VP's working as intended

[aika]

As mentioned on many threads its impossible currently for Order to capture T4 zones, here's an example of Dragonwake on KEP today. We control all keeps and bo's for 6 hours. Destro take one bo.

this what happens:
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/2661/twinief002yt0.jpg

nevermind that 7h after server restart Destro are sieging Altdorf and Reikland fell in the 15 mins I was doing a scenario, while the so-called Fortress fell even faster.

I can see a lot was tested in the beta.

When was Origins release date again?

 

[aika]

Altdorf captured 8 hours after server reset

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/8857/twinief003yi2.jpg

is this normal?

 

[Dvergar]

During the last Altdorf push (3-4 days ago?), we defended against the first assault on Stonewatch, and then all the WB's (2 or 3 full and some random parties) moved to Thunder M. We took the Destro keep, defended ours, took all BO's and generaly kicked destro's ass in the process. We both had same VP's after 30 mins. It was pointless as Destro seamed to have left the zone after the initial skirmish, so most of us left. 30 min later Destro took the undefended keeps and locked the zone.

 

[Norvindus]

At least GOA reset the campaing because of the zone locking errors. linky : Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning

 

[Aqe]

I think i know why it is so easy for destruction to take control, wont say exactly as i like being on the winning side.

It has something to do with how and from where you get VP, and how it is calculated.

 

[Gahn]

There's really something wrong in the VPs calculation, we held Avelorn also for most of the med noon early evening with Keeps and all BOs and we couldn't lock the zone.

 

[Javai]

VPs don't only come from activity in the rvr parts of the zone, my understanding is they are also effected by things like PQs and scenario outcomes and probably a bunch of other things that don't seem obviously related to it.

 

[Gahn]

VPs don't only come from activity in the rvr parts of the zone, my understanding is they are also effected by things like PQs and scenario outcomes and probably a bunch of other things that don't seem obviously related to it.

Yeh that's sure, but i can't still get how the weight is distributed tbh, surely my guild was farming repetedly some PQs in Chap 12-13, it didn't seem we were doing bad in scenarios also (as Order overall).
The algorithm must be borked or right out bad thought somewhere.

 

[Aqe]

Ok i will give this one to order side so we get some more competition. You can't take the elf zones or atleast it almost impossible due to all the scenarios run there. Both sides got thousands of victories so 1-2 more doesn't matter. In the greenskin/dwarf and chaos/empire front 5 victories in a row can be enough to capture the zone, if you own some open world objective.

PvE VPs is always close to 50/50, Skirmish VP is close to 50/50, Open rvr VP is depending on what you own at the time.
Scenario VP that is the largest pool should be around 50/50 but as none/few is doing other SC than Serpents passage just a few victories sway the balance in other zones.

Was the same in beta, when they first opened scenarios someone would claim the zone instantly, if none did in the first day then no zone was captured until next reset.

 

[Javai]

Ok i will give this one to order side so we get some more competition. You can't take the elf zones or atleast it almost impossible due to all the scenarios run there. Both sides got thousands of victories so 1-2 more doesn't matter. In the greenskin/dwarf and chaos/empire front 5 victories in a row can be enough to capture the zone, if you own some open world objective.

Would perhaps balance things better to make the VPs split according to the zone the players joined from rather than which pairing the scenario belongs to since it's so rare to get empire/chaos and dwarf/greenskin ones to pop in t3 and t4. Alternatively atm I would make it so you queued a scenario without being able to choose which one or all and which one came up was random as the lack of variety even when queuing all is both tedious and a shame because some of the t3 ones I've only managed to play once are really atmospheric.

 

[GReaper]

PvE VPs is always close to 50/50, Skirmish VP is close to 50/50, Open rvr VP is depending on what you own at the time.
Scenario VP that is the largest pool should be around 50/50 but as none/few is doing other SC than Serpents passage just a few victories sway the balance in other zones.

Sounds fairly logical.


I think yesterday evening seemed to be a bit better in some respects. Destruction opened Altdorf, we completed probably 3-4 PQs inside and we took control of the zone for the next stage, seems about right given that Order didn't win any PQ in the city. Obviously the time this was taken (01:00 BST) made it impossible to do the next quests within the 2 hours to keep Altdorf under Destruction control. So this morning all the zones are reset, I'm assuming this all happened naturally instead of Altdorf being under siege for 2 days due to bugs!


We should not have a VP system based on unknown formulas. Whilst I understand the need not to release every formula as not to abuse the system, players need to know what to do in RvR. Should they be doing PQs, scenarios, keep takes, or open rvr to move the victory bar?

Order players are quite annoyed that they can take all the keeps/objectives in a zone and are unable to even get close to taking control, whilst Destruction seems to be able to take the zone easily. If either side knew the reasons why enough victory points haven't been earned then we might be able to trust the system. But until more details are given, people are accusing a system we don't fully understand as being bugged.

 

[Pandemic]

Sounds fairly logical.


I think yesterday evening seemed to be a bit better in some respects. Destruction opened Altdorf, we completed probably 3-4 PQs inside and we took control of the zone for the next stage, seems about right given that Order didn't win any PQ in the city. Obviously the time this was taken (01:00 BST) made it impossible to do the next quests within the 2 hours to keep Altdorf under Destruction control. So this morning all the zones are reset, I'm assuming this all happened naturally instead of Altdorf being under siege for 2 days due to bugs!


We should not have a VP system based on unknown formulas. Whilst I understand the need not to release every formula as not to abuse the system, players need to know what to do in RvR. Should they be doing PQs, scenarios, keep takes, or open rvr to move the victory bar?

Order players are quite annoyed that they can take all the keeps/objectives in a zone and are unable to even get close to taking control, whilst Destruction seems to be able to take the zone easily. If either side knew the reasons why enough victory points haven't been earned then we might be able to trust the system. But until more details are given, people are accusing a system we don't fully understand as being bugged.

well we know its bugged heavily against order; we had a situation on KEP yesterday where order controlled both keeps and all 4 flags. Destruction took 1 flag and locked the zone. Then Mythic announced today that they are making changes to how the vp system works i.e. fixing the bugs

I'm also not sure how many PQ's you need to win to gain control, you managed it in 35 mins by winning 3, I was under the impression you needed alot more but maybe not

 

[GReaper]

Trying to gain Altdorf seems to have gone from one extreme to the other.

The first two times it always seemed impossible to move the victory bar regardless of winning the PQ. The last attempt seemed too easy, it was locked down too quickly!

I'm just hoping that the next patch brings some balance to the entire thing.

 

[Aqe]

well we know its bugged heavily against order; we had a situation on KEP yesterday where order controlled both keeps and all 4 flags. Destruction took 1 flag and locked the zone. Then Mythic announced today that they are making changes to how the vp system works i.e. fixing the bugs

I'm also not sure how many PQ's you need to win to gain control, you managed it in 35 mins by winning 3, I was under the impression you needed alot more but maybe not

How many scenarios in that zone had you won? You can take a zone with only 1 objective as long as you won 100% of the scenarios.

 

[Gahn]

How many scenarios in that zone had you won? You can take a zone with only 1 objective as long as you won 100% of the scenarios.

Err hardly believable that Destro won 100% ain't it?

 

[gordro]

Err hardly believable that Destro won 100% ain't it?

I've not lost a game vs a pug when in a premade, and the pre-mades vs premades are normally pretty easy as well.

Now imagine a premade queuing up for an instance NOT SP? I doubt there are any pre-mades on the Order side in those queues, they just want the easy pug's to face and farm.

So when a premade destruction group joins the graveyard queue, and eventually gets a game, they are allmost allways facing a PUG. 50% of which drop out 2 minutes into the game anyway.

The VP system isnt bugged in favor of one faction over the other, its just that one faction are not helping themselves. If a few Order groups decided to do that same we would have you guys locking zones and getting somewhere.

Although Order continually call Destruction cheats, its allways the fault of Order that Destruction actually get to their doorstep. Play more than the one scenario and actually defend yourselves......

 

[ECA]

Here's how destro does it.

Take a BO/etc to initiate.

Then find a big hill.
Have everyone suicide and get ressed repeatedly as ressing gives that team VP.
10-20 mins of suicide ressing later you will get zone control.

Enjoy.

 

[Gahn]

I've not lost a game vs a pug when in a premade, and the pre-mades vs premades are normally pretty easy as well.

Now imagine a premade queuing up for an instance NOT SP? I doubt there are any pre-mades on the Order side in those queues, they just want the easy pug's to face and farm.

So when a premade destruction group joins the graveyard queue, and eventually gets a game, they are allmost allways facing a PUG. 50% of which drop out 2 minutes into the game anyway.

The VP system isnt bugged in favor of one faction over the other, its just that one faction are not helping themselves. If a few Order groups decided to do that same we would have you guys locking zones and getting somewhere.

Although Order continually call Destruction cheats, its allways the fault of Order that Destruction actually get to their doorstep. Play more than the one scenario and actually defend yourselves......

I still hardly believe it can work that way, it would be utterly stupid that you can join any scenario from anywhere (and trust me i do always join all but 90% of times is the same shit coming up) and the system does take in count the Zone which the Bg belongs to instead of the Zone from WHERE i actually JOIN any scenario.
There's a flaw, no matter what.

Here's how destro does it.

Take a BO/etc to initiate.

Then find a big hill.
Have everyone suicide and get ressed repeatedly as ressing gives that team VP.
10-20 mins of suicide ressing later you will get zone control.

Enjoy.

This sounds somewhat more like the typical bug Mythic would let slip in game.
Check logs and ban accordingly please, we can quite get going without these morons.

 

[gordro]

I still hardly believe it can work that way,

Theres lots like that in this game, or rather, this game has lots of things that are a pretty good idea if used in the original "spirit of the game"

Its just that players (humans) will allways look to use things to their best advantage. Its why we arn't swinging in trees anymore (google Darwin to understand that if its confusing)

For example. The renown/exp gain from kills/heals would be fine if they were distributed amoungst the group as intended. But then mythic allow people to drop from group, throwing the numbers off kilter and the system as a whole is then GOING to be abused.

Anougher example. Contibution in PQ's and keep Takes is also off key. I can spend my entire time AOEing like mad (on my Maurader) and using the ram to hit the doors etc and come 15th.
If I don't bother, and I just wake up at the boss itself and single target him, ignoring the entire start fo the fight, I can come first with 500 contribution. How? i don't know, but i've done it 3 times in a row. Hardly fair, but thats the system


Tors - White Rose - KEP

 

[Gahn]

Theres lots like that in this game, or rather, this game has lots of things that are a pretty good idea if used in the original "spirit of the game"

Its just that players (humans) will allways look to use things to their best advantage. Its why we arn't swinging in trees anymore (google Darwin to understand that if its confusing)

For example. The renown/exp gain from kills/heals would be fine if they were distributed amoungst the group as intended. But then mythic allow people to drop from group, throwing the numbers off kilter and the system as a whole is then GOING to be abused.

Anougher example. Contibution in PQ's and keep Takes is also off key. I can spend my entire time AOEing like mad (on my Maurader) and using the ram to hit the doors etc and come 15th.
If I don't bother, and I just wake up at the boss itself and single target him, ignoring the entire start fo the fight, I can come first with 500 contribution. How? i don't know, but i've done it 3 times in a row. Hardly fair, but thats the system


Tors - White Rose - KEP

Doesn't mean that he HAS to work that way, we are clearly finishing off beta testing in here cause, as i feared during Beta, most of people played the game instead of testing it.
There are flows and Mythic need to address it.

 

[ECA]

Doesn't mean that he HAS to work that way, we are clearly finishing off beta testing in here cause, as i feared during Beta, most of people played the game instead of testing it.
There are flows and Mythic need to address it.

MMOs dont launch in the state wow is in now, when wow came out endgame was dreadful,endgame itemisation was dreadful.

No crossrealm, queueing only from that specific zone rather than cities etc etc.

Warhammer is in a great state for a just launched mmo, compared to say Anarchy online, age of conan, etc etc.

 

[Gahn]

MMOs dont launch in the state wow is in now, when wow came out endgame was dreadful,endgame itemisation was dreadful.

No crossrealm, queueing only from that specific zone rather than cities etc etc.

Warhammer is in a great state for a just launched mmo, compared to say Anarchy online, age of conan, etc etc.

Do be honest up to T3 i didn't find anything really gamebreaking (apart some cheater trying to get into the Keep climbing walls).
You have to agree with me tho that the Endgame (T4) actually suffers from a plethora of game breaking issues that need to be addressed quickly.
Can't really wait 1-2 months for a fix or people will start leave.

 

[Succi]

Here's how destro does it.

Take a BO/etc to initiate.

Then find a big hill.
Have everyone suicide and get ressed repeatedly as ressing gives that team VP.
10-20 mins of suicide ressing later you will get zone control.

Enjoy.

Now look at the first screenshot in this thread. This is what destruction did on KEP.

gg!

 

[Poag]

I still hardly believe it can work that way, it would be utterly stupid that you can join any scenario from anywhere (and trust me i do always join all but 90% of times is the same shit coming up) and the system does take in count the Zone which the Bg belongs to instead of the Zone from WHERE i actually JOIN any scenario.

Yeah it does work that way, and it wouldn't be a problem either if they hadn't added the 'Join All' button. As you would have had to be in the right zone to go there for starters.

So by making it "easier for everyone" to have fun, they infact gimped the VP generation of order on KEP for any pairing thats not the current favorite instance. Seeing as order dont actually join anything other than TA in t3 and SP in t4.

Was good last night we had the dwarf one pop up, 5 points to cap and the like. So 15 blood thirsty destro charged down the ramp took all the flags and wondered where the order team was. Upon checking the list there was 1 (one) order player, a bright wizard who was level 6! we tracked him down and all bounced around him manically as he tried to kill us untill the BG closed

Had the same in T3 with the order team taking one point, dieing once then all exiting the instance...very yawn.

 

[Skaven]

Yep the PQ system is fucked. Whether or not its working as intended your PQ contribution shoulden't be based entirely on the final boss. Someones who's been there since the first stage should always get priority over someone thats just rolled in on stage 3 and hit the boss a few times.

Theres certainly a crap load of things like this in the game which make it uber frustrating, I just hope the patches (like they seem to be doing at the moment) come thick and fast to address these concerns.

 

[Xandax]

Theres lots like that in this game, or rather, this game has lots of things that are a pretty good idea if used in the original "spirit of the game"

Its just that players (humans) will allways look to use things to their best advantage. Its why we arn't swinging in trees anymore (google Darwin to understand that if its confusing)

For example. The renown/exp gain from kills/heals would be fine if they were distributed amoungst the group as intended. But then mythic allow people to drop from group, throwing the numbers off kilter and the system as a whole is then GOING to be abused.

Anougher example. Contibution in PQ's and keep Takes is also off key. I can spend my entire time AOEing like mad (on my Maurader) and using the ram to hit the doors etc and come 15th.
If I don't bother, and I just wake up at the boss itself and single target him, ignoring the entire start fo the fight, I can come first with 500 contribution. How? i don't know, but i've done it 3 times in a row. Hardly fair, but thats the system


Tors - White Rose - KEP

Don't even think to compare evolution and human evolving using "advantages" in that connection with wanting to play unfair to win in a computer game.
The two are not even remotely connected.

The problem here is the same as it always is on the internet. Anonymity makes people think they can act like they want because there is no immediate consequence. Self restraint and common sense goes out the door.

 

[Gahn]

Don't even think to compare evolution and human evolving using "advantages" in that connection with wanting to play unfair to win in a computer game.
The two are not even remotely connected.

The problem here is the same as it always is on the internet. Anonymity makes people think they can act like they want because there is no immediate consequence. Self restraint and common sense goes out the door.

The more i read those kind of sentences the more i wonder wtf Goa's waiting in handing out, at least, some suspensions.

 

[- English -]

As mentioned on many threads its impossible currently for Order to capture T4 zones, here's an example of Dragonwake on KEP today. We control all keeps and bo's for 6 hours. Destro take one bo.

this what happens:
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/2661/twinief002yt0.jpg

nevermind that 7h after server restart Destro are sieging Altdorf and Reikland fell in the 15 mins I was doing a scenario, while the so-called Fortress fell even faster.

I can see a lot was tested in the beta.

When was Origins release date again?

cry more irl about a game pls

 

[aika]

cry more irl about a game pls

study more pls xD

 

[- English -]

study more pls xD

indeed im too much of a busy atm to play atm ;/

you should duo log my RP and be like boofyboty ;<