The financial downturn and "substance" use

[Scouse]

So, I'm hearing increasing amounts of stories that big firms are beginning to step up their drug and alcohol testing policies and may be using these as a handy tool to get shot of staff numbers rather than taking the financial hit of redundancies.

Makes sense (from a corporate point of view). If you can kick a number of staff out of the door for a supposedly legitimate reason (for example, marajuana use) then you'll save on your bottom line.

Is anyone else seeing this? I've not worked in so long that it doesn't affect me but I've friends (especially in the construction industry) that tell me that this sort of corporate behaviour is picking up pace rather drastically in recent months...

 

[Damini]

That's interesting. I can't say I blame them for taking this stance - if you can find a way to skip redunancy packages, then obviously they are going to take it.

I went into Land of Leather the other day - its been in administration since Jan 12th. They're still selling settees, BUT simultaneously phoning people to say they won't get their settee or the deposit back. This recession is going to pull some pretty dirty tricks out of the bag.

 

[Chilly]

Nice tactic (for shareholders).

 

[`mongoose]

So, I'm hearing increasing amounts of stories that big firms are beginning to step up their drug and alcohol testing policies and may be using these as a handy tool to get shot of staff numbers rather than taking the financial hit of redundancies.

Makes sense (from a corporate point of view). If you can kick a number of staff out of the door for a supposedly legitimate reason (for example, marajuana use) then you'll save on your bottom line.

Is anyone else seeing this? I've not worked in so long that it doesn't affect me but I've friends (especially in the construction industry) that tell me that this sort of corporate behaviour is picking up pace rather drastically in recent months...

Depends on the terms of reference I guess

If people are drinking or using at work then Duh! Cya.

If people are being picked up for a heavy sesh the night before and booted then I think the firms are on very dodgy ground.

In all fairness they'll get away with as long as people let them get away with it. I'm not sure whether it's legal or not. It's whether they can call it gross misconduct or not at the end of the day.


I do know alot of blue chip companies just fire people because they know 90% won't bother taking them to court and the pittance they pay in fines/judgements each year don't come close to wiping out the benefits of the practice.

M

 

[Scouse]

I can't say I blame them for taking this stance - if you can find a way to skip redunancy packages, then obviously they are going to take it.

From a purely economic standpoint it makes sense but from a corporate governance standpoint I find it abhorrent.

It enables the sacking of people for reasons other than job-performance related ones. Even the proverbial "trip to Amsterdam" could mean you find yourself with no income (and all the bad things that are associated) - and all completely unrelated to how you are performing in your job.

I bet there's a huge rise in sales of those "detox" kits that are around on the web. No idea if they're any use tho...

 

[Chilly]

Ah but maybe it is job-affecting. he boys in the market operations team where I work (they manage live betting markets for games, races, elections, whatnot) have to be 100% on the ball and are heavily discouraged from going on benders on school nights (be it a friday or a wednesday - its a school night if they are workin the next day, we are 24x7). Theres actually a study correlating benders night before vs error rate next day and its clear enough that it could be used in anger, imo.

 

[Trem]

Thank fuck I don't get drug tested at work, my boss (Samm) would batter me

 

[old.Tohtori]

From a business perspective, it's a clever move and the guy who thought of it should get a pat on the back.

From a personal "every man" perspective, it's f*cked up and the guy who thought of it should get a...well...swaffle from TdC.

 

[Macey]

In all fairness they'll get away with as long as people let them get away with it. I'm not sure whether it's legal or not. It's whether they can call it gross misconduct or not at the end of the day.


M

Thats always the problem tbh. Whilst I imagine there would probably be a fairly strong claim for wrongful dismissal/invasion of privacy if it was out of work hours, anyone who has been sacked from a job for such a reason will be unlikely to be willing to foot the legal bill to take a claim like that to court, the company will just drag it out forever with some bollocks procedure and the claim will just magically disappear.

 

[old.user4556]

Haven't heard about this, but I know of plenty of "exotic" drug usages amongst young IT contractors.

 

[mr.Blacky]

in all fairness I wouldnt know any employer that would approve of drug use.

That they now apply the rules stricter is not really a big surprise now is it?
a lot of companies are doing worse and wouldnt really want stupid avoidable mistakes.

 

[Yoni]

Although I can understand, why do I feel it is an infringement of human rights and where does it stop...

Will people be allowed the same amount to drink as if you are driving the next day? Will they start testing us for the amount of sugar in our bodies or caffeine because I have a crazy reaction to both?

Will they start to dictate to us what we can do in our own time, for example no dangerous sports in case we have an accident and can't come to work, or that we have to be in bed by a certain time, or how and when we can have our children.

As we are all aware taking "exotic" drugs in the UK is illegal so anyone completely off their tits repeatedly deserves to lose their job, the same goes for if you are repeatedly drunk at work (although not illegal it is usually in your contract).... but testing? Are managers so unaware of their staff that they can not tell the difference?

 

[Carbon60]

The company I work for has just implemented a stop and search policy which I was forced to sign. However, the evil people running the place have never needed an excuse to sack people. They've used 'compromise payments and being escorted off the premises' tactic over the last few years to avoid redundancies. Someone I know refused their compromise payment so they doubled it.

I've heard there is some drug use within certain departments but I've never heard of anyone being sacked for it.

 

[Zenith.UK]

I used to work for a medical diagnostics company making blood and urine tests for hospitals. All I can say is that I would challenge any adverse result because I know how the tests work.

I was seeing a girl from work for a while, and she was a smoker. FYI I'm a total non-smoker. One of the tests that we made was for cotinine, a metabolite of nicotine and an indicator of smoking. I was asked if I could provide a urine sample for a negative as I was a known non-smoker. My result came out as equivalent to a regular smoker who had gone the day without a cig. It took a couple of days to work out why I'd come up as a positive.

My g/f had a smoke before coming to bed the night before. We'd had a session and I had soaked up some of HER nicotine from our "intimate contact".

These tests are so sensitive that you could register as a positive from SOMEONE ELSES use. Got a g/f with a coke habit even though you're clean yourself? It's possible you might absorb enough to register as positive yourself.

 

[soze]

My old company are doing this they have a 0 booze in your system policy as in drink the night before you can lose your job. They have recently stepped up piss testing and i know 2 guys who think they are 7 days away (test time) from getting the sack. They signed the contract though so i suppose its a easy way of triming numbers.

 

[Aoami]

Do people not join Unions anymore?

 

[Zenith.UK]

My work don't recognise unions, but it doesn't stop me being in one (Unite).
If push came to shove and I had one of "those" meetings, I would have my regional union rep as my chaperone.
And there's nothing the company can do about it... it's in the grievance procedure that you can bring someone with you.

 

[Aoami]

Your union should be able to lodge a grievance for you if you ask them, there's no work in lodging a claim against an employer really. Don't even have to go to the tribunal yourself.

 

[Rubber Bullets]

I have a friend who works for Honda in Swindon who are having very well publicised problems. Apparently quite a lot of people have accepted redundancy packages worth 10-12k though clearly some of these people a clearly very stupid. One, the day before leaving, told his boss in very colourful language exactly what he thought of him, and was dismissed on the spot.

Even more stupid was te guy who simply refused to pay for his meal on his last day, he even used the words 'what are you going to do, sack me?' Can you imagine what he said to the wife when he got home 12k less well off than she was expecting?

RB