Server

[Deadmanwalking]

Right as i am tired of having to turn the computer downstairs on in order to print, that and the fact my computer is always being used as a filedump/server.

I am after a very very cheap server. Looking on Dells webby the 400SC IDE is about bang on what im on about here. But one it's in the small business bit which i have been told you need to actually be a business in order to use.

So i am after suitable solutions, No celerons/durons plz, at least 256 mem and 80 gig HDD.
Considered building one myself but it came out alot more expensive then the dell one

Help!

 

[Will]

What are you building this server to do? Is it just as a print-server, is it going to be a web-server/mail-server, are are you going the full monty and building a gaming server?

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Well, Print/file server as its basics. And also alongside it a webserver for my projects

I wouldn't mind enough whack to host a LAN game or 5.

Edit: Also as i still haven't found a replacement hardware firewall, i may have to do some serious rewiring and then plonk that on there as well

 

[Will]

You could quite honestly run that from a Duron/Celeron. A print server/firewall can run off a 486. You are looking at a linux/BSD box to run that. For your sanity I'd try and build something with low-end parts that runs as quietly as possible.

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Noise isn't a problem as it will be sitting understairs/in study.

 

[Chameleon]

Agreeeeeed, go for a low spec linux based small pc.

 

[Deadmanwalking]

I know i want it low spec

But i do still want some kick in it if needed..... and do i build my own very low end desktop? or go for a "server" from the likes of dell etc

 

[PR.]

Cheap Servers = Expensive PCs in a different case

I would have thought you could make a decent machine for less money than a server, I mean you can spend more on all the buzz words that the Dell marketing department have put on the website but end of the day your not going to notice much difference.

Our office at work runs an entire domain on a P3 800mhz with 256mb ram, that includes all the domain systems plus exchange/print/file/update server for 70+ machines and it does it pretty well.

The only thing that server will do thats remotely taxing will be the Games servers rest of the time its like your desktop machine... sitting idle

Good luck

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Yeah cheers PR. that's what i wanted

As my computer at the moment is acting as the resident server here and it's starting to annoy me no end. That and the fact my HDDs are 80% full of shit that isn't mine

 

[Quige]

I'd get a cheap case, a £60/70 Athlon XP, and 512MB RAM, no need to have super fast stuff, and spend any money on getting a couple of sizable hdd. Look for a mother board that does RAID1 or get an addin IDE RAID controller. Any old CD-ROM drive - again speed isn't really an issue I would imagine.
Bobs yer much maligned uncle - a server with some redundancey in the data area.
If the hardware RAID1 pops the price up to much, get the 2 matched disks, and use windows software RAID. - for the sort of application you seem to talking about, I don't expect you'd notice the performance hit.

For the record I have a PII450 as server and it can run a LAN game of UT2003 dedicated with 4 or 5 real peeps and a matching amount of bots, whilst still doing doman functions and mail server.

 

[Will]

I'd go with Quige's spec...but Windows software RAID? Windows?

Personally, I'd use FreeBSD, and only worry about the HDD setup if you are going to be doing major fileserver work.

 

[Jupitus]

I have an old machine with no GFX capability to speak of lying around here. You'd need an HDU and basic gfx card (might have) but it's very cost effectively priced... no brand, just home built.

PM me if interested.

Edit: I used to run DAoC on it (with gfx card in) fine so it's a reasonable machine...

 

[Quige]

Yes well OK, however you do it, whatever OS you end up using ... I was just trying to say that some sort of redundant data setup was probably better than nothing. But that's just from the perspective of having had a similar setup, but with a single disk, and I almost lost GB's of photos taken since the birth of my little girl. Yes I had some of it backed up to CD, but not all ... the disk died over a period of days so I was able to get most of it off in time, but it was scary! So IDE RAID Controller and a couple of matched disks later = a slightly happier Q. I'd be much happier if I could afford a RAID 5 solution, but I ain't got that type of money.

Windows is what I'm experienced in from a work & home point of view, (though I've dallied with the odd Mandrake install, and managed to get UT running under it on my old Geforce2 ), so that was the solution I suggested.

Having just got a new Shuttle I'm planning on trying to make my old kit a Linux server ... try and get to grips with it a bit more, perhaps go penguin altogether on the server side of things.

 

[Will]

I didn't mean to sound like I was putting you down. Sorry if I came across that way. Just that, for the applications he was suggesting, *nix seems to me to be the better choice, since once it is up and running, you shouldn't ever have to touch the actual machine.

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Hmm well, thanks to some smooth talking to a university techy

I can get my hands on a p3 800, 512 sdram and 2 40gb 7200 rpm HDDs.

For about 100 odd.

Now, that isn't enough storage space as like i said my curent computer is being used as the fileserver/file dump so i now need storage suggestions.

By that i mean not what Hdds, but OS and how to best set them up. The motherboard has very few extras im told so if i do go down the RAID route i will need all the extras that go with it.

Help appreciated

 

[PR.]

What my plan was was to have my games PC with an large harddrive to duplicate my shuttle data on incase of disaster.

Then also get a removable caddy drive that has the data on it that I store somewhere this means I don't lose anything which is currently my main worry.

I did think of duplicating RAID but if there was a power surge I could still lose both drives.

PS: A P3 800 won't run those huge NS games

 

[Will]

For RAID, you could get a seperate addon card and the extra HDD space to suit, that was you wouldn't need to upgrade that spec until it disappeared.

 

[Deadmanwalking]

I know the CPU is a little underpowered but it will have to do for now (Cash wise). It will prob have hdds left right and centre stoved into it along with the several NICs that are needed to keep this (Bodged) network going.

I will prob also attempt to get it going as a wireless bridge so the laptops can roam around free as the wind

 

[Quige]

Originally posted by Will
I didn't mean to sound like I was putting you down. Sorry if I came across that way.

no offense taken - my apologies if I came across as in a huff!

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Awwww i feel like crying *sniff* *sniff*

 

[Quige]

Originally posted by Deadmanwalking
By that i mean not what Hdds, but OS and how to best set them up. The motherboard has very few extras im told so if i do go down the RAID route i will need all the extras that go with it.

Help appreciated

So depends on your stance on various things,

If you're relatively techie and want something free & legal then for basic file/print/web/email a *nix solution is obviously the winner.

Games support is less universal, but at least on servers you're usually running in a 'dedicated' mode.

If you're not very techie, a Windows system is probably going to be easier to set up, but of course staying legal has a quite large cost involved.

A RAID solution just requires an addin card, 2 or more disks and some IDE cables. Most IDE RAID cards seem to only support 0, 1 & 1+0 RAID levels, but I haven't really checked it out recently so maybe IDE RAID 5 exists out there somewhere.

0 = striped. Data is split across the 2 disks. As it can write to the disks simultaneously you get a performance increase in disk access

1 = mirror. Data is written twice, once to each disk. No speed benefit. Good for when a disk dies. Replace it and the array rebuilds.

0+1 = combination of the above, usually requiring 4 disks, - can never remember if you have 2 sets of mirrored pairs and then stripe across that . Or whether you stipe across a pair of disks and then mirror that.

Anyway, a quick search on Google will give the proper explanations and levels.

As I've explained earlier, personal experience makes me favour the RAID 1 solution.

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Yeah it will prob end up with a *nix version on it.

Saying that i can get my hands on a copy of 2k Server/AS all legal like and all. With the 5 cals which is enough.

In terms of raid the data that goes on and off is going to be stay on there for a maximum of a few days. So the redundancy isn't a priority. It's pure speed/space that is needed.

 

[Quige]

Then I guess you need to decide whether RAID is really that important at all. A decent 7,200rpm hdd on it's own may be all that's needed. I've never really used RAID 0 so I'm not sure how perceptible the speed increase would be. Might be as well spend all your dosh on one of the newer 160GB disks and get as much capacity as you can.

 

[Deadmanwalking]

I would prefer to have 2 sep disks or maybe even more. One for OS/system stuff. The main one to be pounded with the huge transfers and anouther for my stuff, so i can use it while the other is getting several hundred gigs ripped off and put onto it.

 

[Quige]

Then you could still do this without involving RAID .. just get 2 hdd on seperate channels on the mboard, or if you need a DVD/CDROM permanently attached then just get an extra IDE card, to add another 2 IDE channels to the system ... about £35 , giving a potential total of 8 IDE devices.

Promise Ultra ATA 100 TX2

 

[Deadmanwalking]

Ok thanks so much Quige.

And will... expect me back in a few weeks asking about *nix maybe