Tory being hung out to dry for a legitimate belief

[cHodAX]

Was shocked at how the media are reacting to this story...

BBC News - Grayling suggests B&Bs should be able to bar gay guests

Here is what he said...

He said: "I think we need to allow people to have their own consciences.

"I personally always took the view that... if you look at the case of 'Should a Christian hotel owner have the right to exclude a gay couple from their hotel?'

"I took the view that if it's a question of somebody who's doing a B&B in their own home, that individual should have the right to decide who does and who doesn't come into their own home.

"If they are running a hotel on the High Street, I really don't think that it is right in this day and age that a gay couple should walk into a hotel and be turned away because they are a gay couple, and I think that is where the dividing line comes."

I don't see the problem, as he said if the B&B is actually someones home then they should have the right to allow or turn away whoever the person it. This is still a free country right where people are entitled to thier own opinions no matter how warped they might be? Or can the law force it's own virtues upon people in thier own homes?

 

[Tom]

He's out of touch. Want to run a B&B? Tough shit if you don't like the sexuality of your guests.

 

[rynnor]

I agree with him tbh - it should be illegal for hotels to discriminate but you cant force people to take others into their homes.

However in the case that sparked it she should have advertised that fact and confirmed it at the booking time - turning people away at the door is a big no-no and the least she could have done would be to find them a room elsewhere and pay for it.

 

[cHodAX]

He's out of touch. Want to run a B&B? Tough shit if you don't like the sexuality of your guests.

Or mebbe you are just a pinko treehugging communist?

 

[Edmond]

The original story about this from the couple themselves did say that the woman had not been rude or abusive and appologised, she gave them a full refund without quibble

I have a few gay friends and although i think she is probably a bit outdated, she has every right to turn away who she wants from her home, its her prerogative at the end of the day

I will ask my gay friend what he thinks about it. i'm seeing him on tuesday, knowing how he thinks, he will probably say that she has the right to do whatever she wants, her loss at the revenue at the end of the day

 

[Raven]

He's out of touch. Want to run a B&B? Tough shit if you don't like the sexuality of your guests.

Er no. He is right. A guest house or a B&B is not a hotel, it is someone's home, they have every right (or should do) to decide who stays at their home.

 

[cHodAX]

However in the case that sparked it she should have advertised that fact and confirmed it at the booking time - turning people away at the door is a big no-no and the least she could have done would be to find them a room elsewhere and pay for it.

Totally agreed, turning people away at the door is plain wrong.

 

[Aoami]

Not letting someone into your home because of their sexuality is just wrong though. Perhaps you should have the right, but you'd be an absolute ****.

 

[chipper]

chodax its the usual PC brigade the media know itll make a good story so they trump it up sure some of the pc brigade will turn up here too they usually do.

personally im undecided about it can understand the point of view of both sides

me personally no i wouldnt want a gay couple in my B&B (if i ran one) but then again i wouldnt want chavs in it either theres quite a few stereotypes i wouldnt like in

but the fact is your running a buisness and that buisness is renting rooms all your doing is hurting your revenue and publicity and thats not good for buisness at all. im not religious so i dont have it hangin over me.

frankly if you feel it betrays your beliefs to allow a gay couple under your roof then you should be allowed to turn them away simply on the grounds of all the bullshit we currently get about respecting others beliefs 1 religion in particular.

i used to live at the coast and it was very popular with foreign students and there was a lot of B&B's who wouldnt take them in dont recall any of them gettin fines for this. some wont take kids etc.


just to clarify just cos i wouldnt want them in doesnt mean i wouldnt take them in. buisness is buisness

 

[Krazeh]

If someone wants to invite people into their home as genuine guests then sure they can pick and choose who stays. However as soon as they start running a business then they should be subject to teh same laws and restrictions as any other business, regardless if they're running that business from their home or a commercial property.

 

[Gumbo]

The only mistake she made was giving them a reason.

For what it's worth, I run a holiday business and by far the best guests are the gay male couples. They leave my boats as clean and tidy as they find them, and smelling delightful!. The butch lezza's on the other hand are the worst for leaving them a shithole.

I can refuse anyone a holiday on my boats if I don't want them to take them. Indeed I've done it before when I've thought that they would not take care of it properly. I had one fella drive into my car park waaay to fast, past families with kids, and then handbrake turn to a halt outside my office, march in and say I'm here to collect my boat. I asked who he was, told him he wasn't taking my boat out and he could expect a refund in the post. I didn't ask if he was gay or not.

 

[cHodAX]

Discrimination against stupid people! Someone call the broadsheets!

 

[Zenith.UK]

Nan used to run a christian guesthouse from her home from the 1950's through to the late 1980's and I know for a fact she would have reacted in exactly the same way as the couple in the article. The thing is that most christian guesthouses are prebooked through church contacts or by returning visitors. I vividly remember Nan referring to her guests as "brothers and sisters" and frequently by name.

This couple couldn't ask the guests if they were gay before they booked because that in itself is discriminatory, so the first they knew was when they turned up on the door. The commonsense approach would have been for the woman to politely decline (which she did apparently) and make arrangements for them to stay in another guesthouse in the local area.

I'm always telling my kids the rule.
My house. My rules.

 

[Furr]

I think that as it's a private house that has been opened up to provide a service that the owners beliefs should be allowed to determine who they want to serve based on sexuality but not on race.... This goes for refusing to serve for instance a 50yr old man turning up with some 18yr old girl and the like. If you don't like what they might be doing under your roof based on your belief's then so be it.

 

[ECA]

Would it be acceptable to decline a mixed race couple because it violated their personal beliefs?

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

There's quite a large number of BBC staff who are themselves gay - so you're looking at an organisation that has a weighting towards a particular stance on the subject.

How do I know this? I have a friend who worked at the BBC.

I have mixed feelings on the reported subject. I do not like the idea that people get discriminated against but I also don't like the idea that a person cannot choose who comes into their home. Because this hits some grey area, its difficult to come to a clear choice on the matter because its muddied.

Not having particularly thought about this type of instance before, my first thought is to lean towards the B & B owner clearly stating in advance what they will and won't accept. That forces their bigotry into the open and if they feel a need to hide that belief then its an indication that they need to question it.

 

[Furr]

Pretty sure none of the major religions have anything about that, but then I'm of the idea that a persons home is their own and the Government stops at the door. If a Christian/Jewish/Muslim B&B owners who are taught that homosexuality is a sin are forced to take in people who are against a fundamental belief in their religion isn't that also wrong? I'm not religious nor do I care about peoples sexual orientation personally but I do think that people shouldn't be forced to accept something they don't want to in their own homes.

 

[rynnor]

Would it be acceptable to decline a mixed race couple because it violated their personal beliefs?

Its obnoxious but I think the fundamental point is that the government should not be telling you who you can and cannot have in your own home.

Its too dangerous a precedent to allow - lets turn it around and say we have a hypothetical racist homophobic government in power.

I would not want to be told I couldnt have black or gay people in my house by the government.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

If you run a business you opt in to agree to business laws.

This includes sexual and racial discrimination, and anything else that goes along with it. So belief has NOTHING to do with this.

 

[cHodAX]

If you run a business you opt in to agree to business laws.

This includes sexual and racial discrimination, and anything else that goes along with it. So belief has NOTHING to do with this.

Opt in? Oh really? When did that come into force then? Must be a new addition to the statute books. Right along side the law that says you must allow known paedophiles to stay in your home as well. Is it really any different? You still have to discriminate either way but would the liberal media say you were wrong to discriminate againsts paedos? Not a chance.

Free country my arse, fucking nanny state that enforces it's virtues on the masses.

 

[Krazeh]

Opt in? Oh really? When did that come into force then? Must be a new addition to the statute books. Right along side the law that says you must allow known paedophiles to stay in your home as well. Is it really any different? You still have to discriminate either way but would the liberal media say you were wrong to discriminate againsts paedos? Not a chance.

Free country my arse, fucking nanny state that enforces it's virtues on the masses.

In most cases i'm very much against most of the actions taken by the Government and it's pursuit of the nanny state but in this scenario I have absolutely no sympathy for the MP involved. If people want to run a business offering services to the public, whether it be from their own home or commercial premises, then they are required to comply with legislation that makes it illegal for them to discriminate against people based on thier race, religion, sexuality etc. If people want to bigots then fine, they either stop running their business or they keep their bigotted views to themselves and comply with the law.

 

[Turamber]

But a B&B is different from a business establishment - it is the persons own home. The law should recognise that there is a difference else you can expect B&B's to close down by the dozen all over the UK, forcing people to stay in hotels with the subsequent increase in cost.

Where the B&B owner went wrong was in telling the truth to the people. She'd have been much better off saying that they were full, that there had been some confusion over the booking. Much too honest!

 

[Krazeh]

But a B&B is different from a business establishment - it is the persons own home.

So? And i'd argue it's different anyway, once you decide to run a business from your home then it becomes a business establishment.

The law should recognise that there is a difference else you can expect B&B's to close down by the dozen all over the UK, forcing people to stay in hotels with the subsequent increase in cost.

Why should it? If you're offering goods and services to the public then you should be subject to the same laws as anyone else doing the same. Either everyone is allowed to base their business policies on their bigotted views or noone is. If B&B owners don't feel they can continue to make a living out of charging members of the public if they are no longer able to discriminate based on their own bigotry then tough luck.

 

[Turamber]

Heh, somebody has their panties in a twist. I have a great deal of sympathy for B&B owners. Most of them, or at least the ones I've come across, have been retired people living in seaside resorts who open up their homes to help defray the costs of running their homes.

Yet the Government introduces more and more legislation each year which most B&B owners will struggle to stay on top of.

Relevance of Anti-Discrimination Laws - Start A Bed And Breakfast (UK)

Interestingly this link seems to indicate that the law does indeed treat B&B owners as regular businesses. But then the law is an ass. Which, in this particular case, does seem appropriate.

 

[yaruar]

You run a business and make money off it you comply with the law.

You don't like the law either go into another business or try to get the law changed.

People can keep their bigoted views if they so wish, but should not be allowed to profit from them in a civilised modern society.

 

[Turamber]

People can keep their bigoted views if they so wish, but should not be allowed to profit from them in a civilised modern society.

How do they profit from them if they are turning away business? :lol:

 

[yaruar]

How do they profit from them if they are turning away business? :lol:

They're still allowed to run as a business, if they do not abide by the rules they should be shut down.

To change a previous statement in the thread.

Our country, our rules.

 

[mooSe_]

If you don't like certain types of people staying in your house then in my opinion you shouldn't be opening up rooms in your house for members of the public to stay in.

 

[Turamber]

Sorry, but that is very simplistic.

 

[Krazeh]

Sorry, but that is very simplistic.

Why is it? Why should you be able to run a business based on your bigoted views when other businesses have to comply with the law? If you want to use your home to provide services to members of the public and as a means to make money then you need to comply with the law in the same way as any other business.