To crazymuppet

[Jimli]

Originally posted by old.CrazyMuppet
Hiya Jimli

Well, that's not true . You are overlooking a number of things... not in the least that spellcrafted AF102 stuff will be better than epic armor. I am already getting orders for 99% AF102 plate armor... and those people are the smart people, cos they will have a set waiting for them when SC is in... unlike the people that will start asking too late and end up on the waiting list.

At first I want to say I am comparing the amount of armour orders to the amount of weaponcraft orders. From that point of view armour and tailoring are pretty dead.

Current patch is capped at af100. Epic armour is 100% qual af 100. so 99% qual af102 (effictive af being 0.99 x af100 due to cap) is NOT better then epic.

1.52 will raise this and the dps cap of someone with RR5 to dps 16.5 and af 102. Now i dont know the exact formula for AF but I think it will be the same as with weapons. A 99% 16.5 does do more damage then a 100% 16.2 but if that few points of AF is worth 6 slots of stats? Prolly not. People will most likely just replace the parts of epic armour that contain useless stats to them

When 1.54 gets here the spellcrafters and alchemists will need to skill to 1000+ first. During that time I will expect armour demands to pick up and after the 1st spellcrafted items are available you will really understand why I consider it dead now

Oh, and as a high level weaponcrafter I got to know the other crafters quite well so there wont be much of a waiting list for me.

Btw a small tip. If people want af102 when sc/alc finally gets here you could let them turn in their epic armour. Salvage rates are pretty good i heard so that will take a large bite out of the cost of a full af102 set.

Still think i'm overlooking things?

 

[old.CrazyMuppet]

Originally posted by Jimli


At first I want to say I am comparing the amount of armour orders to the amount of weaponcraft orders. From that point of view armour and tailoring are pretty dead.

That is true, but subjective... when you compare the orders for weapons vs armor, yes it's a LOT less... but i'm not complaining about that. Our realm's primary weaponcrafter has a burnout, and i'm not looking to join her.

Also, as far as tailoring goes: for each order of armor, there's an order for a tailor (except studded stuff)

Current patch is capped at af100. Epic armour is 100% qual af 100. so 99% qual af102 (effictive af being 0.99 x af100 due to cap) is NOT better then epic.

The effective armorfactor of an epic piece is 151, 99% AF102 stuff has an effective AF of 150. so indeed, that's one point less when < RR5... but that's the 'naked' armor without the soon to be added SC, and let's not forget alchemy. you can have reactive procs on pieces of armor AND have charges on all of them. Those are very clear advantages over epic.

1.52 will raise this and the dps cap of someone with RR5 to dps 16.5 and af 102. Now i dont know the exact formula for AF but I think it will be the same as with weapons. A 99% 16.5 does do more damage then a 100% 16.2 but if that few points of AF is worth 6 slots of stats? Prolly not. People will most likely just replace the parts of epic armour that contain useless stats to them

If half of all epic-wearing people ask me to make 1 piece of armor i will be just as busy as the high-end weaponcrafter.

When 1.54 gets here the spellcrafters and alchemists will need to skill to 1000+ first. During that time I will expect armour demands to pick up and after the 1st spellcrafted items are available you will really understand why I consider it dead now

Close, but no cigar

To imbue a 16.5 weapon or AF102 armor you need 640 SC to imbue a maximum of 32 imbue points on 100% quality items.

Only reason to go 1000+ is overcharging. But do you wanna risk losing the AF102 99-100% hauberk you bought for 2 plats?

Oh, and as a high level weaponcrafter I got to know the other crafters quite well so there wont be much of a waiting list for me.

Nice feeling isnt it?

Btw a small tip. If people want af102 when sc/alc finally gets here you could let them turn in their epic armour. Salvage rates are pretty good i heard so that will take a large bite out of the cost of a full af102 set.

Yes i know about that middie that salvaged his epic suit... you get a lot for it, but it's a very painful thing to see your epic armor transformed into some arcanium metal.

I know i will keep my epic suit, although i will be wearing my own crafted suit... never salvage epic armor... the cash can be farmed easily, epic armor will never come back...

Still think i'm overlooking things?

Yes

Mythic is finally fulfilling their promise to crafters: to make the best stuff in the game.

Epic armor will be inferior to finely crafted armor, even at lower ranks than RR5. AF102 99% armor may have 1 point of EAF less when below RR5 but don't underestimate the power of SC when it comes out.

Epic armors ONLY have stat buffs and resist buffs (as far as i know (armsman epic doesnt have skill stuff)), and on most of the epics they are all wrong, far from optimal. BUT for +skill points you have to rely on your jewelry and cloak.

Imagine all your useful skills having +11 due to your armor having the right skills imbued.

Imagine the horror Hibbie casters will endure when all mid/alb tanks have maxed their resists on Heat, Energy and Spirit, also due to smart imbueing of armor.

Then, imagine having a melee fight with an armsman who has imbued 3 armor pieces with reactive proc Ablative aura (takes half damage for a fixed amount of time) and 3 pieces with the reactive heal proc (self heal for a fixed amount of time).

So, summarizing:

When SC and alchemy hit the servers, 99% AF102 armor has a total amount of 6AF less than epic armor when you're < RR5 and 6AF more when > RR5. You can cap your resist, your skills, and the important stats, and finally create the 'perfect' character for you.

The only downside is the cash needed to get a full set of 99%. That's why it's useful to already start gathering them early on, before the big rush.

BTW: i like this discussion . I'm eager to hear your response and other people's opinions.

 

[Jiggs]

blimey, glad i wear leather

 

[starblade]

Djeez, .... I'll leave the techy talk to you 2 and quietly continue my struggle to, well, eventually 1000+ I hope.

Think Methos had loads of reading time tho from the looks of his answer so I better stock up on literature

 

[osy]

they both done their homeworks allright

 

[kinadold]

I am 45 dex above my cap wirh epic studded and has tons
of spirit resist.

But vital stats like hp, quick, resist against assasins is badly placed.

For most scouts there is no way than to use spellcrafted. It aint the af, but the fact that Mythic did make such bad choices making the epic set.

 

[Jimli]

Re: Re: To crazymuppet

Originally posted by old.CrazyMuppet


That is true, but subjective... when you compare the orders for weapons vs armor, yes it's a LOT less... but i'm not complaining about that. Our realm's primary weaponcrafter has a burnout, and i'm not looking to join her.

Also, as far as tailoring goes: for each order of armor, there's an order for a tailor (except studded stuff)

Good point about the burnout. Though the armourcrafter who has sat next to me became quite depressed when he witnessed all the sends he saw coming in for weapons.

The effective armorfactor of an epic piece is 151, 99% AF102 stuff has an effective AF of 150. so indeed, that's one point less when < RR5... but that's the 'naked' armor without the soon to be added SC, and let's not forget alchemy. you can have reactive procs on pieces of armor AND have charges on all of them. Those are very clear advantages over epic.

Yes, but my point is that with the current and coming 2 patches(1.52 and 1.53) epic armour still has large advantages over crafted. 1.54 is still months away.

If half of all epic-wearing people ask me to make 1 piece of armor i will be just as busy as the high-end weaponcrafter.

Albion? Perhaps. Midgard? No.

1. Some epic wearers wear leather. Not your skill. They do use weapons.
2. Most midgardians use both 1h and 2h so that would mean all would have 2 replace 2 pieces of epic armour
3. Zerkers use 3 weapons. 2 1h and a 2h.
4. Sb's use a minimum of 3 weapons. Usually more (lower quality i admit) to use more poisons.

Close, but no cigar

To imbue a 16.5 weapon or AF102 armor you need 640 SC to imbue a maximum of 32 imbue points on 100% quality items.

Only reason to go 1000+ is overcharging. But do you wanna risk losing the AF102 99-100% hauberk you bought for 2 plats?

Lets discuss this again with the final release notes of 1.54 shall we.

Nice feeling isnt it?

It sure is

Yes i know about that middie that salvaged his epic suit... you get a lot for it, but it's a very painful thing to see your epic armor transformed into some arcanium metal.

I know i will keep my epic suit, although i will be wearing my own crafted suit... never salvage epic armor... the cash can be farmed easily, epic armor will never come back...

Since I will be able to afford it I will also be keeping my epic. But I can imagine people are not so attached to it and hate moneyfarming.

Yes

I'm still thinking no

Mythic is finally fulfilling their promise to crafters: to make the best stuff in the game.

Hope so, you never know what kind of drops they put in as a solution that some people are too lazy to moneyfarm

Epic armor will be inferior to finely crafted armor, even at lower ranks than RR5. AF102 99% armor may have 1 point of EAF less when below RR5 but don't underestimate the power of SC when it comes out.

Agree and I dont underestimate it but I also don't overestimate it

Epic armors ONLY have stat buffs and resist buffs (as far as i know (armsman epic doesnt have skill stuff)), and on most of the epics they are all wrong, far from optimal. BUT for +skill points you have to rely on your jewelry and cloak.

Imagine all your useful skills having +11 due to your armor having the right skills imbued.

Been thinking of that since day 1. Not even going drophunting with my level 50 warrior. Doing orders and leveling alts till SC/Alc gets in

Imagine the horror Hibbie casters will endure when all mid/alb tanks have maxed their resists on Heat, Energy and Spirit, also due to smart imbueing of armor.

I can feel a resist nerf from mythic coming up here

Then, imagine having a melee fight with an armsman who has imbued 3 armor pieces with reactive proc Ablative aura (takes half damage for a fixed amount of time) and 3 pieces with the reactive heal proc (self heal for a fixed amount of time).

To bad that the Mid warrior you're meleeing with has the same

So, summarizing:

When SC and alchemy hit the servers, 99% AF102 armor has a total amount of 6AF less than epic armor when you're < RR5 and 6AF more when > RR5. You can cap your resist, your skills, and the important stats, and finally create the 'perfect' character for you.

The only downside is the cash needed to get a full set of 99%. That's why it's useful to already start gathering them early on, before the big rush.

Some US servers are suffering from too much cash around thanks to DF seal farming

Summarizing, the people with high realmranks at the moment will probably also be the most prepared for this and be the first with spellcrafted items. Combined with the RA's they have they will be able to do astonishing things in the frontiers for a while. Then the general population will also have the same stuff and all will return to current situations with the exception that there are now 2 levels in the frontiers and that this will become 4. No sc/alc no RA. With RA no sc/alc. With sc/alc no RA. With both.

The end result will then just be a couple of filthy rich crafters
Since I'm one of them I don't have a problem with that

BTW: i like this discussion . I'm eager to hear your response and other people's opinions.

Yes, nice to see that it is possible to have an intelligent discussion on this forums

Hmm, this might well become the longest thread with the fewest post if we keep this up