The Age of (Lost) Innocence

[Kalthorine]

Just out of interest (7337-ness check), I was wondering if anyone, in their hunt for the various Master Levels, actually take time to read the stories behind them. Somehow, being the friendly cynic I am, I doubt it - which is a shame, because Mythic clearly

This isn't a whine about the effect ToA has had on the game (although god knows it could be if I wanted it to), more a sad reflection on our own shortcomings as gamers. Graendel/Ilyena led an excellent Raid through the entire of ML4 battlegroup steps, and deserves high praise.

However, I still couldn't help feeling a little sad.

Why?

Because I would bet everything I own that:

For every 1 person thinking "Why would we need to defeat Seti in his temple? What is the secret of the Fortress of Storms" there would be 100 thinking "I hope the towns don't repop too quickly"

For every 1 person thinking "What are these mysterious crocodile statues doing in the desert, and what is the significance of these mysterious gems?" there would have been 100 thinking "Have I got time for a quick afk loo break while they sort those statues out"

For every 1 person thinking "Daehiem, your days of evil staining the Lands of Atum with your blood are OVER!" there would be 100 thinking "Hope I don't LD in this encounter coz there is a really long repop time on this guy"

And for every 1 person thinking "At last! Martikhoras is defeated! We are triumphant and evil is banished!" there would be 100 thinking "Nerf stoopid low /random 100 rolls 4 phat lewt"

Hehe... yes, I KNOW that the only real reason everyone does MLs (myself included, being a total hypocrite) is to try and keep up with their peers in remaining competitive in the game, but considering this is meant to be a Massive Multiplayer Online ROLEPLAYING game, am I the only one who thinks we have lost something here?

 

[civy]

Frim 1.71 patch notes.

NPC Speech Changes

To increase the level of communication between grouped and battlegrouped players, we have added the ability for other players to see what a NPC is saying to another player for certain master level encounters. The NPC's speech will appear to other players in the lower chat window in white.

Looks like mythic thought the same.

 

[Saggy]

Stories are made to help people with quest and stuff. However, way too slow patching -> tons of walkthroughs from Yanks makes stories useless (unless, ofc, you are interested in reading them ) and therefore kinda spoils the whole idea of PvE for euro-players.

 

[Amuse]

Stories are made to help people with quest and stuff. However, way too slow patching -> tons of walkthroughs from Yanks makes stories useless (unless, ofc, you are interested in reading them ) and therefore kinda spoils the whole idea of PvE for euro-players.

was aboute to say the same.

i used to do quests etc the hard way, read everything that all the NPCs told me (back in the old days, when i was lvl 20 and blody proud of it ), and tryed to figure oute what to do by my own.. but then some1 showed me a walktrough side.. i have hardly read any NPC text since that day

for me, this game is aboute the RvR, and i would rather use a walktrough to get there faster, than figuring it out myself these days.

 

[Roadie]

The fact that everything you do is reset to its origonal status after about an hour or so other than the change from ml3-4 on your own character makes any sence of achevement through the story element.

I see your point though, if people read the storys and things it would probably make it a bit more enjoyable, but it would make it a lot more time consuming as well.

Its not realy a shortcoming of the gamers the play single player games when they want a interactive story and if not read books . If anything its another sales pitch from mythic trying to make the game something that realy its not to prolong the playtime of the players.

 

[Talsar]

Hmm i think you have a point there... I have been on a few ml's myself, and when in the heat of the raid you get told not to click a certian npc etc, and you do anyway I think that curiousity gets the better of you.

It does seem a shame that we have (currently) lost the ability to get "involved" in the role playing of ML's.

However, as Civy's post indicates it will be corrected soon, which tbh is a patch well over due.

 

[Mairghead]

I think it will take more than overhearing more NPCs to imbue MLs with any lost sense of roleplaying. Above all it takes the willing contribution of those present on the raid.

Most Prydwen raids seem to be FFA, which is great - I think we should be looking to assist our realm mates in gaining things which will make our defence and offence stronger. However, when you take into account just how many people are required for some of these steps, especially ones like 4.2 or most of the later x.10 steps, then consider the contributions being made by that many representatives of the average MMORPG playerbase, then you can see how a consensus for roleplay is going to be difficult to achieve.

Even if you gloss over the usual folk who think that being a roleplayer means you're a sad-arsed gimp who doesn't care (or know) about the game itself and that you should therefore be flamed, pointed and laughed at whenever an opportunity arises, not everyone perceives roleplay to mean the same thing. It doesn't mean anybody is "wrong" or "right" in their approach, per se, but it does mean that the higher the number of participants, the more likely you are to see conflict over play styles - usually, but not necessarily, between those who are perceived to be "hard core" roleplayers and those who like to talk in numbers or text speak.

Another barrier to roleplay in master levels is the terribly precise strategies that are required to solve many of the encounters. If it matters how many people are standing in a room and where, or what styles they are using, or what messages they should be listening out for and reacting to etc...then most people will be thinking with their game mechanic head on and not their roleplay head.

The more complex an encounter and the more mistakes that can be made which wipe a raid or bollux the result, the more stressed and focused on game mechanics people get, the more important it is that everyone listens to raid instructions and focuses. People then just don't get the chance to relax and really think about their environment in anything but solid game mechanic terms. As Kalthorine says, you're not thinking about the lovely room you're in or what a lovely temple Seti has, you're worrying about whether you've pulled the boss out of the wall so that he drops loot etc.

I would have liked to have seen Master Levels achievable with two groups (any reasonably balanced two groups, not two uber optimised gank groups), so that most guilds or alliances could have a friendly and chatty attempt at all of them, as well as joining in larger FFA raids for the fun of it. It would have been even better if ML content had been designed so that there were a multiple of different, valid techniques to resolve each encounter...all achievable by that 2 groups WITHOUT pulling hair to ensure that certain classes are definitely there etc. (Just too sick of getting the right classes to ensure that 2.10 or 5.2 will work, for example. Nerf that bloody Duamutef!)
Lower spawn times for encounters would also take some of the stress out of the trials, making it more condusive to roleplay (of whatever sort)...and more inclusive for casual players, since it might just enable a greater number of smaller raids to take place at different times.

It's not only ToA that has this problem, though. Some of the big bosses in Sidi caused the same effects, as does the dragon on occasion.

 

[Oro]

I remember the first time I saw a crocodile statue's head move. I was gobsmacked. Ok, in graphical terms not a big deal. However, I was just ambling around, with Mairghead actually, and this thing moved for no apparent reason.
It was a long time later it all came together while on an ML raid as again, I didn't rush into MLs or anything.

I usually stay away from reading the spoilers and stuff just so I could enjoy the raids more. If leading of course, you don't have the luxury, but when I'm along as a grunt for the first time on a particular raid, I try to get the stories. Same with encounters, if I'm not being rushed through it by someone, but I'm a bit blase, and don't get to hung up

 

[Escape]

Mythic need to employ real script writers, if they expect people to read ~5 pages of background, followed by another verbose NPC and ending with final encounter of pointless text. It's too much to read for someone who only wants the reward.

The scrolls are a better idea, you can make the book and read the story... or not - It doesn't matter. All quests should be like this, with the encounter information and background story kept seperately. Now those interested in the background can read it and those who want to complete the encounter quickly, don't need to scrolll down pages of amatuer fantasy.