SM for the people

[old.Gromnir]

I know there are alot of sm out there in daoc, some are good at it some even do sm with albs and hibis - and then there are your normal sm with mobs.

But how to spec in sm do you go for bondage or do you go for pain or do you play nice to your slave and give if buffs.

What is need to make a good alb and hibi spanker and what is need for a good mob spanker?


ps. Ofcoures in the end some of it comes down to the toys you use.

 

[ImLestat]

I've now played my sm to the 23rd level. I got a tip to spec very high in darkness, and so I've done. At the moment I've got 20 in darkness, and the rest divided somewhat equal between the others. I can't say I regret my speccing at the moment. I'm able to nuke the mobs to hell and back, even the orange ones usually, although I usually have a high downtime when doing orange mobs.

Haven't tried rvr yet, will wait until I am 24 for that. The mez and roots will be quite handy there though.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Ooooh boy...

Mainly darkness. You can juggle the levels to suit but darkness is the kicker (in my opinion) no matter what way you want your SM to work.

Darkness gives you:

Direct Damage - Blast and Lifetap
PBAE Mez
Qui/Dex Debuffs
Resistance Debuffs

I find also that the Qui/Dex debuffs are the best when grouped because they allow the tanks usually to hit the mob first time, get agro faster and hit more often during the fight. I usually do str/con debuffs second because with a healer present the pressure is on to get the tanks hitting the mob but the damage to the tanks is taken care of. Over the course of a fight you want to limit the damage as much as possible but the str/con can wait (if needed at all, I often don't need to do this if the mob is going down fast enough).
Lifetaps do more damage than blasts (though not as pretty to look at) which is one of the main reason darkness gets specced by peeps wanting to RvR.

Suppression gives you shields but you get this anyway as you level. The only benefit of speccing this (so far) is the Str/Con debuffs, which, to be honest, you don't really miss too much. When the pbae nuke becomes available on the suppression based line then this might change but for now... not suppression.
The root you get anyway just by being an SM, so no need to spec for it.
The hitpoint transfer is good for emergencies in PvE but you'll rarely use it in RvR because the battles are so fast. I use the hitpoint transfer quite a bit to heal tanks after they been bashing keep doors and taken damage, while their sat back a bit from the keep recuperating, but this is the one of the few times I find it useful.

Speccing summoning is NOT group friendly. Most groups ask you to get rid of your pet as soon as you join. Very few SMs can tightly control their pet in pulls where more than one mob is inbound to the group and even if you can... they won't believe that you can (and you'll already have had moans about the xp leech) so all your points you put into summoning are usually wasted when you are grouped. If you intend to be Mr. Uber Solo then you can spec this but unless you're soloing your way to 50 this isn't the way to go. Spec to 23 if you want to be able to rez in a future patch. Again for the moment... not much use. Spec it up a little for a few of the basic pet buffs but don't take it too far.
In RvR no enemy is dumb enough to waste time on the pet and they always go for you (in large battles they can't always find you which is funny and your pet can rampage about until someone deals with it) so a buffed up pet isn't a whole lot of use many times - an unbuffed pet is often just as effective in RvR.

I'm not going to go into templates or numbers. The SM char works in a lot of different combos. I've gone for very high darkness (which I know is the most common way to do it) but I know peeps that have gone for an even spread, and some that have gone mainly summoning. They all work, just in different ways. In PvE, the SM is a group's wildcard and generalist. The lifetap and hitpoint transfer combo can save a group in a pinch if used right. In RvR the pbae mez is flypaper for stealthers coming through milegates - I love smoking them out with this.

Expect pain though. The SM works by being devious and not always going for direct damage so its often not very obvious what it does for a group. Most times you've poured everything into debuffing a mob and the tanks cream it they just assume it was an easy mob

Some bad news though: I found RvR was not viable til lvl35, and not a whole lot of fun before 45. That was before Battlegrounds though so you should have a better time. Remember that SMs are the backstabber nightmare. If you survive first stab, quickcast pbae mez and lifetap the fool til he's dead.

For RvR though until the pbae nuke becomes available, Darkness is the only one that matters.

Not directly related to question but you did mention downtime when solo...

make sure you have 3 staves, 1 each for darkness, suppression and summoning. If you switch them during a fight, you can reduce the amount of power you expend on casting and hence reduce downtime. This is more handy when solo and you haven't got a pom from a nice healer. I didn't work this out, someone told me... and I found it to be true. For example, load up the Summoning staff when you summon your pet, buff it or heal it. If the focus levels within the staff are equal to or greater than the spell you are casting it reduces the amount of power you expend.
you have to be a bit handy with the equipment switching but it works well.
At some levels you'll find a staff that does all 3 well, but this is rare, and only helpful if you've gone for an even spread across all 3.

 

[~Mobius~]

yup roo covered it all

also in a later patch im pretty sure we get insta dmg spells in darkness line....but dont hold me to that

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Actually I forgot to say the asbolutely best thing about playing a Spirit Master:

You get to say MUHAHAHAHAHA a lot.

It's possibly the easiest character ever created to roleplay. Say this and stick a lot of 's's in words and everyone thinks you're a topnotch roleplayer.

Time to ssssummon ssspiritsss yessss.

You see? Easy.

Muhahahaha

 

[old.Gromnir]

Thanks Primus and Roo I might just have something to go on here

Now im gonna go try and own some mobs with my 6level sm kobold.

And yes its true that its easy to roleplay a sm i'v already made up a story for him and his sister (shes a hunter) and how they lost their parents. The youngest of the two being him he had no where to turn to and tried to call for his parents and one day it happende his parents came to him and helped him in his battles vs. evil. thats why my sm will normaly be seen traveling with either is long dead Dad or Mom and maybe he might even be talking to them


MUHAHAHAHAHA

 

[rynnor]

Got my SM to 37 so far and its Darkness all the way - dont bother with the three staves just keep ya darkness one - pet summoning is a straight percentage of your mana so focus staves dont effect it (sorry).

I'm currently 37 dark- its great in mass rvr - F8 blast until dead - rinse repeat - even purple players cant resist all the time

PvE Solo it tho I havent had groups make me kill the pet but I'm always carefull to control it and if it wanders release it.

Only thing I miss is a speed buff - sigh

Enjoy being the best solo class in Mid.

 

[Biermann]

With my sm, I´ll go 49suppression, 18darkness and rest in summoning. Then wait for the 1.51patch next millennium.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

At higher levels (say 30+) you will almost always in group situations be dealing with pulls which have anything up to 3 or 4 adds. The pet will automatically attack anything that agros onto you. This is what drives groups crazy because when the pet goes charging off to attack an agro mob it can easily activate an un-pulled mob which just happens to be close. Very nasty. Ask anyone who's spent their time in Spindelhalla in the lower levels. The trick I use is to set the pet to passive just BEFORE the mob it's fighting is killed, this way there is zero danger of it charging forward and earning me everlasting hatred from my fellow players.

I got different ways of earning that

I find the only groups that are happy to let me keep my pet (known as Junior to one and all) are made up of the peeps I've grouped with a lot.

Muhahaha (TM)

 

[old.Belorfyn]

Originally posted by rynnor
Got my SM to 37 so far and its Darkness all the way - dont bother with the three staves just keep ya darkness one - pet summoning is a straight percentage of your mana so focus staves dont effect it (sorry).

Well, guess it's just me then who's noticing the difference. Explain to me too please, why couldn't it affect spells that have power cost based on percentage ? It could be used as initial power usage (without speccing and focus bonuses affecting it yet) all the same. I fail to understand why they couldn't be affected.
Also, even if it didn't affect the summoning spell, is it not true that when fighting with spirit you sometimes have to heal it ? Speccing and focus bonuses also affect heal (Uses less power and maybe heal effect is more stable).
Also I have found the focus damage shield quite useful.

I must say that when you're thinking about completely discarding summoning, remember speccing in any lines affacts spells on base line as well. Darkness affects base nuke as well, suppression root and debuffs and summoning healing.
What Roo said about pet in groups is quite true, at the moment anyway. In some future patch (can't remember which one) the pet has been changed not to attack mezzed targets so the problem will be gone and it should be useful in groups too. As for the "exp loss" talk. As far as I know, spirit takes maximum 25% of exp and 25% is the case only when the spirit kills the mob all by itself. So it's not really a loss, everything it hits is a gain for group. Faster killing equals faster pulls which equals faster exp. At the moment I've used spirit in bigger groups (malmo) only to peel myself when tanks fail to, quite useful even as it is I must say.
So far none has complained about my nukes dealing too low damage in groups either.
I personally am very fond of my pet in rvr. Healing it is also very nice, it used to, and still does, surprise your enemies because they don't expect it. Not all classes are able to heal their pets after all. Maybe for this same reason or not, enemies often give up running after me with pet after them if they can't catch me easily and start fighting pet. Then they die but not like there was much choice for them. Spirit isn't at any rate bad tank. It takes quite long for your average melee class to kill it if it's buffed and in full health.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Interesting Bel, I sometimes use Junior as my own personal peeler too - setting the spirit to passive until its really needed for an emergency. It's also very handy for peeling agro off healers themselves since the cold nuke can get the attention of almost any mob.

I've also found that I can transfer hitpoints into charmed pets used by hunters, so SMs can actually prolong the life of other chars' pets. Was in a 2-man today with a hunter in Spin for some quick carnage and was doing this.

 

[old.Belorfyn]

Originally posted by Roo Stercogburn
Interesting Bel, I sometimes use Junior as my own personal peeler too - setting the spirit to passive until its really needed for an emergency. It's also very handy for peeling agro off healers themselves since the cold nuke can get the attention of almost any mob.

I've also found that I can transfer hitpoints into charmed pets used by hunters, so SMs can actually prolong the life of other chars' pets. Was in a 2-man today with a hunter in Spin for some quick carnage and was doing this.

Sure, if you have life transfer high enough. Mine is only level 11 and heals ~50 hit points so not much use.
Healing players is probably useful too, there's always the life leech to get the hp back. I hear many more specced in suppression use this as backup heal in groups sometimes.

 

[~Mobius~]

i actually REALLY like the life tap

if ever i see a grey con who has lost life i always stop to heal them

i just wanna say that spiritmasters rock and also invaders when you see me....keep going for my pet... it makes for a good fight

hmm Roo i think ill have to give my pet a name to.

probably call it Corona2

 

[Old Nicodemus]

Hmmmmmm... interesting topic.

First off I can understand why people want to specc mainly in darkness. It IS the only true line at the moment, however from personal taste if I had wanted to be an Uber nuker then I would have made an RM.

We are supposed to be SPIRITmasters after all......... but I digress.

I am currently working on 32 darkness 28/9 suppression and 13 summoning. Now I don't do as much damage as a Darkness specced SM but I do more than enough for my tastes. I will be ploughing some more into Summoning to get to 23 over the next couple of levels to give Jeeves (my pet) some better buffs. The rest I haven't really decided on where to put. Once I get to 32 Dark, 32 Supp, 23 Summoning I will have a number of points left over to decide what route to take. I will most likely put most of it into supp but I may up summoning or darkness... whatever takes my fancy.

With this specc I find that I am more than useful in groups as I can do a bit of everything... Good mezz, good nukes, good debuffs, able to keep peeps alive AND have a good peeler in my pet. What more could you ask for really?

Well of course the rezz and the PBAoE DD

In the end it comes down to how YOU want to play your SM. I personally prefer the jack of all trades. Besides if you really want to nuke things to death don't be surprised if your pet cannot take aggro away from you!

The important thing to remember is to have fun! There is no right or wrong way to play an SM... who knows you might find a good combo that everyone else might try!

Happy Hunting!

Nicodemus
Spiritmaster of over 40 winters.

 

[rynnor]

Originally posted by old.Belorfyn

>Also, even if it didn't affect the summoning spell, is it not true >that when fighting with spirit you sometimes have to heal it ? >Speccing and focus bonuses also affect heal (Uses less power >and maybe heal effect is more stable).
>Also I have found the focus damage shield quite useful.

Heh OK - each to his own but are you really encouraging people to put their points into summoning - universally held as a great example of a badly messed up line??? I mean the buffs are dire!!

And the focus damage shield - yeugh - I use the pet where neccesary to generate about 30 percent damage before I dd the mob to death - not as the main damage dealer and you will get less xp if you let pet take it down - not a lot but it adds up.

Your right - I dont heal my pet much and I dont know why you would really - despite its usefullness if you group it is very rarely going to get aggro if you have any sort of tank in the group?

Soloing I generally find a bunch of yellows - pet only has to do them a little damage before I nuke em down or if I feel brave I can just ignore the pet and dd it into extinction.

>I must say that when you're thinking about completely >discarding summoning, remember speccing in any lines affacts >spells on base line as well. Darkness affects base nuke as well, >suppression root and debuffs and summoning healing.

Indeed - with about half your level in Summoning you will get a lot less variance on your heals - but what a waste of points!

I think Suppression will become an equally valid spec once we get the PBAOE but until then some combination of Dark Major/Supp Minor is optimum in my opinion.

 

[old.Belorfyn]

Originally posted by rynnor

Heh OK - each to his own but are you really encouraging people to put their points into summoning - universally held as a great example of a badly messed up line??? I mean the buffs are dire!!

Actually, I was talking about using summoning focused staff when fighting.
I try not to encourage people to do anything, when someone asks me how to spec, I don't tell them what to do, I'll just tell them what happens when they spec this or that.
But if someone asked me if I thought summoning was waste of points, I'd say no. I've found it useful, too bad if none else hasn't.

And the focus damage shield - yeugh - I use the pet where neccesary to generate about 30 percent damage before I dd the mob to death - not as the main damage dealer and you will get less xp if you let pet take it down - not a lot but it adds up.

"Eek! My pet ain't doing any damage on this red mob and I can't heal it because I'd get aggro and I don't have damage shield!"

Your right - I dont heal my pet much and I dont know why you would really - despite its usefullness if you group it is very rarely going to get aggro if you have any sort of tank in the group?

Suppose so, if you don't solo at all.

As for the peeling, I often get aggros from pulls in malmo in groups where there is 10 tanks. The mob that comes for me is the one healer didn't mez and tanks didn't see. But this isn't a big problem, I just thought it was worth mentioning since it makes the pet useful sometimes in big groups as well.

Soloing I generally find a bunch of yellows - pet only has to do them a little damage before I nuke em down or if I feel brave I can just ignore the pet and dd it into extinction.
Indeed - with about half your level in Summoning you will get a lot less variance on your heals - but what a waste of points!

I think Suppression will become an equally valid spec once we get the PBAOE but until then some combination of Dark Major/Supp Minor is optimum in my opinion.

Well, anyway, as Nicodemus put it, "In the end it comes down to how YOU want to play your SM".
I think that's true, I've often said to anyone asking about speccing that "you can't really make a bad spiritmaster, we get all the stuff from base-lines anyway, rest is up to you".

 

[old.Gromnir]

hehe looks like a sm post was needed for people too share thier ideers (and help me understadn the class a bit better)

I don't know about the staff swapping thing, I might remember it when summoning my "pet" and buff him/her up but once in battle I forget stuff like that

One of the things i find the most fasinating about the class is that every body likes the pet but none wants to specc in the line that buffs the pet - I said before that i'd keep going to specc in darkness, but comming to thing of it I might just go for a (maybe 32 like nico) stand where I find that the spells are realy good, and then por the rest of min points into a the last two tho I think i'll mainly go for summoning to keep the spirte of the sm class alive and not look like a rm.

But in the end it always comes down to what you'd want from youg class and not what some templets made of your class

 

[Darkwind]

Thanx a lot all, this helped me a lot!

 

[Quemine]

Was killing orange cons in varulv with 5-10 sec lag on every spell and ld once every 5 minutes... so might aswell add some thoughts in here!

I really luv this class, gets all those nifty spells and is very valuable in any group. Nuke, mezz, debuff, heal, peel, act cool... so much things to do! My SM is currently dark specced mostly with 11 supp and a whole 3 points put in summ. Think I'll go all the way dark from there and some more in supp laters.

But, I wouldn't mind trying a supp/summ specced sm one day when I get really bored, see how the little spirit works out. Don't think your SM will get majorly gimped no matter how you spec it, since the baseline spells are quite good already. Make yourself über in one spec or do the jack of all trades... it's up to you!

Quemine ~ 50 Healer
Caeron ~ 46 Aug Healer (don't ask)
Cui ~ 30 Spiritmaster

 

[old.Belorfyn]

Originally posted by old.Gromnir
I don't know about the staff swapping thing, I might remember it when summoning my "pet" and buff him/her up but once in battle I forget stuff like that

I swap staff usually (if I remember) when summoning spirit. Then rest of the time generally keep the same staff depending on what I do :
Soloing: summoning-staff
Rvr: darkness-staff
Groups: usually darkness-staff

Oh, if someone is curious about my specs (doubt it ), here we are: 30/12/43. I didn't go all the way in summoning in case someone thought so

Oh, for those who are interested and haven't noticed, they're making focus damage-shield more powerful in future patches.

 

[demented_smurf]

from what ive seen for far form sm's they deal huge dmg but have long downtime without PoX

 

[old.Zatan]

and then....

If you can find a SM friend (almost the same level) don´t hesitate to group with him/her...

2 Sm´s who knows to handle their pets really are a Blast

 

[- Pathfinder -]

Keep 'em SMs coming Make a change from the usual Skald/SB/Hunter emain action

 

[svartalf]

Rez?

I hear SM gets a rez at 30 spirit, but nobody wants to spec 30 in spirit..?

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Its at 23, so not quite as far up