Weapskill? ;x

[Straef]

Made a nice template I'd like to use, but smart as I am, I forgot the +slash/dw skill ;x I don't really feel like gimping the template or starting all over, so wondered if weapskill affects dmg ;/ I always thought that weapskill was just more or less your 'to hit' chance, and that it didn't have (a lot) to do with your dmg, am I wrong? If the weapskill doesn't ruin my damage I'll just leave the +skill, as I'll prolly end up with 2k+ weapskill without it anyway.

 

[Tsabo]

Made a nice template I'd like to use, but smart as I am, I forgot the +slash/dw skill ;x I don't really feel like gimping the template or starting all over, so wondered if weapskill affects dmg ;/ I always thought that weapskill was just more or less your 'to hit' chance, and that it didn't have (a lot) to do with your dmg, am I wrong? If the weapskill doesn't ruin my damage I'll just leave the +skill, as I'll prolly end up with 2k+ weapskill without it anyway.

The figure weapon skill means nothing and is not used in any calculations at all.

BUT, your +DW Skill effects how much damage you do when using DW styles, and +Slash skill effects the amount of damage you do when doing slash styles, if you use slash and DW styles regularly you will want both slash and DW as high as possible.

If you use only DW styles then you only need to get Slash to a total of 51 with +'s.

 

[Straef]

K, just wanted to know if it affects dmg, guess I need to rework temp then x<

 

[Sycho]

Weaponskill is a very important actually.

I went from 2000 odd weaponskill on merc to 2200(tested aug str 5) and i could notice that 10% damage increase...since the weaponskill increased roughly by same too.Even when res sick you can see weaponskill effects damage...

+11 slash is 154 weaponskill, it will alter your caps aswell as your damage, you SHOULD have in your sc template being a damage dealing class aswell as +11 dw believe me straef i know.

Maybe use shike's sc he posted or ask him for the sc i sent him as i no longer have it on my hardrive but it has some hard to get items.

 

[Tsabo]

Weaponskill is a very important actually.

I went from 2000 odd weaponskill on merc to 2200(tested aug str 5) and i could notice that 10% damage increase...since the weaponskill increased roughly by same too.Even when res sick you can see weaponskill effects damage...

+11 slash is 154 weaponskill, it will alter your caps aswell as your damage, you SHOULD have in your sc template being a damage dealing class aswell as +11 dw believe me straef i know.

Maybe use shike's sc he posted or ask him for the sc i sent him as i no longer have it on my hardrive but it has some hard to get items.

But how can you use Weaponskill as a judge of damage when you will granted have a higher weapon skill when you are 50slash 50dw, yet when using a DW style you will do the same damage being 50+16DW 50+16slash compared to 50+16DW 35+16Slash? the 1st will have a higher WS, but both will do the same damage.

 

[Sycho]

Well slash mercs(which straef is still? haven't played for 6 months or more) can't just rely on dw styles they have to use backslash too that's why he needs both capped....the dw behind chain isn't anywhere near as good(0.62+0.92 growth rates compared to 0.85+0.85, aka 2 backslashes)

Weaponskill will always be involved, i do not know how(i mean the calculation) but it certainly does effect your damage, i never got the chance to test what wryd said but i bet there would still be 5% difference or so(which the +11 weapon is roughly) in damage there.

 

[Samaroon EatsCheese]

but but eclipse chain hinders!

 

[Straef]

Weaponskill is a very important actually.

I went from 2000 odd weaponskill on merc to 2200(tested aug str 5) and i could notice that 10% damage increase...since the weaponskill increased roughly by same too.Even when res sick you can see weaponskill effects damage...

+11 slash is 154 weaponskill, it will alter your caps aswell as your damage, you SHOULD have in your sc template being a damage dealing class aswell as +11 dw believe me straef i know.

Maybe use shike's sc he posted or ask him for the sc i sent him as i no longer have it on my hardrive but it has some hard to get items.

I saw some really nice temp by shike once, but it used eirene's I believe, dunno if I cba getting that :/

 

[Madae]

make better templates straef xD
or drop spirit in the one u made

 

[Eva]

WS for dual wield styles when you have 35 + 16 parry will only affect the chance for the opponent to defend themself (evade, block, parry). But when using slash styles it will do a massive differance in damage.

 

[Deepflame]

Weaponskill isn't actually used, it's just a measure of how well you do.
But if it's higher then your stats are better and as such you got a better template. But WS itself does nothing.

 

[Straef]

Guess I'll make a new temp. Actually kinda curious if I could make a decent temp with som/ml10 weap in it, tho they would probably render scalars useless ;x I'll have a go at a new temp tomorrow, hopefully a useful one this time -.-

 

[Sycho]

Weaponskill isn't actually used, it's just a measure of how well you do.
But if it's higher then your stats are better and as such you got a better template. But WS itself does nothing.

It's not true, you can see by res sickness, so you are saying when you get a str buff THAT increases weaponskill that does nothing too then?

Of course it increases damage, it's obvious or we may aswell not use buffs at all right?

 

[Eva]

Guess I'll make a new temp. Actually kinda curious if I could make a decent temp with som/ml10 weap in it, tho they would probably render scalars useless ;x I'll have a go at a new temp tomorrow, hopefully a useful one this time -.-

Ml10 bonuses goes over the 10% cap for toa bonuses, so it would only make it better. Malice + ml10 weap + golm + gov/eirenes is the best you can get really.

And ROFL at Deepflame.

 

[Deepflame]

Weaponskill is just a little display thing to let you know how well your stats are. If you die and get res sickness, you receive an effectiveness penalty, effectively debuffing you and thus lowering the stats WS is calculated by.

Here's a quote from the Paladin TL:
In addition, the display of AF on the character is largely meaningless. Much like the display of Weaponskill it doesn't factor into any calculations in the game at all, it's merely a numerical display for the player to give them a rough idea of how different things are affecting them.

Here is the topic:
http://forums.drunkenfriar.com/viewtopic.php?t=5137

I'm just going by what the TL says here. I figure he knows what he's talking about.

 

[Straef]

Ml10 bonuses goes over the 10% cap for toa bonuses, so it would only make it better. Malice + ml10 weap + golm + gov/eirenes is the best you can get really.

And ROFL at Deepflame.

I'll keep that in mind

 

[Sycho]

When it comes to light tanks i have played all four(including savage) for a large amount of time aswell as doing many tests on each, you honestly think i make this stuff up? i do not and try to help people with friendly advice.The paladin TL has no clue really, if AF didn't mean anything then why does spec AF certainly reduce damage? and why does str buffs make you hit harder? which you can obviously see with the naked eye.

I think he's stoned or something.(by the way not having a go at you deepflame but he sure is wrong, can test ingame if you do not believe me)

 

[Tsabo]

Weaponskill isn't actually used, it's just a measure of how well you do.
But if it's higher then your stats are better and as such you got a better template. But WS itself does nothing.

Someone with brains!

WS is NOT used in any calculations to determine your damage/effectiveness.

Before you reply, read this thread from the VN Boards, if you don't believe me, perhaps you will believe the DaoC TL's etc...

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=87051674&start=87103927

 

[Sycho]

Someone with brains!

WS is NOT used in any calculations to determine your damage/effectiveness.

Before you reply, read this thread from the VN Boards, if you don't believe me, perhaps you will believe the DaoC TL's etc...

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=87051674&start=87103927

Well i am still wondering what they would say if str buff doesn't effect damage when it does and it also alters weaponskill....

Since your spec doesn't change, you get buffed and gain more str, your weaponskill increases and so does your damage.So if it doesn't mean anything then how does the damage raise since str is the only thing that's been changed? also look for artemis' logs on VN of merc with different weaponskill, there's a damage difference, it's not much but it does change it and he even proved it with ingame logs.

Or even better go test for yourself, use str buff gain more weaponskill and hit the same target.

Oh well who cares, can only know the real answer from a mythic game dev anyway.

 

[Deepflame]

Slash and Crush uses full Strength and Thrust uses Strength/Dexterity. Thus as your Strength increases, so does your damage. I figure that in the calculation for weaponskill, the game takes your Strength into math as well.

 

[Elendar]

straef needs only weepskill

 

[Tsabo]

Well i am still wondering what they would say if str buff doesn't effect damage when it does and it also alters weaponskill....

Since your spec doesn't change, you get buffed and gain more str, your weaponskill increases and so does your damage.So if it doesn't mean anything then how does the damage raise since str is the only thing that's been changed? also look for artemis' logs on VN of merc with different weaponskill, there's a damage difference, it's not much but it does change it and he even proved it with ingame logs.

Or even better go test for yourself, use str buff gain more weaponskill and hit the same target.

Oh well who cares, can only know the real answer from a mythic game dev anyway.

But Weaponskill itself isnt used in the calcs, and can't be used in the calcs...

2 infs;

Inf A - 50+16CS 35+16Slash 200str has say 1500 WS
Inf B - 50+16CS 50+16Slash 200str has say 2000 WS

Both perform Garrote and both on average will hit for the same damage due to the composite spec of Inf A.

Yet Inf has 500 more WS so in your thinking Inf B Should hit harder?

This is why Weaponskill is not a good way to judge how hard you hit or how hard your character is compared to other peoples.

This is the second time I have tried to explain this so if you don't understand it this time... I won't bother again.

 

[Elendar]

But Weaponskill itself isnt used in the calcs, and can't be used in the calcs...

2 infs;

Inf A - 50+16CS 35+16Slash 200str has say 1500 WS
Inf B - 50+16CS 50+16Slash 200str has say 2000 WS

Both perform Garrote and both on average will hit for the same damage due to the composite spec of Inf A.

Yet Inf has 500 more WS so in your thinking Inf B Should hit harder?

This is why Weaponskill is not a good way to judge how hard you hit or how hard your character is compared to other peoples.

This is the second time I have tried to explain this so if you don't understand it this time... I won't bother again.

thats because garotte is based of the weaponskill from CS NOT from slash, and the weaponskill you see is based on slash and has nothing to do with cs
thats why zerks etc can splitspec if they use only la/dw/cs

 

[Straef]

straef needs only weepskill

Oi you :< That's harsh

 

[Tsabo]

thats because garotte is based of the weaponskill from CS NOT from slash, and the weaponskill you see is based on slash and has nothing to do with cs
thats why zerks etc can splitspec if they use only la/dw/cs

Incorrect, the damage of garrote is based on slash and cs, but the effect slash spec has on it caps at 51, hence 35+16 is the max you need. This is because the damage calc requires the Unstyled Cap.

And this again is my point, if a merc can play using just his/her DW styles then you can have more points spread elsewhere, i dont see any problems with using pure DW as the DW taunt has same growth rate as ammy slash and plenty other good styles in DW.

I'm in the process of trying a different spec out atm, making a merc with;

50dw
35slash
42sheild
19parry

Charge + slam then switching to DW weaps may prove nasty, but i will find out soon enough

 

[Straef]

Ml10 bonuses goes over the 10% cap for toa bonuses, so it would only make it better. Malice + ml10 weap + golm + gov/eirenes is the best you can get really.

And ROFL at Deepflame.

By the way, didn't really get the first bit before but... did you mean I could get up to 12 melee/style dmg using the ml10 slasher? Never heard of anything like that before.

 

[Huntingtons]

By the way, didn't really get the first bit before but... did you mean I could get up to 12 melee/style dmg using the ml10 slasher? Never heard of anything like that before.

its' because it's a different bonus, its pvp only

 

[Straef]

its' because it's a different bonus, its pvp only

Wouldn't it be best to use 2 of those then, for 14% melee/style dmg? :x

 

[Eva]

Gl getting that bonus though without malice/ctd.

When it's a specific bonus (vs Player Races like ml10, or vs animals or some pve bonus) it can go all the way up to the 25% cap that was the cap for all in 1.67.

If you use Croc, GoV, golm and ml10 mainhander you'd get 12% melee, 11% style in pvp, and 10% melee 9% style in pve.

Or if you used Malice, GoV, golm and ml10 offhander you'd get 11% melee, 12% style in pvp, 9% melee 10% style in pve etc.

 

[Sycho]

But Weaponskill itself isnt used in the calcs, and can't be used in the calcs...

2 infs;

Inf A - 50+16CS 35+16Slash 200str has say 1500 WS
Inf B - 50+16CS 50+16Slash 200str has say 2000 WS

Both perform Garrote and both on average will hit for the same damage due to the composite spec of Inf A.

Yet Inf has 500 more WS so in your thinking Inf B Should hit harder?

This is why Weaponskill is not a good way to judge how hard you hit or how hard your character is compared to other peoples.

This is the second time I have tried to explain this so if you don't understand it this time... I won't bother again.

Well what you saying is impossible to test hence why no one knew it until the TL's brought it up(including me) since stats(str/dex) and weapon spec change weaponskill which results in you never being able to see if weaponskill does effect damage.(or involved within the formula)

Inf A - 50+16CS 35+16Slash 200str has say 1500 WS
Inf B - 50+16CS 50+16Slash 200str has say 2000 WS

For example this would never happen ^^ as you would have to change stat or spec to alter the weaponskill of each, it would be the same if they both 50+16 slash 50+16 cs and 200 str.So i am wondering if the TL's got this from mythic as you can no way test it as you would have to change stat or spec to make their weaponskills different which they say are involved in the formula.