Weaponskill

[Juilie]

Right, ive been regretting choosing celt instead of firbolg for my blademaster lately, because of the 30 strenght difference, making a firbolg having more weaponskill. Please disregard other class advantages celts might have like similarity to groups naturalists or anything else, this question concern weaponskill only.

Ive asked a lot of people about the relation between weaponskill and actual damage, and i usually end up with two views of this relation.

Its the people saying they are 10000% sure weapskill affects damage to a very large and direct degree, and usually points to the effect ressurection illness has (cutting damage and weapskill in half) as proof of this.

The other half of the people say weapskill mainly affect your chance to hit, (chance to not be parried/evaded/blocked/etc), and that damage has more sides to it than just the weaponskills. One can see that where a few skill points dont give much weapskill compared to strenght stat (for slash/crush for instance), it considerably increases damage more than strenght does(not something i have tested, something i have been told). Drawing in examples like savages being good damage dealers despite low weapskill, as well as to a certain degree friars and champions/valewalkers, are also arguments from this corner.

So, can anybody supply some constructive ideas and opinions about this, possibly even a proof or at least an attempt at an explanation according to their view of this?

 

[Sycho]

I am pretty sure weaponskill works like this vs your target's af:

Say like i have 2136/3= 712af.

I will cap on anything with that or below it IF i am not debuffed or diseased that is or if the armour is resistant to me then i will probably not cap but be very near it.

What i do know though for sure is 30 str is about 9-10% more damage for a pure str base weapon user(pure tank/light tank), i have tested this with my merc and even weaponskill wise you can see this on a light tank.The reason why savages hit hard is when they use the dps buff which raises their base damage just like ml10 banelord(which also both alter damage caps) which also boosts your style damage per hit, a friar only hits hard really on casters/light armoured targets i bet it will not hit a heavy armoured target near it's caps due to the weaponskill but hits very fast instead.

Weaponskill certainly effects damage, take the +11 skill from your sc gear off for example i bet as a light tank you will see the difference(at least in damage caps anyway) but never the less firbolg is like a half ogre, give it 15 str and 10 qui at creation, you got the best damage type race in hib/alb.

Briton: str 60 qui 60
Highlander: str 70 qui 50
Half ogre: str 90 qui 40
Saracen: str 50 qui 60

Can't remember inconnu's stats but if you look at the above and start with the offensive stats(the above example is of course if you speccing slash/crush)you will see half ogre is best :/ since it will have that 10 more stat overall anyway(str+qui=total offensive stats) aswell as more racial resists.With NF coming isn't going to matter much anymore....like a half ogre could hit qui cap and a celt could hit over 400 str which is basically enough.

 

[Xeanor]

Sycho says:
ffs i know it all about light tanks xD

 

[p0x]

I am pretty sure weaponskill works like this vs your target's af:

Say like i have 2136/3= 712af.

umm, I dont even cap on casters with about 20 less wskill than you have so wth are you babbling about?

Where would toa bonuses, relic bonuses, armor abs%, weaponspec etc come in?

Anyways seeing your bm is already rr6, rerolling would be a bit silly. I've regretted making my bm a celt since about rr7 :|

 

[Sycho]

umm, I dont even cap on casters with about 20 less wskill than you have so wth are you babbling about?

Where would toa bonuses, relic bonuses, armor abs%, weaponspec etc come in?

Anyways seeing your bm is already rr6, rerolling would be a bit silly. I've regretted making my bm a celt since about rr7 :|

Well you probably usually get debuffed by sorc/spiritmaster whereas if i get str debuffed by an eld or so i hit noticeably less damage too xE

Resists come into after aswell as other factors you stated but that's where i never have found out how it works....(the way i said is probably how it's calculated before everything else comes into the equation)

The fact is, if you go blades/blunt/crush/slash there is no reason not to choose half ogre/firbolg unless you do not want to be a big primary target but in NF you can easily overcome the suitable stat problems.(400 str and 250 qui easy to get in NF for a fairly high rr tank of any race or near these stats providing they do not have high actives which cost 30 points for 3rd level, with aug str 3 and aug qui 3 in NF i be on 403str and spot on 250 qui for example.)

Empty your inbox too p0x ffs xD

 

[SoulFly]

The more ws, the closer to cap you hit it's that simple! xF

The more the better.

http://haldar.newmail.ru/daoc/ws.html : r0x

 

[Succi]

I've regretted making my bm a celt since about rr7 :|

[Group]Sharwyn :"ffs, wish I was an elf"

 

[Bubble]

The more ws, the closer to cap you hit it's that simple! xF

The more the better.

http://haldar.newmail.ru/daoc/ws.html : r0x

nice link

 

[Escape]

Firbolgs are strong, but not sexy. That's why you play a celt.

 

[Belomar]

Mistakes made at character creation are the worst since you can't change them; this includes race, stat point distribution, and even class. In my experience, they're always there, gnawing in the back of your mind, and they'll make you go crazy sooner or later!

 

[Cozak]

umm, I dont even cap on casters with about 20 less wskill than you have so wth are you babbling about?

Where would toa bonuses, relic bonuses, armor abs%, weaponspec etc come in?

Anyways seeing your bm is already rr6, rerolling would be a bit silly. I've regretted making my bm a celt since about rr7 :|

You hit my RM with capped resists shields up etc for 370 mainhand :< hard enough

 

[Garok]

There are bugs in WS calculation though...

Wep Skill Bug

 

[p0x]

done :|

 

[Sagano]

my troll has far higher str and ws then most light tanks here but doenst hit as hard must be more to it then just ws and stats ?

 

[Xeanor]

my troll has far higher str and ws then most light tanks here but doenst hit as hard must be more to it then just ws and stats ?

landing positionals rather than anytimers helps xD

 

[Sycho]

my troll has far higher str and ws then most light tanks here but doenst hit as hard must be more to it then just ws and stats ?

What targets? when i hitted alb plate/chain as a hib/mid it was hard as fuck to cap on targets which had spec af but with relics you could get near it though.

Bare in mind you also have red conc haste often which means lower per hit but much better damage overtime and with str relics your damage was on par i assume? +11 skill in weapon spec changes cap aswell as increasing weaponskill.

 

[Ticking]

Just go pierce 4tw D:

 

[Toxx]

Relics wont make you hit closer to cap sycho... simply make your cap 20% larger, which will raise your normal hit by 20% obviously.

But im sure you already knew that, and you prolly just made a typo or something ><

 

[Edlina]

Relics wont make you hit closer to cap sycho... simply make your cap 20% larger, which will raise your normal hit by 20% obviously.

But im sure you already knew that, and you prolly just made a typo or something ><

Ehh what are you talking about? Relics don't change cap.

But I'm sure you knew that etc

 

[bigchief]

Relics wont make you hit closer to cap sycho... simply make your cap 20% larger, which will raise your normal hit by 20% obviously.

But im sure you already knew that, and you prolly just made a typo or something ><

or indeed the total opposite. Which is in fact true and is what Sycho said ...

 

[Sagano]

if i compare my 2H dmg with 2H of a zerker ( same style , spec , target , etc ) i get lower dmg altho i got more ws
same effect on 1H <-> mainhand

so must be something else that makes a difference in dmg between the classes ?


and less strong replies from a sorc who whines better then he mezzes

 

[Sycho]

The only thing that changes your caps are:

- Melee damage toa bonus.
- Styled damage bonus.
- Melee speed damage bonus.
- Quickness.
- Any forms of haste/celerity.
- Any skill bonuses from items or realm ranks.
- Amount of skilled spec into a weapon.

Str relics just make you have more of a chance to hit caps.

 

[Sycho]

if i compare my 2H dmg with 2H of a zerker ( same style , spec , target , etc ) i get lower dmg altho i got more ws
same effect on 1H <-> mainhand

so must be something else that makes a difference in dmg between the classes ?


and less strong replies from a sorc who whines better then he mezzes

Get a zerk you know, hit the same target and do 30-40 style log or something each (but try to get same damage type as you aswell as spec,qui and haste.Then you can use same styles but just use 2h since LA 1h will be different to yours or even better use another troll warrior)

Then state stats, realm ranks, toa bonuses aswell as skill bonuses then lets see where you are going wrong.

 

[Osri]

I bet this is intresting with this stuff...

http://vnboards.ign.com/Midgard_Viking_Professions/b20911/72473784/p1

There is base damage diffrence between troll and kobby but its small imo...kobby has in those tests more qui which lowers style damages.

nn

 

[Toxx]

jesus Oo

Obviously ive never tested myself, but i only assumed str relics work exactly the same as power relics, power relics = 20% more spell damage (including cap) and heal bonus...

Well guess who looks like a total assflap

 

[Sycho]

I bet this is intresting with this stuff...

http://vnboards.ign.com/Midgard_Viking_Professions/b20911/72473784/p1

There is base damage diffrence between troll and kobby but its small imo...kobby has in those tests more qui which lowers style damages.

nn

As you can see in those tests str does vary all the time, at one minute that 30 str difference from a firbolg compared to a celt can be 7% damage roughly the next time it could be 9% due to the damage variance every melee class gets which also lowers with the more weaponskill you have, however quickness never varies, it only effects swing speed(which quickness gives a certain set percentage per point, 6 qui is 2% faster swing speed roughly if i remember might be slightly wrong) and evade.That's where those lower str races can get the advantage.

Though in NF with the quickness cap easier to obtain the higher str races can excel a bit better in damage compared to the lower str ones since the cap is easier to obtain than the str cap which is 450 in NF but to be honest with around 400 str and relics you would hit pretty damn hard as any light tank.When i got 26 str overcap on my merc it worked at around 5-6% damage more roughly too.

 

[Belomar]

Obviously ive never tested myself, but i only assumed str relics work exactly the same as power relics, power relics = 20% more spell damage (including cap) and heal bonus...

Eh. The assflapping continues. Power relics and strength relics work exactly the same way, they make you hit closer to your cap and does not raise it (heals are a special case, however).

 

[Shike]

jesus Oo

Obviously ive never tested myself, but i only assumed str relics work exactly the same as power relics, power relics = 20% more spell damage (including cap) and heal bonus...

Well guess who looks like a total assflap

haha, no

All relics only makes it easier to reach caps, they _never_ fiddle with the cap itself. One thing powerrelics affects is heals though, maybe you mixed it up with that. Damages always stay the same capwise Tried this myself so I am 100000000% sure it is this way it works.

 

[Dreami]

Go pierce m8, the choice of r0xstars

 

[Puppet]

jesus Oo

Obviously ive never tested myself, but i only assumed str relics work exactly the same as power relics, power relics = 20% more spell damage (including cap) and heal bonus...

Well guess who looks like a total assflap

Power-relics only increase cap for heals, not for damaging spells. Basically you will hit nuke for nuke 20% closer to cap; its not like our delves go 20% up (that would be hilarious for self-debuffers tho )

You're right about heal-spells; they do gain 20% flat over their cap; with same gear and RA's a druid on Prydwen heals 20% better then a cleric/healer if they use the same delve heal-spells.