The way of the wa[rrior|nker]

[CstasY]

Gahn grow a brain and fuck off.

 

[Aragyn]

Getting nuked/shoot inside a tower aint something new here ...for example last night at bolg got shoot by Simosh 2-3 times after i got inside and happend with other scouts aswell ...nuked 2-3 times by X sorc after i got inside tower .....

Ps not accusing any1 for some kinda bug abuse ...its just happends all the time ...guess its from lag

Yeah, thats because after an arrow is released there is no LoS check on impact, only on release, when it happens with casting that sometimes has to do with lag or just the split second when you zone. What I was talking about though was the no LoS check on shrooms after they start casting, other castingtypes/arrows have this.

 

[Puppet]

Yeah, thats because after an arrow is released there is no LoS check on impact, only on release, when it happens with casting that sometimes has to do with lag or just the split second when you zone. What I was talking about though was the no LoS check on shrooms after they start casting, other castingtypes/arrows have this.

Not really. All players have indeed a 2nd LoS-check; but none of the other pets has it. Neither do theurg FnF elementals btw.

A cabby pet will finish his nuke once he started; you could be in Tokyo and it still lands. Same for a necro-pet, theurg ice-elemental etc etc etc.

An animist shroom is no different to those regarding their LoS-check; EXCEPT there's mostly more then 1 locking on to you so you take abit more damage when u quickly pop into LoS.

Ironically there's 1 spell which has no LoS-check at all on a pet, and its the amber simulacrum stun-proc/effect. They stun through walls/doors, whatever up to iirc 700-1000 range.

 

[Sycho]

Even as much as i hate animist los bug, it is VERY hard to fix....look at the daoc engine, it has so many flaws compared to a fps game like half life 2, the buildings are solid in it, you can't shoot through them ever but in daoc you can with certain things so it will never get fixed probably unless they changed the entire gfx engine completely.I be very surprised if it does get fixed with such a mediocre game engine compared to games out now.

Yes i know it wasn't through a wall in that screenshot but it's still within the structure of the building, it's very near it and it never happens in open does it or has anyone seen it happen on an open field?

 

[Sharkith]

Nobody is blaming the actual animists really, its mythic and the unbelievably fucked up code. I cannot get my head around how something can be so broken for so long, and nothing is ever done about it.

I know mate but I can't figure it out from the images.

Remember I ain't ever played any other realm (being a relative noob) so I have not got a foggiest notion whats the issue with the pics. LOS is bolloxed at times in the game for example in the second picture I have had similar issues with the front of towers where I could not rezz people. So it doesn't seem to be a shroom only thing.

As for the first picture Manisch provided I thought it looked like he had hit f8 and somehow the auto targetting had picked a different shroom to the one right in front of him. The reason I say it is because clearly the one right in front is not being targetted. It might well be that the auto targeting has picked up one of the shrooms inside the tower against the wall (if there is one - in a situation like this there will be one) in which case it is a pain in the ass. But not being able to target it is not the issue. The issue is with the auto function of f8 and a lag through the wall or something silly like that.

What I am mystified is why he thinks it is purposeful bug abuse? The animist would have no clue this is going on. If you cast aggro shrooms you very seldom know what the hell goes on with them because you don't control them.

So not saying there is no bug I am just trying to understand the gripe.

Sharkith

edit I can see one just around the corner that might be hitting Mansic but he cannot hit back - if thats the case it must be a shitty bug - but it affects everyone because sometimes you cannot rezz or sometimes ou cannot target in similar situations. I think why you guys feel it more is because animist spam turrets all over the place and so the probability is higher that you will feel it with respect to shrooms.... so not shrooms bugged just a bugged game that makes animists seem the particular problem area in general?

 

[Sharkith]

Even as much as i hate animist los bug, it is VERY hard to fix....look at the daoc engine, it has so many flaws compared to a fps game like half life 2, the buildings are solid in it, you can't shoot through them ever but in daoc you can with certain things so it will never get fixed probably unless they changed the entire gfx engine completely.I be very surprised if it does get fixed with such a mediocre game engine compared to games out now.

Yes i know it wasn't through a wall in that screenshot but it's still within the structure of the building, it's very near it and it never happens in open does it or has anyone seen it happen on an open field?

To be honest I think this is the real issue - something to do with the vector graphics engine and gaps in the outlines. Half life 2 (just spent a couple of hours playing it - have aheadache though I think my card updates too fast ) is very solid in comparison - and I would agree gfx would probably be able to avoid this issue relatively easily. The problem is that half of the customer base of DaoC are on minimum spec as it stands and so they might not be able to improve for some time... if ever....

 

[Aragyn]

Not really. All players have indeed a 2nd LoS-check; but none of the other pets has it. Neither do theurg FnF elementals btw.

A cabby pet will finish his nuke once he started; you could be in Tokyo and it still lands. Same for a necro-pet, theurg ice-elemental etc etc etc.

An animist shroom is no different to those regarding their LoS-check; EXCEPT there's mostly more then 1 locking on to you so you take abit more damage when u quickly pop into LoS.

Ironically there's 1 spell which has no LoS-check at all on a pet, and its the amber simulacrum stun-proc/effect. They stun through walls/doors, whatever up to iirc 700-1000 range.

Yeah, I mean players and not pets when I said that about LoS check, sorry for not making that clear.

 

[Zede]

Have Mythic ever actually, ever commented over the shroom LoS issues ?


something like " yes we have looked into it, but due to our graphics engine being developed in the 90s, it cannot cope"

or are we just left totally in the dark to whine and get fustrated with no feedback ?

 

[Sycho]

Have Mythic ever actually, ever commented over the shroom LoS issues ?


something like " yes we have looked into it, but due to our graphics engine being developed in the 90s, it cannot cope"

or are we just left totally in the dark to whine and get fustrated with no feedback ?

I am sure they know about it, but they realise they can't fix it because:

-They may lose customers if they did change engine=higher spec pc.
-It costs a lot of money for them to do so.
-The only way they could solve it i guess is to completely re-design the keeps in NF or towers or remove mushrooms for the class and add something else.

Mythic should of knew about it in the first place, people testing the game in the U.S obviously didn't do good enough job or they probably would of never gave animists those mushrooms.But then again in old frontiers it wasn't so much of an issue as badly as now.

 

[Puppet]

Have Mythic ever actually, ever commented over the shroom LoS issues ?


something like " yes we have looked into it, but due to our graphics engine being developed in the 90s, it cannot cope"

or are we just left totally in the dark to whine and get fustrated with no feedback ?

Not more not less then 'LOS issues are always being investigated and if possible resolved'.

No specific information about shrooms or something either. Anyhow think you shouldnt push for an animist-nerf, as it will NEVER happen considering animist has been nerfed into oblivion already, without giving a proper solution.

The solution lies in fixing the LoS-issues around keeps involving the placement of animist-turrets. Nerfing a class with 75% the nuke-capacity of a sorc/caba and 60% the UTILITY of a wizard useable in a keep is simply not the solution.

Just to turn the issue around: What do you think wizards would say when Mythic announced 'sorry we cant fix it properly; therefore we disable spec-nukes from a wizard entirely in a keep and you can only bolt up to 150 units above your character. Thats basically abit like what happened to animists in NF with shrooms.

I know animists are a pain in the ass in keepfights; but fix the LOS-bug and its suddenly alot more bearable. Also dont forget the animist-class should shine in keepfights by design - same with firewizzies

 

[Sharkith]

so am I right thinking that the Los issue is a general thing that appears more with animists because they have spam turrets ? Or is it just a single class issue?

 

[Straef]

Sounds like time for Daoc 2 to me!

 

[sneakies]

Okay; can someone explain to me what im not seeing? Cause i can't see any problems in either of them screenshots (not just saying that; i seriously can't see one problem (admittedly; in one thats nice bug abuse hiding behind a warp to put your self out of LOS (similar to dropping a bag of loot)).

That would at least explain why you couldn't target the shrooms in front of your face; (http://www.pauleh.nildram.co.uk/doodah.jpg <-- thats the same bug as you get in exp'ing though - shot taken January 5th (and still present)).

And in the other where the shrooms are placed in front of the door - in clear line of sight; well i not got a clue why you cant target them (if thats what the wajn is about). Certainly doesn't look purposeful; and as i said - it does look as though that are in a perfectly nukeable spot.


Any who's; as said before manisch; try putting as much effort into playing; as you do to your daily whining

 

[Septina]

Anyone saying the animists are shrooming the shrooms at a certain place to get bugged shrooms on purpose is a moron and needs to be slapped silly irl.

The bug however occurs at almost all places over a keep and is HIGHLY annoying and will ofc lead to ppl whining about being killed by (almost) unkillable shrooms.

For example:
Animist shrooms lots of shrooms from on top of the keep at the gate to make it harder for the ppl in the rams etc to break down the door.
This wouldnt be much of a problem if you actually could kill/cc/whatever the shrooms, BUT, in 99% of the places where you stand (even ontop of the damn shrooms) you will get 'Your target is not in view' which results in unkillable shrooms

So, 4 - 5 animists spamming shrooms at the gate will lead to an almost untakeable keep, which isnt really fun and you must see how people can whine at this bug?

Fixing this bug surely isnt easy, but all you hibs must realise how annoying this must be and why the albs/mids are whining?

 

[sneakies]

Anyone saying the animists are shrooming the shrooms at a certain place to get bugged shrooms on purpose is a moron and needs to be slapped silly irl.

The bug however occurs at almost all places over a keep and is HIGHLY annoying and will ofc lead to ppl whining about being killed by (almost) unkillable shrooms.

For example:
Animist shrooms lots of shrooms from on top of the keep at the gate to make it harder for the ppl in the rams etc to break down the door.
This wouldnt be much of a problem if you actually could kill/cc/whatever the shrooms, BUT, in 99% of the places where you stand (even ontop of the damn shrooms) you will get 'Your target is not in view' which results in unkillable shrooms

So, 4 - 5 animists spamming shrooms at the gate will lead to an almost untakeable keep, which isnt really fun and you must see how people can whine at this bug?

Fixing this bug surely isnt easy, but all you hibs must realise how annoying this must be and why the albs/mids are whining?

Well i had no idea about the shrooms near the door being un-targettable (i see no logical reason for a LOS bug to occur in that situation either). But if thats the case (i only play a bard on hib/pryd so i dont know) then yea - i agree that it would suck.

Arguably though; i wouldn't have thought that its purposely done - its not exactly getting them into the oil spot; its placing them on the floor; outside of the tower - in view (or not according to the game code)

 

[Septina]

Well i had no idea about the shrooms near the door being un-targettable (i see no logical reason for a LOS bug to occur in that situation either). But if thats the case (i only play a bard on hib/pryd so i dont know) then yea - i agree that it would suck.

Arguably though; i wouldn't have thought that its purposely done - its not exactly getting them into the oil spot; its placing them on the floor; outside of the tower - in view (or not according to the game code)

Yea, in keeps... the LOS is fucked beyond belief when it comes to shrooms, you can basically put a shroom anywhere in the keep and it most likely will get the LOS bug that people are talking about.
Its highly annoying but hardly bugabuse that some ppl try and make it out to be

 

[Zede]

Anyone saying the animists are shrooming the shrooms at a certain place to get bugged shrooms on purpose is a moron and needs to be slapped silly irl.

The bug however occurs at almost all places over a keep and is HIGHLY annoying and will ofc lead to ppl whining about being killed by (almost) unkillable shrooms.

For example:
Animist shrooms lots of shrooms from on top of the keep at the gate to make it harder for the ppl in the rams etc to break down the door.
This wouldnt be much of a problem if you actually could kill/cc/whatever the shrooms, BUT, in 99% of the places where you stand (even ontop of the damn shrooms) you will get 'Your target is not in view' which results in unkillable shrooms

So, 4 - 5 animists spamming shrooms at the gate will lead to an almost untakeable keep, which isnt really fun and you must see how people can whine at this bug?

Fixing this bug surely isnt easy, but all you hibs must realise how annoying this must be and why the albs/mids are whining?

well, the voice of reason I guess. I'll shut up now

 

[Sharkith]

Anyone saying the animists are shrooming the shrooms at a certain place to get bugged shrooms on purpose is a moron and needs to be slapped silly irl.

The bug however occurs at almost all places over a keep and is HIGHLY annoying and will ofc lead to ppl whining about being killed by (almost) unkillable shrooms.

For example:
Animist shrooms lots of shrooms from on top of the keep at the gate to make it harder for the ppl in the rams etc to break down the door.
This wouldnt be much of a problem if you actually could kill/cc/whatever the shrooms, BUT, in 99% of the places where you stand (even ontop of the damn shrooms) you will get 'Your target is not in view' which results in unkillable shrooms

So, 4 - 5 animists spamming shrooms at the gate will lead to an almost untakeable keep, which isnt really fun and you must see how people can whine at this bug?

Fixing this bug surely isnt easy, but all you hibs must realise how annoying this must be and why the albs/mids are whining?

Like anyone in their right mind I would like to see this sort of thing fixed. The problem is clearly related to the graphics associated with shroom stacks and this is also related to the fact that you can lag strafe through people. I have an animist at level 44 at the moment for PvE farming. If you drop 14 shrooms they fall on top of each other that would most likely cause this issue. So a whole shroom stack might not be targetable from range.

AOE attacks however would still hit them hard?

As for the pictures Septina and Sneakies - ty for the explanation I get it now. The loot that is in the picture probably came off an npc guard a lot of them were pulled from Blog before the Albs had us under the kosh. Not intentional as the initial post in this thread seemed to indicate (can't read it now) but definitely annoying. However we all get similar issues it can be even worse when your trying to heal or rezz someone who is not in your group and loads of people/rams get in the way etc.... so no doubt you guys feel it more and that is actually a pity.

It is without doubt the outdated graphics engine and yes it might mean that only DaoC 2 could fix it. However I guess Mythic is not likely to ever invest that much in the game ever again. Maybe we are now seeing its very real limits and of course the beginning of the end of its lifespan?



Sharkith

 

[Samaroon EatsCheese]

Okay; can someone explain to me what im not seeing? Cause i can't see any problems in either of them screenshots (not just saying that; i seriously can't see one problem (admittedly; in one thats nice bug abuse hiding behind a warp to put your self out of LOS (similar to dropping a bag of loot)).

That would at least explain why you couldn't target the shrooms in front of your face; (http://www.pauleh.nildram.co.uk/doodah.jpg <-- thats the same bug as you get in exp'ing though - shot taken January 5th (and still present)).

And in the other where the shrooms are placed in front of the door - in clear line of sight; well i not got a clue why you cant target them (if thats what the wajn is about). Certainly doesn't look purposeful; and as i said - it does look as though that are in a perfectly nukeable spot.


Any who's; as said before manisch; try putting as much effort into playing; as you do to your daily whining

roll an elph next time!

 

[Inso]

I thought this was a whinepost about warriors... Was like WTF?!

 

[Sharkith]

jep answer is easy /ignore Manisch Depressiv then you can like rest easy you won't have to listen to dickheads like that again.....