Reduce Magic Damage...

[Tizu]

Hi all,

im asking why doesnt mythic "reduce" magic damage?. Its making this game very boring just being debuffed and dead within 3 nukes getting hit for 500-1000). It takes away the fun in the game, if you find your caster fun to play "debuff" "nuke" and you insult BD players your just as bad.(im talking about any caster class here)

What i ask is for mythic to take away casters debuffs in ANY resist line which there nukes attack with in there realm, and tone down magic damage.

Im ready for flaming as normal, why i dont post here much.

 

[Awarkle]

i dunno my nukes hit for crap all around 400ish mark

and god forbid my spec line arb nukes actually finding a target

yes some casters need some toning down but then stealthers hit casters for crap loads of damage.

 

[Roadie]

its only extream because your fighting against relic bonuses.

If they toned down caster dmg all groups with resist buffs would have no problem dealing with casters at all and we would be back to dark age of tankalot.

At least at the moment its a mixture of tanks and casters that makes the most effective groups not 100% pure tanks.

Also i dont understand your point about BD's are you saying that all casters are "as bad" as bd's because they do alot of dmg? ppl dont hate bd's because of high dmg output :z

 

[Cozak]

its only extream because your fighting against relic bonuses.

If they toned down caster dmg all groups with resist buffs would have no problem dealing with casters at all and we would be back to dark age of tankalot.

At least at the moment its a mixture of tanks and casters that makes the most effective groups not 100% pure tanks.

Also i dont understand your point about BD's are you saying that all casters are "as bad" as bd's because they do alot of dmg? ppl dont hate bd's because of high dmg output :z

Think he was refering to the skill levels required to play one at a decent level.

 

[Bowie]

Well casters have crappy armors and a lot less hp, so should be able to deal out some good dammege. But the cast-speed u are able to makle in this game is Total stupid realy. Sometimes u think u get 1 shootet and u scrool up and se: No i didnt get hit once like i thought and not twice, i got hit 3 times in what looked like 1 hit...

Either half the cast speed or half the dammege, or give casters a crit-shoot like Bowers have witch take a little longer time to cast, 4-5 sec no matter ur dex or toa bon and same with normal nukes 2-3 sec.

With half dammege over time ( either speed reduse or dam reduse ) u would force in tanks in the game again to protect casters doing crit-shoots on a 4-5 sec timer. As it is today u can just make a nice caster setup with a few healers and u are ready to rock. U can ofc bring along tanks for the fun or for old time sake, but its not needed as is today.

Imo tanks should be realy Needed to bring life back to this game, and only way to do it is to reduse efficiensie on casters.

Ok lets say Mythic fixed that and u made a nice mixed fg of lets say 3 tanks 3 caster 2 healers, then u run into another problem : where to rvr ? with all the daam archer add ( yes i played a ranger too myself for long time, but NF made rvr too archer-friendly imo with all the towers so close ). Large places with no towers near and good chock-points like MGs in OF ( Albs had to pass AMG to enter Emain ect,ect) is very needed in DAOC today, for fg rvr to be nice again. Could be a Round island each realm should port to in order to come there, and from the portel location on the island , each realm had to pass a milegate like in OF, to enter the mittle of island, from where u could check out and run through, the other 2 realms Milegates.

Could be made nice with hills and stuff in the mittle, and with some kind of bonus or the pure plesure of clean fg rvr as reward for running there.
Kinda like lvl 50 Play gound, i bet it would be very populair fast

Well thats all for my 50 cents

 

[Nausilus^^]

I agree that it would be nice with some sort of balance caster vs melee vs stealther. If a solo caster meets solo melee, who would win? I think in most of the cases the caster would. Mainly because of insane casting speed, spell pierce and insane damage. If the melee should be so lucky to even reach the caster, he would probably be so low on hp it only takes 1 qc nuke to be finished off. I don't get jumped by archers much, and same with assasains. And when I do it's normally by a fg of them (or so it looks). I don't think the solo archer add or solo assasain running around poses a big thread to the balance, and I know it's definately not all archers who do the high damage that most ppl focus on (I do shit dmg on my ranger.. don't ask me why). But if in some way the balance between caster, melee and stealth RvR could be fixed I think that would bring more fun into everyday RvR

Just my 2 cents.. not really looking to flame or get flamed, just stating how I feel about it

 

[Maleg]

Four ways to reduce mage damage:

1) Make sure you have resistance buffs
2) Make sure you have characters in a group with Magic damage reduction RA's (BAoD, plus EM / AoM on self)
3) Take back Power Relics
4) Make sure group has use of BL abilitys that reduce damage

Mage damage is horrendous if you're low RR / ML and fighting vs a Realm with Power Relics. Start getting some of the stuff above and mage damage takes a serious hit to the point where it's no longer that bad.

If you nerf mage damage generally then you'll need to do something about the above, because with lower mage damage and those in place mages just might as well not play.

(For reference I don't play a mage, I generally would play in a group with a couple of mages and a couple of tanks)

 

[Puppet]

* Remove spellpiercing / resist piercing
* Lower resist-buffs to 5-10-15% (tier1 till tier3)
* Cap cast-time on 1.5-1.6 sec for all spells
* Give damage-spells a 5% chance to fumble on spells; but not on quickcasts

* Make Mage baseline lifetap a normal DD with same delve/cast-speed as other magic-classes and put the lifetap in body-spec (replace the sorc body DD!) with as top 179 delve 80% hp returned

* Sorc receives a DD209 in matter-line; the DD179 snare nuke goes to... matter cabalist spec :O

 

[sneakies]

1v1 MoC3 Lifetapping sorc/cabby... I yam invincable!!

 

[Shike]

1v1 MoC3 Lifetapping sorc/cabby... I yam invincable!!

think you mean same stuff as SM can do? or am I mistaken?

 

[Eva]

think you mean same stuff as SM can do? or am I mistaken?

Yes, you are. The sm don't need moc3.

 

[Shike]

* Remove spellpiercing / resist piercing
* Lower resist-buffs to 5-10-15% (tier1 till tier3)

so every nublarzerglingcaster do more damage, good idea.

* Cap cast-time on 1.5-1.6 sec for all spells
* Give damage-spells a 5% chance to fumble on spells; but not on quickcasts

also add in a chanse to not get interrupt with a decent % and sure. Otherwise mage will be 100% obsolete. Sort out fucked up coding with mezimmune and still get interrupted etc. Then capped casttime at 1.5s or so is viable. Damage and lul should be only ways to interrupt/cancel, not popping moc and spam aoeDisease.

* Make Mage baseline lifetap a normal DD with same delve/cast-speed as other magic-classes and put the lifetap in body-spec (replace the sorc body DD!) with as top 179 delve 80% hp returned

yes, good idea, agree 100%, that LT is abit fecked up. Although, i'd rather see LT go away totally and not exist at all, reason is simply because MoC along with LTs are completely whack.

* Sorc receives a DD209 in matter-line; the DD179 snare nuke goes to... matter cabalist spec :O

Sure why not, but 219DD imo. As all speccnukes should be all across the line.

---------------------

There are ways to encounter casters tbh, I dont truly believe they are overpowered in any way. With the change to % in piercing, mages dont do as much damage. Toss in demor and they do even less, add in EM/AOM/BAOD and suddenly they just scratch alittle, add in good interrupting, mainly thinking reaver/mincer, BD/shaman, bard/?, (ive always believed hibs lack in interruptingarea overall, only thing hibs used to have except bards, was DPSdebuff but that was a bug) and you can lock down casters pretty good aswell to prevent them from doing full damage. Castergrp that get the drop should win pretty easy, but headon its pretty even id say.

Aaaaanyway... just me ranting alil as usual. And sort Animist so its a viable fieldclass and nerf shrooms even more. And wait until you guys get warlocks and banshees, gonna be crying of insane amounts hehe.

 

[remi]

my dmg with relics was ridiculous

 

[willowywicca]

my dmg with relics was ridiculous

Aye remove relics (str and pow) as they're just stupidly unbalancing.. other than that tho, caster damage is fine imo.. if you do anything to reduce it you have to do something to stop every single little sneeze interupting casters too.. otherwise it'd be completely pointless playing casters again

Also puppet, is that 5% chance to fumble spells in addition to the chance to outright resist a spell? (which is already higher than 5% even for lvl50 spells)

 

[Equendil]

Resist rate of 15% or more is annoying enough me think.

 

[Puppet]

Also puppet, is that 5% chance to fumble spells in addition to the chance to outright resist a spell? (which is already higher than 5% even for lvl50 spells)

In addition. Casters can get 'outright resists' and thats it.

Melee can fumble, get parried, blocked, intercepted, bladeturned AND misses (=~ resisted). Add to that they do less damage when they swing faster (casters dont get that with rising dex) and I think 5% fumble-rate (miscast) wouldnt be too bad and a 'nice' 5% nerf to casters Can only fumble on damage spells; not on heals to stop it from being too annoying :O

Remove the dmg bonus u receive from relics and change it into something else.

Also make amnesia abit more useful; and add confuse in RvR. It will never happen but it would make the game more interesting.

The resist-piercing vs. resist-buffs makes perhaps 'every nooblet' nuke harder Shikei; but it also removes the call for nerfs because someone only has '26% resists'. Mage-damage on AoM3 + 50% resists isnt the reason why people say nerf casters. Its mostly nuking people without resist-buffs for insane amounts. The change I proposed removes that ánd makes the caster still powerful on 'red resists'.

 

[remi]

removing relics is enough nerf if you ask me.

my dmg vs 26%+resists+aom, is of poo. Add the interuption code and the caster dmg is balanced.

 

[willowywicca]

In addition. Casters can get 'outright resists' and thats it.

Melee can fumble, get parried, blocked, intercepted, bladeturned AND misses (=~ resisted). Add to that they do less damage when they swing faster (casters dont get that with rising dex) and I think 5% fumble-rate (miscast) wouldnt be too bad and a 'nice' 5% nerf to casters Can only fumble on damage spells; not on heals to stop it from being too annoying :O

Aye tanks can be blocked parried etc.. casters can be interupted. tanks cannot.. remove interupts, than add your 5 or even a 10% fumble rate.. that'd be fine.. also for the most part tanks kill casters and healers, not other tanks (except when casters and healers are all dead) and don't face much blocking evading etc by them

 

[remi]

i fight whatever f8 brings to me



xD

 

[Puppet]

also add in a chanse to not get interrupt with a decent % and sure. Otherwise mage will be 100% obsolete. Sort out fucked up coding with mezimmune and still get interrupted etc. Then capped casttime at 1.5s or so is viable. Damage and lul should be only ways to interrupt/cancel, not popping moc and spam aoeDisease.

Ehmm.. You know caster DPS got an about 30-35% dps-increase during TOA ? Resist-piercing (+10 %), cast-speed (+10%), magic-dmg (+10%), slightly higher acuity due to 'acuity cap' and slightly higher dexterity due to 'dexterity cap'.

So.. a caster gains ~35% and an about 5% nerf (fumbles) would be enough to give em even more goodies and again increasing their dps? No; I dont agree; atm mages are over the top and there's nothing EXCEPT a nerf which will put em down.

Dont forget the resist-piercing removal is NO damage-nerf due to the lowering of resist-buffs; only on people without resist-buffs; who are probably dead before u can say your guildname on Prydwen

Sure why not, but 219DD imo. As all speccnukes should be all across the line.

All spec-nukes are DD209 except runie + fire-wizard; rest is DD209 :O

 

[Equendil]

In addition. Casters can get 'outright resists' and thats it.

Melee can fumble, get parried, blocked, intercepted, bladeturned AND misses (=~ resisted). Add to that they do less damage when they swing faster (casters dont get that with rising dex) and I think 5% fumble-rate (miscast) wouldnt be too bad and a 'nice' 5% nerf to casters Can only fumble on damage spells; not on heals to stop it from being too annoying :O

Melee 'miss' once in a blue moon compared to how often casters are resisted, parry/evade/block is something that benefit them in the first place, I don't think people would be too happy if that was removed, melees don't have to suffer interrupts, melees don't gain DPS linearly with swing speed and that's rather fortunate seeing as they kill casters as fast as casters can kill them anyway, melee damage is hardly gimp, melees don't have to deal with resist buffs either, etc etc.

Melees and casters are two different beasts, there is already way more than enough ways for a caster to fail casting a spell as it is, fumbling spells on top of that would be silly.

 

[Equendil]

atm mages are over the top

*Everything* in DAoC is over the top, CC is over the top, healing is over the top, melee damage is over the top, caster damage is over the top, RAs are over the top, interrupts are over the top, MLs are over the top, relic bonus is over the top, artifacts abilities are over the top, it would take a total redesign of the game to make things sane, not just nerfing casters so they are only useful in keep siege.

 

[Rudor Dwarf]

The stuff that bother me is all shit i need to hit thru b4 i can hit the caster.
And i wouldnt be very happy to face a sm Ôô.

I think they should add that you do a lil less dmg if you cast faster etc as melee work.

 

[Equendil]

I think they should add that you do a lil less dmg if you cast faster etc as melee work.

Should they also provide damage adds, haste buffs, base acuity buff, dps buff, spells that do more damage if you hit from the side or behind or whatever, etc to make it work like melee ? Or should magic damage be uninterruptable at range so it works a bit more like melee ?

Trying to make casting work like melee isn't going to work.

 

[Rudor Dwarf]

Why would the need to do that ?
Its not like melee will be close the dmg a decent caster do anyway..
I can come up with what a caster dish out when i go frenzy and pop banespike and that is at slower spd.

 

[willowywicca]

Why would the need to do that ?
Its not like melee will be close the dmg a decent caster do anyway..
I can come up with what a caster dish out when i go frenzy and pop banespike and that is at a less faster spd.

it's also uninteruptable tho

 

[Puppet]

Aye tanks can be blocked parried etc.. casters can be interupted. tanks cannot.. remove interupts, than add your 5 or even a 10% fumble rate.. that'd be fine.. also for the most part tanks kill casters and healers, not other tanks (except when casters and healers are all dead) and don't face much blocking evading etc by them

LOL. Well you know deep in your heart it doesnt even out like that.

Also dont forget u can root a tank and he's out of the game for the root-duration. good luck doing that with a mage :O

Beside the miss/block/parry/bladeturned/intercepted/guarded you can also get brittle-guards, you can get bodyguard'ed (ironically by a tank btw ) all those are effective counters against melee. About the resist-buffs: Albion gets spec-AF, a ~16-19% damage-reduction to melee (resist buff :O)

I, for the most part, played support in the RvR-game (in groups), perhaps my view is abit biased; but I notice a trend that casters think they dont need a nerf; while most tanks seems to disagree

Truth as always is somewhere in the middle; some casters need some nerf in some areas

 

[Tuorin]

Caster damage is wrong, the whole idea of the game needs a rethink from keeps/towers and range. It just encourages zergs to buildup and then those with the most casters/archers wins. You cant take it to anything historic as there wasnt any casters firing bolts at you in medieval times. So openfield or keep, range > all.

They still need to look at probably 3/4 of the classes in this game atm, los in keeps for secondary healers, range for most hybrids, and range for heavy/light tanks. Sort animists, deal with pets going through walls and make necro shade killable, not go take a tour around the keep impunitively. Imo ofc. I mean waht fun is it to be assist nuked while running around keeps, cos 1 caster caught you through a window while you were running past and you die half a keep away cos the bolt/damage bypassed the los when it was fired, ie range, cast speed, quick player reaction, heavy damage (u know 1k bolts) and assisters. And you as 2/3 of the classes in the game can do nothing to negate it as they are too far away. Half the time someone kills you cos they lag more and see you as a revolving target while stationery, or you are doing the same.

They should make it that you cant nuke through a window as the attacking realm. Make you go through the door, lessen oil damage so that people can actually bash on them and not instantly die. ie make your healers earn their realm points, not make it impossible for them.

All you see at keeps is xxxx archers and xxx casters waiting in corners to nuke people and standing on ramparts nuking anything and killing it while it or they lag.

 

[Dorin]

Aye tanks can be blocked parried etc.. casters can be interupted. tanks cannot

tanks can be grappled rendering them useless, mages cannot.

:<

 

[willowywicca]

tanks can be grappled rendering them useless, mages cannot.

:<

Grappling takes the grappler out of the fight too, so it's a trade so to speak, one of our tanks for one of yours Thus it's balanaced.. (tho still stupid and should be gone like FZ)...

Puppet you can root a tank and he's out of the fight.. you can mezz a caster and he's even more out of the fight, since he is (99% of the time) interupted once his mezz is broken, while the tank can go about his business once CC breaks..

Personally I think tanks need a nerf, one banelord with charge 2 and I'm dead. Nothing I can do to fight back at all.. (could pop moc3, cept with 75% dmg, and banelord things like zou and demor the damage is *really* crap with it and you won't kill a tank that has any kind of support behind it.. and if they have 50% resists.. lol >< )