[RANT] Fix the fucking WE's!

[Roo Stercogburn]

Another thing to note / take on board...

Just had several fights with various players in Tier 3 on my WE.

I absolutley CANNOT kill an equal level, decently played Tank, and i am Specced to ignore armour. And am a better than avarage player i think

Once i get to tier 4, ill try some more, but i doubt i will fair better.

Does anyone have pics or vids of WE's "Cutting through tanks like they werent there" as people seem to be claiming?

I would just be interested in how it was done... If it is happening so often like peple suggest.

If it isnt happening so often, i would suggest that WE are doing what there supposed to be doing... tearing up support, and ocasionaly getting lucky vs a tank.

Less posting, more levelling guild

 

[Gear]

Another thing to note / take on board...

Just had several fights with various players in Tier 3 on my WE.

I absolutley CANNOT kill an equal level, decently played Tank, and i am Specced to ignore armour. And am a better than avarage player i think

Once i get to tier 4, ill try some more, but i doubt i will fair better.

Does anyone have pics or vids of WE's "Cutting through tanks like they werent there" as people seem to be claiming?

I would just be interested in how it was done... If it is happening so often like peple suggest.

If it isnt happening so often, i would suggest that WE are doing what there supposed to be doing... tearing up support, and ocasionaly getting lucky vs a tank.

So we have to take into account that all your comments are based on your T3 experience? Right on!

 

[Svartmetall]

They've nerfed DAoCs Stealthers into the ground. Then they make even stronger stealthers in their new game...

The best question to ask would probably be: why on earth was the distilled essence of bullshit that is stealth allowed into this game in the first place?

 

[Xandax]

The best question to ask would probably be: why on earth was the distilled essence of bullshit that is stealth allowed into this game in the first place?

Indeed. One of the things which first drew me to Warhammer was back when I read there'd be no stealth in the game.

 

[Perf]

stealth classes attract more players=more revenue. Most of the W'E/W'H I spoke too had similar toons in other mmo's, and would prefer to play those types than tanks/casters.

 

[Calaen]

The WH and WH are nothing like the stealth classes from previous mmo's.

Trying to compare them is gash.

 

[`mongoose]

I have to say it makes me chuckle reading this thread.

WH do exactly the same things to our support you know. They're supposed to do that because when the melee pain train gets them they die horribly.

As regards healing a WE - lol. Half the time they're dead by the time I've finished casting - same as sorcs - anyone who get's picked out for the assist train.

This is true for both sides btw. Nobody has the healers to keep one person up during the massive burst damage that you get from 5-6 + dps classes hitting them at once.

I base my observations on open rvr. Scenarios are for fun and levelling your toons. Open RvR is where it's at imo. There all classes come into their own and provided you understand how your class has been designed and what it's intended to do you can have alot of fun.

Unfortunately from my observations on Hirn there seem to be a great many people who want their class to be something it isn't.

M

 

[Umilard]

I have to say it makes me chuckle reading this thread.

WH do exactly the same things to our support you know. They're supposed to do that because when the melee pain train gets them they die horribly.

As regards healing a WE - lol. Half the time they're dead by the time I've finished casting - same as sorcs - anyone who get's picked out for the assist train.

This is true for both sides btw. Nobody has the healers to keep one person up during the massive burst damage that you get from 5-6 + dps classes hitting them at once.

I base my observations on open rvr. Scenarios are for fun and levelling your toons. Open RvR is where it's at imo. There all classes come into their own and provided you understand how your class has been designed and what it's intended to do you can have alot of fun.

Unfortunately from my observations on Hirn there seem to be a great many people who want their class to be something it isn't.

M

The big difference is that WE seem to kill much faster, they are a smack-smack-smack-dead class while WH is a smack-smack-smack-smack-smack-smack-dead class

I know and agree that WE should be good at killing squishies. That doesn't mean they should be able to wtfpwn us on their own in less than 10 seconds even while they are detaunted and we are getting healed.

 

[Mr_Grumpy]

WH dont have massive dmg bursts in the WE range tho. They have to build theirs up ( i know bloodlust etc but even so), a we seems to be able to outright at the start of a fight front load all their damage where as the WH seems to have to build theirs up.

Sticking burn armour on a WE should mean they own themselves but guess what? it doesnt, they attack and you check log later to find theyve taken damage from BA like every 5th strike. Fubared.

 

[`mongoose]

Well I don't know about that tbh. I will only base my comments from my experiences. I've got a very low level witch hunter and I have a very low level Witch elf. They both play differently but close enough to the same for me to not experience any great disparity.

I am however basing this on very low level play.

MY experiences on Witch Hunters comes primarily from being their main source of rp food. I play a shammy and unless I can get bubble up and friends to me there is zero chance of me outhealing their spike damage. This is how it should be imo.

I also know that WE tend to spec for what they want to kill - Calaen for instance is specced anti healer and runs like a little girl when he sees a witch hunter. I don't know if the same is true for the witch hunter but I suspect it is so.

I suspect that many abilities on both sides aren't working as intended. Reading earlier I saw an archmage complaining about their buggy knock back. My Marauder's knock down is equally buggy and 9 /10 Shaman knock back attempts result in my bouncing off an invisible stone or something and ending up flying 100 yards in the wrong direction (usually wherever there is lava or a waiting pack of ebil order)

These things should be *bug* reported imo and I hope that mythic fix them.

All in all, I'm happy with the current "state of the game" and am hoping mythic continue to develop it as well as they did cammie. I'd REALLY LOVE a third opponent - maybe something Vampire Counts/SKaven based to give us another side to throw things up into the air as right now - the whole "us" vs "them" is a bit too similar to other mmos. I'd much rather it was "us" vs "them" and "them" and "those fuckers over there who looked at us funny the other day"

M

 

[Tallen]

Indeed. One of the things which first drew me to Warhammer was back when I read there'd be no stealth in the game.

Agreed, same here.

 

[Tallen]

stealth classes attract more players=more revenue. Most of the W'E/W'H I spoke too had similar toons in other mmo's, and would prefer to play those types than tanks/casters.

Stealth classes are also a huge turn-off to a lot of players as well who see them as basically griefer classes or easy-mode iwin buttons and aggrovating to play against, it's a 2-edged sword this one and by no means does stealth necessarily = more subs.

Considering Mythic never managed to balance and integrate them properly in 7 years of DAoC (LA nerf, DF nerf, DW nerf, Bow changes, CD changes, Various Shield nerfs and boosts....the list is endless), it never looked good when they announced stealth in Warhammer.... how many pages is this thread now?

 

[Tallen]

The WH and WH are nothing like the stealth classes from previous mmo's.

Trying to compare them is gash.

On a basic level, they are much like the DAoC assassin classes in many ways.

Stealth = totally invisible

High impact Stealth opener moves

Stealth escape

High burst DPS

Low armour and (supposedly) low survivability

Designed to take out squishies and healers

I know they are also quite different, but the basic design and purpose are not too far removed.

 

[Nate]

The best question to ask would probably be: why on earth was the distilled essence of bullshit that is stealth allowed into this game in the first place?

Still waving that flag then Svartmetall? I remember way back in the day when you first stood up and said no stealth in war on the beta forums.

 

[Menset]

......the whole "us" vs "them" is a bit too similar to other mmos. I'd much rather it was "us" vs "them" and "them" and "those fuckers over there who looked at us funny the other day"

That was great. LMAO

I hear Hello Kitty online has no Stealth in it.....Maybe thats the answer.

WAR is a game, I treat it like one.

 

[Calaen]

On a basic level, they are much like the DAoC assassin classes in many ways.

Stealth = totally invisible

High impact Stealth opener moves

Stealth escape

High burst DPS

Low armour and (supposedly) low survivability

Designed to take out squishies and healers

I know they are also quite different, but the basic design and purpose are not too far removed.

Stealth escape are you shitting me? 9 times out of ten I am uncovered by that dot that was thrown on me a million times, or the axe that was in throwing motion as I stealthed, or the fact that having stealthed to get near my target and I actually have to be able to survive long enough for all the Tab targethomos to unload on me then I might!!! highly doubtful but might be able to press the button again cause it aint on cooldown.

Its a much more balanced class and I believe unlike Cammy they have addressed a lot of the issues.

As Goose has already said I am specced for group utility helping out in battles hitting the healers. Its all good speccing carnage and hitting tanks and such but since healers are in short supply on Destruction I figure its better to cut there healing off.

I do agree that WE's should not be solo killing tanks (S+B) but then I am also aware that a good Tank IB should never die to a WE (if they do re-roll!!). They just have to much utility and can simply outlive the WE initial burst.

If I see a WH I will just run away, its kinda pointless unless they are shit

 

[Thatelf]

Stealth escape.
Made me laugh.
WE pop=death unless 1v1.There's a 30sec reuse on stealth and it breaks on damage,silly thing to say.

 

[Zede]

The best question to ask would probably be: why on earth was the distilled essence of bullshit that is stealth allowed into this game in the first place?

one of the initial things that drew me to the game. WoW rogues had to catered for dont you know ? The 10-16 age group has to have a voice !

 

[Aada]

The simple fact is folks WE will be getting a nerf history shows with Mythic that if people whine enough they will get what they want.

WarAlliance forums is flooded with WE nerf threads.

 

[Calaen]

The simple fact is folks WE will be getting a nerf history shows with Mythic that if people whine enough they will get what they want.

WarAlliance forums is flooded with WE nerf threads.

The dropping of the armour debuff should appease the tanks complaints which were valid. But 90% of the people complaining all rolled BW's that is why they are complaining.

 

[Aada]

The dropping of the armour debuff should appease the tanks complaints which were valid. But 90% of the people complaining all rolled BW's that is why they are complaining.

WE still outdamage a WH though and that is not on at all.

My WL has medium armour yet a WE tears through me like no tomorrow yet my supposed DPS class doesn't come near those naked chicks of death.

 

[Thatelf]

WE still outdamage a WH though and that is not on at all.

My WL has medium armour yet a WE tears through me like no tomorrow yet my supposed DPS class doesn't come near those naked chicks of death.

a BW still outdamage a Sorc.as people keep saying no class is identical ya can't have it all ways.

 

[Aada]

a BW still outdamage a Sorc.as people keep saying no class is identical ya can't have it all ways.

The classes that mirror each other should be identical in damage that way the game is mostly about skill and not about how much more damage your class does.

 

[Jenk]

a BW still outdamage a Sorc.as people keep saying no class is identical ya can't have it all ways.

A sorc does more than just damage though, right? A BW is good for damage, and damage only.

 

[ramathorn]

A sorc does more than just damage though, right? A BW is good for damage, and damage only.

lol

 

[Jenk]

lol

I'm asking because I don't know I thought sorc's had some buffs or something.

 

[Cylian]

Stealth escape.
Made me laugh.
WE pop=death unless 1v1.There's a 30sec reuse on stealth and it breaks on damage,silly thing to say.

maybe it should, but it doesnt.

 

[Thatelf]

maybe it should, but it doesnt.

I can assure you that my stealth breaks with damage.

 

[Nate]

I can assure you that my stealth breaks with damage.

I'm often putting damage on a WE and it Stealths away, then comes back and eats me for breakfast. So at some level it doesn't.

 

[Flimgoblin]

I'm asking because I don't know I thought sorc's had some buffs or something.

damage add buffs like the BW gets is all.

From what I hear sorc's have a better aoe line, BWs better dot line , both are glass cannons though.

Magus is the utility caster (ala Engineer) i.e. gimped damage for erm... I'm sure there's a reason