News War with Russia

[BloodOmen]

"CIA director Bill Burns says Putin planned to take Kyiv in TWO DAYS before invasion stalled and warns Russian leader will now 'double down and grind down the Ukrainian military with no regard for civilian casualties'"

2 days? how fucking naive can you get, even if it went to his warped little plan, he had absolutely no hopes in a two day invasion. And this silly cunt is meant to be ex-KGB? he's a fucking moron.

 

[Gwadien]

"CIA director Bill Burns says Putin planned to take Kyiv in TWO DAYS before invasion stalled and warns Russian leader will now 'double down and grind down the Ukrainian military with no regard for civilian casualties'"

2 days? how fucking naive can you get, even if it went to his warped little plan, he had absolutely no hopes in a two day invasion. And this silly cunt is meant to be ex-KGB? he's a fucking moron.

He genuinely believed that Ukrainians would either welcome them or be indifferent.

Not propaganda, genuinely believed it

 

[BloodOmen]

He genuinely believed that Ukrainians would either welcome them or be indifferent.

Not propaganda, genuinely believed it

Then he's a fool. He's been living in his own little bubble for too long and thinks he's the dogs bollocks.

 

[dysfunction]

When this war is over I hope sanctions on Russia and boycotting of Russian oil and gas continues for the next 5 years at least.
Or until Putin is removed whichever is sooner

 

[Gwadien]

When this war is over I hope sanctions on Russia and boycotting of Russian oil and gas continues for the next 5 years at least.
Or until Putin is removed whichever is sooner

I don't think they will last unfortunately.

And as more companies jump on board with the sanctions, it just means there's going to be more companies lobbying governments to get them lifted as soon as the war ends.

 

[Deebs]

View: https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1501386259389825026

 

[Marc]

I kinda get where Scouse is coming from and ordinarily I would agree. One life lost is far too many and no one gave a shit when we were indiscriminately bombing tens of thousands of innocent people in the middle east in the name of "freedom". Could you imagine the uproar if assange released a video of Russian soldiers laughing whilst they mowed down a load of innocent people from an assault helicopter as though they were playing COD? No one gave a shit when the americans did it though.

But that said, I wouldnt like us to just roll over and let Putin take Ukraine. The only way to defeat a bully is to stand up to them.

 

[Scouse]

But that said, I wouldnt like us to just roll over and let Putin take Ukraine.

No-one is going to like it. Europe or the US.

But to sum up the article I posted: We're going to have to learn how to suck that dick.

 

[Wij]

No-one is going to like it. Europe or the US.

But to sum up the article I posted: We're going to have to learn how to suck that dick.

What would be the point. Give Putin one win and he will go for more. He will never be satisfied as he needs a constant stream of foreign enemies and conflict to distract from corruption at home. We should have stood up to him properly 10 years ago. The price of appeasement gets higher every time you use it.

 

[Scouse]

What would be the point. Give Putin one win and he will go for more. He will never be satisfied as he needs a constant stream of foreign enemies and conflict to distract from corruption at home.

How will he "go for more" Wij? He's up against a front of NATO if he wants to go further - and the Russian military is apparently getting raped by the yokels in Ukraine?

Which is it?

 

[Wij]

How will he "go for more" Wij? He's up against a front of NATO if he wants to go further - and the Russian military is apparently getting raped by the yokels in Ukraine?

Which is it?

Moldova is not NATO. And if the threat of nukes wins Ukraine then why stop there? If people lay down their arms to prevent nuclear war then how much conventional army does he need? And if the nuclear threat works why worry about NATO?

The Russian military won't be getting fucked over if Ukraine lays down their arms as you propose.

 

[Raven]

How will he "go for more" Wij? He's up against a front of NATO if he wants to go further - and the Russian military is apparently getting raped by the yokels in Ukraine?

Which is it?

Once again, for the slow in the room.

If Ukraine rolls over and has its tummy rubbed, like you want them to, then Russia will move onto Moldova, or Georgia, or Poland, or Romania, or Finland, or any other country he wants.

When do you think the right time to stop him is? Just for clarity.

 

[Scouse]

If people lay down their arms to prevent nuclear war

The nuclear question is about our military involvement.

But this:

The Russian military won't be getting fucked over if Ukraine lays down their arms as you propose.

So we'll throw the Ukranian's under the bus, have lots of civilian deaths and inflict a lot of damage on Russian military for an extended period of time before Russia wins (because they will, eventually).

Fair enough. Civilian lives don't matter as long as we are buying something worthwhile with them.

So just to confirm. The strategy is: Throw Ukranian lives under the bus to inflict maximum damage on the Russian military, weakening them so they are unlikely to invade anywhere else - whilst at the same time preventing us getting involved militarily so we avert the threat of nuclear war.

I'm OK with that. I just want it stated clearly.

 

[Gwadien]

The nuclear question is about our military involvement.

But this:

So we'll throw the Ukranian's under the bus, have lots of civilian deaths and inflict a lot of damage on Russian military for an extended period of time before Russia wins (because they will, eventually).

Fair enough. Civilian lives don't matter as long as we are buying something worthwhile with them.

So just to confirm. The strategy is: Throw Ukranian lives under the bus to inflict maximum damage on the Russian military, weakening them so they are unlikely to invade anywhere else - whilst at the same time preventing us getting involved militarily so we avert the threat of nuclear war.

I'm OK with that. I just want it stated clearly.

I would agree with you, but the reality is that the Ukranians are doing far better than anyone expected (or the Ruskies are doing far worse).

The extent of that, we have no idea about, because Ukraine are doing exceptionally well at writing their own narrative, but it is clear that that are doing good, so why would we not encourage them?

 

[Scouse]

I would agree with you, but the reality is that the Ukranians are doing far better than anyone expected (or the Ruskies are doing far worse).

I've said before that the Russians are holding back. If they need to get really dirty to "win", then they will. The Ukranian's don't have that capability.

 

[Gwadien]

I've said before that the Russians are holding back. If they need to get really dirty to "win", then they will. The Ukranian's don't have that capability.

You've been saying this, i've been saying this, everyone has been saying this, but it appears that western intelligence keeps reiterating how much they've fucked up.

They WANT to take the gloves off completely, but they can't.

Their logistics is fucked, they can only properly take their gloves off to the east - IE the place where all the pro-Russian people supposedly live, so they wouldn't *really* want to do that.

Also, this is making me less worried about nuclear war; if their military is in this state, I'd hate to think what quality their nuclear is at - I bet they'll end up nuking themselves or the rocket fuel has been sold off for a yacht or some shit.

 

[Deebs]

View: https://twitter.com/BNONews/status/1501518965427871745

 

[Scouse]

View: https://twitter.com/BNONews/status/1501518965427871745

This is an ACTUAL disaster if this is the case.

 

[Tom]

So we'll throw the Ukranian's under the bus, have lots of civilian deaths and inflict a lot of damage on Russian military for an extended period of time before Russia wins (because they will, eventually).

Win with what? Their economy is ruined. They don't service what they have and soon won't be able to. Their soldiers aren't well trained. They can't replace what they lose by buying from elsewhere. They can't build replacements without parts imported from other countries.

Meanwhile, everyone is throwing expensive, effective weapons at the Ukrainians - who seem to be using them to very good effect.

 

[Scouse]

Win with what? Their economy is ruined. They don't service what they have and soon won't be able to. Their soldiers aren't well trained. They can't replace what they lose by buying from elsewhere. They can't build replacements without parts imported from other countries.

Meanwhile, everyone is throwing expensive, effective weapons at the Ukrainians - who seem to be using them to very good effect.

I've responded to this like four times now. Read up my friend.

 

[ECA]

Temps in ukraine going to hit -5 to -10 tonight, and colder the next few days.
I'd hate to be an undergeared russian in an armored unit with no heating.

 

[dysfunction]

Temps in ukraine going to hit -5 to -10 tonight, and colder the next few days.
I'd hate to be an undergeared russian in an armored unit with no heating.

Or a refugee

 

[Gumbo]

I've responded to this like four times now. Read up my friend.

For the hard of understanding, do it again?

I'm not sure that the Russians can win. Even the scenario of reducing cities to dust is beginning to seem far fetched as long as we keep supplying them with advanced weaponry. If we can supply them with NLAW and Javelin, we can supply them with Patriot and more. They don't have an unlimited supply of armour, air and artillery and we're now limiting their ability to build more quite effectively. There's a very convincing argument that the Ukrainians have actually made a net gain in armour and up armoured equipment since this began with all the abandoned equipment that they are seizing. The Russians haven't made any gains for a week now. We keep awaiting their actual trained shock troops to turn up as promised, but the few times that they've deployed them they've been comprehensively defeated. We're up to 7? senior Russian commanders eliminated now, some by sniper fire. I have no doubt that this is being done with the aid of massive Western intelligence inputs. At any one time there are a dozen or so intelligence gathering platforms running up and down the Polish border.

Simply define the Russian win again for me? And how, from here, they go about accomplishing it.

 

[Gwadien]

I do worry what will happen to the Ukrainian people if Russia do win, I'd imagine they're going to pay the price for the sanctions and resistance... :/

 

[Wij]

I do worry what will happen to the Ukrainian people if Russia do win, I'd imagine they're going to pay the price for the sanctions and resistance... :/

I also don't get the argument that it will avoid loss of life if they do lay down their arms and accept Russian terms. Historical evidence from Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania would point the opposite way. Moscow shipped hundreds of thousands off to Labour camps, once they 'volunteered' to join the Soviet Union at the point of a gun, and killed many thousands on the spot on day 1.

Ukrainians also remember what the Soviets did to them in the Holodomor. Moscow-rule would mean massive loss of life. Not just liberty.

 

[Gwadien]

I also don't get the argument that it will avoid loss of life if they do lay down their arms and accept Russian terms. Historical evidence from Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania would point the opposite way. Moscow shipped hundreds of thousands off to Labour camps, once they 'volunteered' to join the Soviet Union at the point of a gun, and killed many thousands on the spot on day 1.

Ukrainians also remember what the Soviets did to them in the Holodomor. Moscow-rule would mean massive loss of life. Not just liberty.

Oh, my views have completely changed after it appears that Ukraine is putting up a mighty fine resistance, although I am still very sceptical of the numbers they are releasing.

But I also think your comparisons to the Soviet days are a bit of a far reach to be honest... Let's not forget that Russia is basically made up of lots of different ethnic groups and the Soviets very much discriminated on that basis, something we don't really see today in Putin's Russia.

I'm not even talking about a state sponsored response; I'm talking about pissed off soldiers on deployment when their life back in Russia has gone to shit due to sanctions, and all the mates they've lost fighting the Ukranians, the backlash will be huge...

 

[Raven]

He doesn't want the exact same thing as the USSR, he wants the countries that were in it to help fund his mafia.

Edit, or well, he did before going completely barking mad, who knows what he wants now.

 

[Wij]

This is an ACTUAL disaster if this is the case.

View: https://twitter.com/clairecorkhill/status/1501543224556544005

 

[Wij]

But I also think your comparisons to the Soviet days are a bit of a far reach to be honest...

The view of most people in Eastern Europe would be "Those that refuse to learn from history..."

Moscow is Moscow. It treated its neighbours much the same whether it was the Tsar or the Soviet Leader and Putin fills them with no warm fuzzy feeling of a new, caring, sharing Moscow.

 

[Raven]

Or a refugee

I was talking to the wife about offering a room, but our fucking useless government aren't letting people in.