hybrids is Lack of Determination.

Click to expand...

I don't think they need Det, but what they need is to lower the dmg output on the Staff and implement some groupfriendly stuff in the enhancement spec line.

Vindicator said:

I cant see Friars having a problem getting into any grp really, once froniters is here or Det is changed. Because They offer alot of utility to a grp.

magic Resist buffs, Most Friars have the all the 24% buffs.

Base buffs, With buff shearing this will be important.

Heals, yes agreed there shit but Never the less help.

have access to a 8sec < 3rd chain > Stun.

Click to expand...

Can U give me 1 reason to why a Dualwielding, Det5 Merc, with capped swing time should join instead of a 2H Friar, with basicly no chance of hitting a 50 Shield tank?

I take it that U know how the dualwielding vs shield works... and that you are aware of the 40+ BB's @ ATK Emain in primetime (which means that every member in grp can be buffed by a BB with ALL spec buffs)... ooh yea ... and with ToA out, all Clerics (with Perfector ML4) have 20% added to their conc, so in theory _1_ BB can buff an entire grp with spec's (or well, 7 peeps).

Vindicator said:

So its not so bad mate, Try to look on the bright side ever once in a while. There's plently of other class's that need attention above Friars thats for sure.

Click to expand...

who? ... 2H Paladins ?

Lejemorder said:

ohh and btw u friar is lvl 44?? have u ever tried a friar in RvR in for the last month? or r u basing that u say on how friars was year ago?

Click to expand...

Friars years ago had no staff spec and lacked enhanceline self buffs
also 1.x spec pts.. read up

I have a feeling most hybrid class players are praying to their house god that determination will be nerfed when Frontiers arrive.

Determination IS NOT the way to fix a class... ffs i wish people would shut up about NO DET classes.. Friars dont warrant Det and theyll never get it, what we do deserve is a grp ability..

Staff spec SHOULD NOT be lowered, ffs its fine where it is.. sure we have penalties for using 2H..and u wanna lower my WS aswell? please...

ive already started the Perfector ML so i can have Grp abilities to be able to get in grps..

any my sig is out of date its 45 now =P

Who said Friars didn't hit hard?
Imo quicksilver hurt my back when hes chasing me, and he hits hard!

Lejemorder said:

ohh and btw u friar is lvl 44?? have u ever tried a friar in RvR in for the last month? or r u basing that u say on how friars was year ago?

Click to expand...

no actually im basing that on the 3 lvl 50 shamans i kicked the living shit out of when i was level 44 running around in Hadrians and Pennines..so i THINK maybe you should look at your template if your having trouble in RvR...or maybe...just maybe realise YOUR NOT A TANK...YOUR A SUPPORT CLASS.. maybe you should stop picking fights with people who can spec shield..seeing as we get a major ass slapping from those classes due to 2H weilding mechanics.

Greenfingers said:

who? ... 2H Paladins ?

Click to expand...

Well, going from top 100 rp holders (taken from VN necro boards):

Class Realm 1Mil+ 2Mil+ 3Mil+ 4Mil+ 5Mil+ 6Mil+
Healer Mid 100+ 100+ 100+ 97 60 39
Druid Hib 100+ 100+ 100+ 69 44 28
Hero Hib 100+ 100+ 100+ 64 48 35
Cleric Alb 100+ 100+ 100+ 57 30 21
Bard Hib 100+ 100+ 99 49 27 14
Skald Mid 100+ 100+ 73 51 25 17
Berserker Mid 100+ 100+ 68 34 26 16
Enchanter Hib 100+ 100+ 67 43 28 17
Eldritch Hib 100+ 100+ 62 41 29 22
Minstrel Alb 100+ 100+ 60 32 17 11
Infiltrator Alb 100+ 100+ 59 31 14 10
Shadowblade Mid 100+ 100+ 59 23 13 6
Savage Mid 100+ 100+ 58 29 16 11
Wizard Alb 100+ 100+ 57 27 16 10
Paladin Alb 100+ 100+ 54 27 11 8
Shaman Mid 100+ 100+ 53 27 15 10
Sorcerer Alb 100+ 100+ 47 17 11 8
Runemaster Mid 100+ 100+ 45 28 18 8
Nightshade Hib 100+ 100+ 41 21 12 5
Champion Hib 100+ 97 53 28 15 11
Scout Alb 100+ 92 42 16 7 5
Blademaster Hib 100+ 87 45 20 16 13
Warrior Mid 100+ 86 48 26 12 5
Mercenary Alb 100+ 86 43 21 12 5
Hunter Mid 100+ 85 45 23 11 9
Warden Hib 100+ 85 40 23 11 7
Armsman Alb 100+ 82 36 21 11 7
Ranger Hib 100+ 76 34 15 7 4
Theurgist Alb 100+ 63 29 19 13 9
Spiritmaster Mid 100+ 61 28 19 10 4
Thane Mid 100+ 46 25 12 6 4
Mentalist Hib 100+ 45 23 10 6 5
<<<<<<Friar Alb 100+ 45 16 7 3 1>>>>>>>
Cabalist Alb 86 41 16 9 3 2
Bonedancer Mid 76 19 7 2 1 1
Reaver Alb 47 10 5 1 1 1
Valewalker Hib 38 13 6 1 1 0
Animist Hib 29 9 1 0 0 0
Necromancer Alb 23 3 1 0 0 0

Apparently Cabbys, BDs, Reavers, VWs, Animists and Necros need more help than friars. Of level 50 chars logged in at last 7 days by class and average rps:

N Class AVG RP Population
1 Hero 537,066 4,140

2 Blademaster 528,286 1,748

3 Healer 486,880 6,191

4 Shadowblade 482,852 4,142

5 Savage 482,590 2,104

6 Skald 471,652 4,178

7 Nightshade 454,429 3,318

8 Infiltrator 450,739 5,093

9 Minstrel 449,085 3,929

10 Champion 437,047 2,711

11 Eldritch 432,716 3,006

12 Runemaster 430,771 2,871

13 Scout 415,709 3,183

14 Berserker 410,845 2,961

15 Mercenary 409,190 2,294

16 Sorcerer 401,906 2,671

17 Ranger 396,492 2,965

18 Hunter 394,237 2,797

19 Druid 378,697 6,563

20 Bard 374,053 5,453

21 Warden 371,487 3,153

22 Armsman 302,467 3,776

23 Wizard 296,073 4,882

24 Warrior 295,972 4,276

25 Enchanter 290,319 5,295

26 Theurgist 286,995 3,033

27 Cleric 282,893 10,068

28 Cabalist 261,590 1,622

29 Thane 253,480 3,637

30 Spiritmaster 249,222 3,519

31 Mentalist 248,598 2,568

32 Valewalker 242,885 940

33 Shaman 240,820 7,618

34 Paladin 225,424 8,750

35 Friar 225,377 3,431

36 Animist 211,086 932

37 Bonedancer 207,938 1,701

38 Reaver 188,366 1,412

39 Necromancer 47,252 6,601

Same but only chars with 10000+ rps earned in last week (i.e. RvR active chars):

1 Hero 537,066 4,140

2 Blademaster 528,286 1,748

3 Healer 486,880 6,191

4 Shadowblade 482,852 4,142

5 Savage 482,590 2,104

6 Skald 471,652 4,178

7 Nightshade 454,429 3,318

8 Infiltrator 450,739 5,093

9 Minstrel 449,085 3,929

10 Champion 437,047 2,711

11 Eldritch 432,716 3,006

12 Runemaster 430,771 2,871

13 Scout 415,709 3,183

14 Berserker 410,845 2,961

15 Mercenary 409,190 2,294

16 Sorcerer 401,906 2,671

17 Ranger 396,492 2,965

18 Hunter 394,237 2,797

19 Druid 378,697 6,563

20 Bard 374,053 5,453

21 Warden 371,487 3,153

22 Armsman 302,467 3,776

23 Wizard 296,073 4,882

24 Warrior 295,972 4,276

25 Enchanter 290,319 5,295

26 Theurgist 286,995 3,033

27 Cleric 282,893 10,068

28 Cabalist 261,590 1,622

29 Thane 253,480 3,637

30 Spiritmaster 249,222 3,519

31 Mentalist 248,598 2,568

32 Valewalker 242,885 940

33 Shaman 240,820 7,618

34 Paladin 225,424 8,750

35 Friar 225,377 3,431

36 Animist 211,086 932

37 Bonedancer 207,938 1,701

38 Reaver 188,366 1,412

39 Necromancer 47,252 6,601

bah even Valewalkers get more grps :touch:

Elewyth(TLSOA) said:

Determination IS NOT the way to fix a class... ffs i wish people would shut up about NO DET classes.. Friars dont warrant Det and theyll never get it, what we do deserve is a grp ability..

Staff spec SHOULD NOT be lowered, ffs its fine where it is.. sure we have penalties for using 2H..and u wanna lower my WS aswell? please...

ive already started the Perfector ML so i can have Grp abilities to be able to get in grps..

any my sig is out of date its 45 now =P

Click to expand...

totally agree what i want is not det, but somekind of grp utilty exept from my 24% resist

Elewyth(TLSOA) said:

no actually im basing that on the 3 lvl 50 shamans i kicked the living shit out of when i was level 44 running around in Hadrians and Pennines..so i THINK maybe you should look at your template if your having trouble in RvR...or maybe...just maybe realise YOUR NOT A TANK...YOUR A SUPPORT CLASS.. maybe you should stop picking fights with people who can spec shield..seeing as we get a major ass slapping from those classes due to 2H weilding mechanics.

Click to expand...

lol u r basing how hard a friar hit coz u could kill 3 shammies?? i once killed 1 thane with 2 shammies (yes a thane there r full buffed and with 2 person healing him can be difficult to kill) and yes i know im a support class but atm there aint much support over friars unless u sacrifaci staff for rejuv and therefor not even can solo dia mobs more.

Blazor Meneth said:

Who said Friars didn't hit hard?
Imo quicksilver hurt my back when hes chasing me, and he hits hard!

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remember he is RR11 and that makes alot of difrences and he got a spec there r impossible to get for friars now a days.

[QUTOE=Chimaira]
Friars years ago had no staff spec and lacked enhanceline self buffs
also 1.x spec pts.. read up[/QUOTE]

hmm no?? that was for 2 years ago.... i started 1 year ago on my friar and the speclines havnt chance since i started

Greenfingers said:

dunno if you have been reading the boards lately, but Friars hardly spec out of this template :
39 Staff
15 Reju
48 Enhanc
16 Parry

Click to expand...

Then you dont know what your talking about. Alot of Friars go for 44 Staff and sacrifice some + enchance or + rejuve. Which is Crap anyway. Why do you think ppl want your 25% rezz ? If I was a caster, hell even as my tank, I would prefer to wait for a cleric to have power. If we need an emergency rezz the pally can do that Thanks. Dont assume you know how a class specs when you havent even played 1.

Must have been the glue you wer sniffing when you came out with that.

Greenfingers said:

I don't think they need Det, but what they need is to lower the dmg output on the Staff and implement some groupfriendly stuff in the enhancement spec line.

Click to expand...

You already have Group Friendly stuff, Resist buff's are Uber and any class should count them self's lucky to have them. Instant interupt is also Group friendly < its in enchance line >.

Greenfingers said:

Can U give me 1 reason to why a Dualwielding, Det5 Merc, with capped swing time should join instead of a 2H Friar, with basicly no chance of hitting a 50 Shield tank?

I take it that U know how the dualwielding vs shield works... and that you are aware of the 40+ BB's @ ATK Emain in primetime (which means that every member in grp can be buffed by a BB with ALL spec buffs)... ooh yea ... and with ToA out, all Clerics (with Perfector ML4) have 20% added to their conc, so in theory _1_ BB can buff an entire grp with spec's (or well, 7 peeps).

Click to expand...

So only tank groups are run these days and will 'only' be in the future ?

Firstly, Mercs dont swing at cap. Far from it. Friars with there Haste will. You also list a merc with Det5, So he has to have a lvl 5 ability RA's to be compared with a Friar ? doesnt sound bad to me. Who says he will be in the assist Train? Do you have any idea how effect a Warden is at interutping / healing / and on occasion assisting ? Ask Sheph, Dont assume. A friar hitting at cap speed interutping a few healers / supp at a time can be very useful not to mention that instant interupt and the odd heal is always good, no matter how shit it really is. Oh and if he is hitting a 50 Tank it means either A) He is stupid or B) there facing a BodyGuard grp, in which case His resist's will be most needed as that group will have casters of some form + the fact that if ther are already 4 attackers on the tank he gets a Free hit in, I will assume you understand how shield size works .

As for the BB issue, You dont have to waste conc on a Friar. He can do it him self. With Buff shearing it will become important and obligatory to rebuff after most fights. Clerics will be using ther conc for specs, Not base's. Hello Der mistar Friar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vindicator

So its not so bad mate, Try to look on the bright side ever once in a while. There's plently of other class's that need attention above Friars thats for sure.


who? ... 2H Paladins ?

You it seems.

Nice stats btw, little surprised by the active armsman figure, think I know of 3 off hand that I see every now and again..... another char that could do with some loving

<waits for "you have Det!" msg's>

Doubt we will after frontiers

Friars suck in RvR. No DET means were often left standing mezzed. No Insta heals means even at 33 rejuv (which I was for 1.5 years btw) we can't keep up with healing. Resists are nice I grant you but are they more nice than an extra cleric or a theurgist or even another det tank.

Friars are an excellent class fine mostly for PvE and can be fun in RvR.

Friars though beyond resists have nothing unique to add to an Albion group that counld not be replaced but another charcter that could do it better.

In the new buff shearing world friars may have an advantage, if it wasn't for the fact that the enhance specced cleric just got your place in the group

statistics are from US, cant really compare them to RvR on excal imo

Oh yes! Give Shears to classes with 1.5x Spec pts! Can you spell "FUCKING OVERPOWERED"?

Whats quicksilvers spec then? and why is it impossible to get nowadays?

Friars have been unwanted and pretty much useless in rvr for ages. Take a look at duskwave pre TOA - hell even Quick has rolled a HO merc now. Group utility isn't a huge problem (most people go 'oooo' 'ahhhh' when they get my resist buffs - like they have never seen em). Its det and only det that screwed things up. Oh yes ... and BB.

Blazor Meneth said:

Whats quicksilvers spec then? and why is it impossible to get nowadays?

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Aye i dont get that either, maybe he autotrained if thats possible and he means hes just too lazy to level up without /level?

Cant see how he can spec something while others cant. Friars are very nice and im still syaing all they need is det.

Me loves me friar, even though i deleted him at 50 RR2 L4 <pretty pathetic RR tbh but only was 50 for 5 weeks>, but im making him again currently 41 RR2 L4 <lol>. Tbh this thing about not getting groups in emain is pretty much in my experience a load of old shit, what people actually mean is they dont get in the ELITIST grps who want the perfect setup. Im lucky because im in an uber friendly guild and will pretty much allways have a space, but even before when i was 50, i rarely didnt get a spot. Sure we didnt kill as much, but thats the Zerg for u. I have to agree, friars not having det is a major problem, but remember sorcs have mez resists and mincers have demezz now so provided u got one in grp that shouldnt be a problem. And yes, haste is a godsend whacking on the healers/casters so they just cant do much. Hehe though tbh i panick a lot in RvR, 5.0 spd staffs do ridiculous dmg and most friars will have master of Pain which tbh, i crit a lot even without it beforehand. Also though stands true about the shield issue, could never hit bugger all Warriors but then with my crappy armour i tended to stay clear of the big tanks <thats the armsmans job ^_^ >. Imo every class is viable RvR as battles are never the same and any class can change one. Just my 2cents
Probably Bollox, and once my new friars 50 and i go into emain vs the ML10 artifacts i might change me point of view.

"Friars left behind again?" Doesn't this kind of imply that they at one time or another caught up?