Politics So...Europe then?

[DaGaffer]

So the Norway option, which I'm pretty sure I raised before the Referendum but was told it was a shit idea.

So the first nuance you agree with at this point in time then. Cool.

Its a less shit idea than hard Brexit. And yes, at this point in time, it would make sense. Won't happen though, because the ideological fuckwits have taken over the asylum.

 

[old.Osy]

It's want I don't want obviously.
An economic trading block, that now wants it's own army controlled from an office block in Brussels, they've got a flag, an anthem, have set to work socially engineering Europe against the wishes of it's people, they enslave countries, install politicians, they design our laws, fine us for breaking them, we have their emblem on our number plates, now they even want it on our sports shirts.
The absolute corruption of power is being played out in front of us, every step seems reasonable on the road to hell.
No matter how sensible their laws..no matter how useful their little protectionist trading bubble is..
We had to leave and so does everyone else, because it's a sham that is held together by threat.
A small towns worth of clerks and pseudo officials have brought Europe to it's knees while trying to make it fly, they have handed the extreme right victory after victory through narrow minded self indulgement, the sweeping aside of individual thought for the better good.
Well that went well didn't it, the only really good thing the EU has done is light a spark under nationalism, exactly what they were trying to contain.

I sincerely hope you don't get to live in poverty and / or social angst and that you will indeed be better off without the EU. It would mean better lives for approx 8 million non-native people in your country who came there looking for a future, in what they thought was a civilized country.

 

[Job]

It's not about the money...1st world problems..poverty in the UK is OFFICIALLY, not having enough money to fully socialise.
Leaving huge chunks of the working classes worse off than someone not working on benefits.
Anyway, its a political disaster , I wont call it a financial disaster because its no worse than we would all be without it.

It's simply a feeling that England is filling up, the government admitted yesterday in a strangely timed honesty, that we need 250K extra houses a year for 20 years to cope with net migration.
The contractors are lobbying mps to release greenbelt, they are building a thousand homes by us on the last bit of greenery seperating two towns.
I guess building and moving people in is the only way to keep the economy going.

 

[Raven]

I don't know why people are so bitter that we are leaving the EU. The same people that are always having a pop at the UK are now somehow upset we are leaving them to it? Odd.

 

[Ormorof]

It's not about the money...1st world problems..poverty in the UK is OFFICIALLY, not having enough money to fully socialise.
Leaving huge chunks of the working classes worse off than someone not working on benefits.
Anyway, its a political disaster , I wont call it a financial disaster because its no worse than we would all be without it.

It's simply a feeling that England is filling up, the government admitted yesterday in a strangely timed honesty, that we need 250K extra houses a year for 20 years to cope with net migration.
The contractors are lobbying mps to release greenbelt, they are building a thousand homes by us on the last bit of greenery seperating two towns.
I guess building and moving people in is the only way to keep the economy going.

Most of this problem is caused by the spinelessness of past politicians when dealing with housing in general, building lots of housing supply means house prices wont rise as fast = unhappy voters

 

[Ormorof]

I don't know why people are so bitter that we are leaving the EU. The same people that are always having a pop at the UK are now somehow upset we are leaving them to it? Odd.

I dont think people are bitter, just worried and a little dissapointed, we live in a society that has been connected through open borders for decades, now many people amd their families in the UK are facing a real threat that their residence status is under threat, despite having worked and paid taxes and raised families in the uk for many many years.

It is also a worry for people with british family or friends whose own status is now in doubt

As someone who as a non UK national who once lived in the UK, it saddens me that the UK has effectively voted against people like myself from taking part in the UK economically, I still have family in the UK and it is even more unpleasant for them

 

[DaGaffer]

It's not about the money...1st world problems..poverty in the UK is OFFICIALLY, not having enough money to fully socialise.
Leaving huge chunks of the working classes worse off than someone not working on benefits.
Anyway, its a political disaster , I wont call it a financial disaster because its no worse than we would all be without it.

It's simply a feeling that England is filling up, the government admitted yesterday in a strangely timed honesty, that we need 250K extra houses a year for 20 years to cope with net migration.
The contractors are lobbying mps to release greenbelt, they are building a thousand homes by us on the last bit of greenery seperating two towns.
I guess building and moving people in is the only way to keep the economy going.

The house building requirement (and schools and hospitals etc.) has been known for twenty years! This is not a new thing, and by the way the "net migration" issue isn't just immigration; its internal migration from north to south. The government isn't admitting anything new, the bigger question is why successive governments of either stripe have failed to act. This conversation has been had numerous times; England isn't "filling up", the south-east of England is "filling up", and that's a failure of government, not immigrants.

 

[Raven]

I dont think people are bitter, just worried and a little dissapointed, we live in a society that has been connected through open borders for decades, now many people amd their families in the UK are facing a real threat that their residence status is under threat, despite having worked and paid taxes and raised families in the uk for many many years.

It is also a worry for people with british family or friends whose own status is now in doubt

As someone who as a non UK national who once lived in the UK, it saddens me that the UK has effectively voted against people like myself from taking part in the UK economically, I still have family in the UK and it is even more unpleasant for them

But we haven't, people will still be able to migrate here, I have no idea what the requirements will be but pre-EU membership people still moved about. If anything it will be better because it will be people moving to stay rather than working a few years and returning. It's not like we will become an isolated state or anything.

Also I imagine there will be some sort of grace period too where people who have moved here can stay etc, there are a few Poles in my group of friends who have integrated into "British life" as it were...I don't think they are going anywhere unless they want to.

I wasn't born in the UK and I have zero worries.

 

[Job]

I would be surprised if there is any difference to migration, even after a hard brexit and liberal forces will ensure the same human rights ..stretching of credibilty..rules to ensure the criminal has more rights than the victim rules will still be enforced.
We need immigrants, but of course we don't want people who will just fill up the ghettos..in fact the whole of London is set to be a ghetto in 30 years..so I guess its after the horse has bolted.

 

[Scouse]

Ithe criminal has more rights than the victim rules

What rules are they?

Specific examples of rules that say criminals have more rights than victims please...


Edit: With links please.

 

[Gwadien]

Confirmed, leave voters are all thick;

Local voting figures shed new light on EU referendum - BBC News

 

[Raven]

Well, not necessarily "because they were thick" but because they had nothing to lose due to either being unemployed or in low paid work. It's the "they took our jerbs" brigade...because, well they did. Go into any warehouse in the country and you will find they are staffed predominantly by migrant workers, who generally work harder, for longer for less money. (You can blame the corps greed for that)

Not that it would stop the BBC publishing a poorly written, misrepresentation of the facts though

Pirates vs global warming.jpeg

 

[Job]

Hats off for Nige bagging cute French politician.
Oh the irony, the intrigue.

 

[Ormorof]

But we haven't, people will still be able to migrate here, I have no idea what the requirements will be but pre-EU membership people still moved about. If anything it will be better because it will be people moving to stay rather than working a few years and returning. It's not like we will become an isolated state or anything.

Also I imagine there will be some sort of grace period too where people who have moved here can stay etc, there are a few Poles in my group of friends who have integrated into "British life" as it were...I don't think they are going anywhere unless they want to.

I wasn't born in the UK and I have zero worries.

The reality is that EU citizens seeking residency guarantees are hitting a brick wall of bureaucracy that did not exist before the vote, no decision has been made officially but clearly some instructions have been passed to certain departments to hinder and delay as much as possible

 

[Job]

Nigel Farage and Paul Nuttall are EGGED as they campaign for Ukip in Stoke

What look is that scouse git Nuttall going for exactly?
I 'd feel obliged to egg him myself, he is just like the worst, if Ukip succeed with him in charge, I'll eat his stupid hat.

 

[caLLous]

#UKIP FAKE St George’s flag in #Stoke pic to attack Corbyn. Get it BADLY wrong

 

[Scouse]

Dunno about UKIP. But I do hate Stoke.

 

[Job]

I can just see him on the campaign trail.
Trying to look like Nigels posh brother from the North.
' Arate matey, you er gonna like vote for me or dem spazzy trostkies?'

 

[Raven]

Burp

Why Dutch populist Geert Wilders is scenting victory - BBC News

 

[Ctuchik]

Confirmed, leave voters are all thick;

Local voting figures shed new light on EU referendum - BBC News

So basically uneducated spiteful old people with nothing left to live for jumped at their one and only chance to do something "big". And if it goes tits up then well, they are gonna die soon anyway so what do they care?

 

[Moriath]

So basically uneducated spiteful old people with nothing left to live for jumped at their one and only chance to do something "big". And if it goes tits up then well, they are gonna die soon anyway so what do they care?

No basically people for whom no significant impact has been made to their lives voted for out. Those with more prospects and more international ambitions voted to remain.

The older people are the ones who voted in, in the 70s. So they obviously havent seen any benefit to them in the intervening years.

My self i have a degree and work for an i ternational company. But still voted leave. So i dont fit those stats.

 

[Raven]

So basically uneducated spiteful old people with nothing left to live for jumped at their one and only chance to do something "big". And if it goes tits up then well, they are gonna die soon anyway so what do they care?

Or you could say, air headed millennials who have never done a days work in their lives, voted remain.

Generalisation is great.

 

[Scouse]

Generalisation is great.

Has perfectly good uses.

 

[Gwadien]

No basically people for whom no significant impact has been made to their lives voted for out. Those with more prospects and more international ambitions voted to remain.

The older people are the ones who voted in, in the 70s. So they obviously havent seen any benefit to them in the intervening years.

My self i have a degree and work for an i ternational company. But still voted leave. So i dont fit those stats.

No.

That is completely false.

The EU was amazing until the economic crash, because then, like EVERYTHING, flaws start to turn up, so the older generation took advantage of the EU and had a financial security to say fuck it, let's see what happens.

The rest are racists.

 

[Ctuchik]

Generalisation is great.

It's the bestest!

 

[Job]

No we voted out because the older generation remember the Nazis.
We don't want anymore muslims.
And we don't like the hopelessly right on, PC dictats from the world centre of taking offence.

 

[Job]

No.

That is completely false.

The EU was amazing until the economic crash, because then, like EVERYTHING, flaws start to turn up, so the older generation took advantage of the EU and had a financial security to say fuck it, let's see what happens.

The rest are racists.

The EU is a protectionist Ponzi scheme, everything looks rosy until the chickens come home to roost.

 

[TdC]

yeah, except unlike a Ponzi, everyone gets a payout. which basically means it's not a Ponzi. also, protectionism in it's actual sense is long dead. what it is now is simply the art of brokering a better deal for one's self. iow the threat of higher taxation in order to get something else you want.

 

[Job]

Yes, you're right, like Greece now, another 70 billion payout, with money borrowed on the never never.

 

[old.user4556]

(You can blame the corps greed for that)

All the World's ills in one sentence.