Old Frontiers SI Server

[Paliri]

I have never RVRed much but when I do now I think NF is very good. Speed at which you can move around is great. But the real problem with the whole game is TOA. If you have not got MLs and arties and your TOA suit you dont stand much of a chance in RVR. I just cant bring myself to spend all those hours getting all the TOA stuff, I have not got the hours to be honest so now I dont RVR as there is no point. TOA is and always has been shite. uke: I voted for the non TOA server, all the rest is fine and catacombs is really quite good.

Paliri

 

[old.Whoodoo]

Ok, if you can say NF is fun, while being zerged on Bryjna (sp?) by 1000 warlocks.. just taking keeps all day isnt great.

dont hang out at brynja then, theres loads of places where theres action, takes me 5 mins every time to find a new person to swash my buckle with, your just talking lazy.

In NF its only fixed groups that actually work in rvr, whereas OF you could put a random group together and do pretty nice, nowdays you just get zerged if you run near a keep.

what a crock, in OF you needed a min speedtoon/healingclass/mezzer/dettank/3xpbae to compete with the top guilds, news flash...you still do for 1fg v 1fg. Difference is, in NF, soloers and the odd 3 man team get a look in too.

There is no specific meeting points in NF, like the old runs in OF you were bound to find a group somewhere along the line, now i find i can't find anyone unless i run near a keep, then i get zerged or rolled by a fixed FG etc.

Bled is the best place, failing that, Glen, failing that, Svasud, the other day even my hunter got into a random group. This all sounds like pure laziness to me, you want it all easy, "gifv group", "1 button 4tehwin!" and "all frontiers should be flat and featureless" be your motto.

Try a lil harder m8, you may not get your uber fotm group you want, but you can get A group.

 

[Phuzzy]

I have never RVRed much but when I do now I think NF is very good. Speed at which you can move around is great. But the real problem with the whole game is TOA. If you have not got MLs and arties and your TOA suit you dont stand much of a chance in RVR. I just cant bring myself to spend all those hours getting all the TOA stuff, I have not got the hours to be honest so now I dont RVR as there is no point. TOA is and always has been shite. uke: I voted for the non TOA server, all the rest is fine and catacombs is really quite good.

Paliri

I have to agree with most of this.

After over 100 hours at GoLM with no success, & 50+ hours farming for Traldors 3 with no success I don't really feel very inclined to continue with the ToA-Torture. Also no point in doing ML solo + BG steps when I know I have practically no chance of getting the group steps done.

These are all pre-reqs for todays RvR FFS.

I think I can safely say that everyone I know ingame would just love to go out & RvR, but hardly any of them bother any more because they can't get the pre-reqs done.

If you want more people out in RvR then campaign to get the GD pre-reqs nerfed IMO.

 

[chretien]

I have never RVRed much but when I do now I think NF is very good. Speed at which you can move around is great. But the real problem with the whole game is TOA. If you have not got MLs and arties and your TOA suit you dont stand much of a chance in RVR. I just cant bring myself to spend all those hours getting all the TOA stuff, I have not got the hours to be honest so now I dont RVR as there is no point. TOA is and always has been shite. uke: I voted for the non TOA server, all the rest is fine and catacombs is really quite good.

Paliri

You don't need artifacts and MLs. This is a common misconception. Ubergroups need them to compete withother ubergroups. The vast mass of people who aren't trying to compete at that level don't need them. I have a capped temlate on my Cleric with only one artifact which is not even level 10 (Kalares Necklace). My Paladin has two artifacts. On each I have only one very useful ML ability, both of which are situational (Siegemaster and Font of Power).
You can 'get ToA' without having to put the hours in. You can buy nice drops from CMs for less than crafted stuff these days, Fill in with a couple of soloable or easy to get artifacts and you're away fairly painlessly.

On top of all that, ToA is getting easier all the time, with 1.75 the prereqs for ML3 are gone and you no longer need to do all the other steps to get x.10 credit.

After over 100 hours at GoLM with no success, & 50+ hours farming for Traldors 3 with no success I don't really feel very inclined to continue with the ToA-Torture. Also no point in doing ML solo + BG steps when I know I have practically no chance of getting the group steps done.

I've never camped an artifact. Never saw the point. I got all my artifacts and the ones for friends of mine by simply wandering past to see if it was up. If it was we did it, if not we went and did something fun instead. Got GoLM three times, Orion's Belt four times, SoM twice, Egg of Youth three times, GoV a couple of times and so on. No-one makes you camp. If you do and complain about it you have no-one to blame but yourself.
There's no real excuse for not being able to get group steps done either. There are always people in need of ML credit, MLXP or an opportunity to farm in ML dungeons. If you need group steps, make a post here and get a group together to do it. It's really not rocket science, BG steps should be the only bottlenecks for MLs, and with clustering and the changes coming up, these should be easier to do as well.

 

[Phuzzy]

Let me try & put it more simply ...

Before ToA, all I had to do to get my bottles of milk (= competetive RvR) was open the front door & pick them up. Now, since ToA, I have to open the door, run a marathon backwards through sleet & snow & the fires of hell, pick up the milk, and run another similarly painful marathon back again, which leaves me asking myself ... Do I really want the milk that badly after all? & the answer is ... No. While I'd dearly love to have some milk in my coffee & over my cereal & help out my realm in the process, the pain/reward involved is completely & utterly out of all feasible proportion. If they'd shorten the marathon or make it less painful or even better get rid of it completely I'd be delighted to start drinking milk again. Until that day, there are a hell of a lot less milk-drinkers than could be the case.

 

[Abel]

You don't need artifacts and MLs.

Cleric: "Cleric LFG !!!!"
Groupleader: "Do you have ML5 ?"
Cleric: "erm... no"
Groupleader: "nm then"

I got lost count of the amount of times I got asked "you don't have ml x ???" or "don't you have artifact ability y?". Of course you don't *really* need them, but it's also possible to hit the frontier at lvl 25. But that doesn't mean you're going to enjoy it much.

 

[NeonBlue]

You playing a different game ?

If people couldnt be arsed getting at least ONE character ML'd & ToA - seriously your playing the wrong type of game.

or it could be that they seriously brought out the wrong type of expansion. Ppl who spent the last 2/3yrs kitting out their chars, thought bollocks to this i aint spending another "x" amount of months kitting out my chars with artis/MLs just to line Mythics pockets some more., then to get foooked over again on the next expansion.

Ppl like that wasnt playing the wrong game , they just woke up and smelt the coffee

 

[NeonBlue]

NF was a welcome shot in the arm for RvR. The only people who don't like it are the ones who find anything more complex than CS with swords beyond their comprehension.

Funny how the 1s who say that OF was shite and NF is tonnes better is those who use to "cry" they couldnt compete in old NF or always complained they got steamrolled by the gank groups.

Instead of doing something about it and putting regualr groups together and learning how to beat the said gank groups.

Its easier to come on here flame everyone who liked OF and then compare them to some school kid who plays CS...just because they can now RvR safely by standing in a keep or tower for several hours

you must be proud !

You don't need artifacts and MLs. This is a common misconception. Ubergroups need them to compete withother ubergroups. The vast mass of people who aren't trying to compete at that level don't need them. I have a capped temlate on my Cleric with only one artifact which is not even level 10 (Kalares Necklace). My Paladin has two artifacts. On each I have only one very useful ML ability, both of which are situational (Siegemaster and Font of Power). .

Of course you need at least artifacts to compete in RvR, unless you want to be the only caster without 10% casting speed, or the only stealther without stealthlore, or the only tank who doesnt hit for 300+ because you havent got battler or malice.

Of course you can RvR without artifacts or MLs, but you wouldnt last 20secs in a 1v1 fight because the dmg output now caused by the artis is off balance. Not to mention all the nice little "procs" you get from the artis.

Your idea of RvR might be standing around in number "x" tower or keep for several hours, in which case yes a Sc'ed char would be ok...but it aint my idea of RvR...infact id rather watch paint dry.

You can 'get ToA' without having to put the hours in. You can buy nice drops from CMs for less than crafted stuff these days, Fill in with a couple of soloable or easy to get artifacts and you're away fairly painlessly.

hmm dunno which CMs u been looking at...but i bought a pair of 99% crafted cloth boots the other day for 20g...but yet the cheapest TOA random drop boots were 200g.

Since TOA prices have been silly...ppl think they can charge silly amounts for the crapest ROG.

If your willing to wait around days to find the right stuff for ur char, then yes you can get them cheap enough, but saying you can get "TOA" without having to put the hours in, is just plain bollocks.

1) You can farm the drops you need yourself, but might take some time
2) You can buy the said items from a CM but might take time for the items to show up on the CMs
3) To be able to do "2" your gonna need cash, if you havent got the required amount then ur gonna need to put in a few hours maybe farming


Whichever way you do it..to get "TOA" as you called it..is gonna take some time and effort, whether its getting the drops or the cash to buy them

 

[Phuzzy]

Success or failure in ToA is so heavilly dependant on luck, but before you even get that far you have to have enough in-game contacts to raise the amount of people required for whatever ML/arte you need. The alliance I'm in seldom has enough people on to raise a FG, let alone one faintly resembling optimum.

 

[Gamah]

hmm dunno which CMs u been looking at...but i bought a pair of 99% crafted cloth boots the other day for 20g...but yet the cheapest TOA random drop

Probably the prydwen ones where prices are not retarded.

 

[Marc]

To be honest, most of the people who left with NF have moved on now and wont come back even for an SI server.

 

[chretien]

Funny how the 1s who say that OF was shite and NF is tonnes better is those who use to "cry" they couldnt compete in old NF or always complained they got steamrolled by the gank groups.

I never cried about it. I tried it didn't like it. Tried it a different way, still didn't like it. For me and the vast majority of players who don't run in set groups, OF was crap. NF didn't miraculously give us a chance against the gank groups, it didn't suddenly make a group of randoms equal to a opted group, it gave that group of randoms more choice and a chance to avoid the gankgroups. In NF if I get rolled by a RR9+ hib or Mid grup I can go somewhere else and still have a good chance to find some action. In OF that was pretty impossible.

Instead of doing something about it and putting regualr groups together and learning how to beat the said gank groups.

Because it's that easy isn't it? Different people play for different reasons. I play with my friends. If they are PvEing then so will I, if they want to RvR, I'll go with them. I never wanted to be in a group where I could pwn everything I saw, extending my e-peen was never one of my motivations. All I want when I do go and RvR is that I can enjoy it. Getting rolled repeatedly with no realistic chance to avoid it isn't fun. I don't expect to win against the best guild groups, I expect to be able to go out and find some fun. I expect to die a few times, win a few times and enjoy it.

Its easier to come on here flame everyone who liked OF and then compare them to some school kid who plays CS...just because they can now RvR safely by standing in a keep or tower for several hours

you must be proud !

I disagree with the original poster. Everything he said was pretty untrue. Possible to get group invites in Epic? No adds? Right I don't remember it being like that at all. I remember people whinging on BW about standing onthe pad for days spamming LFG. I remember the whines about the FG RvR with another 3FG on stick that used to get thrown at every RvR guild on the server.

Of course you need at least artifacts to compete in RvR, unless you want to be the only caster without 10% casting speed, or the only stealther without stealthlore, or the only tank who doesnt hit for 300+ because you havent got battler or malice.

My Cleric has capped casting speed, capped plus overcapped dex, capped +heal and capped +buffs as well as most other things capped or close to with only Kalares Necklace. To be honest I could swap it for any decent utility neckie and not lose anything really. You can get important bonuses without artifacts. Specific artifact abilities are nice but for most people they're optional.

Of course you can RvR without artifacts or MLs, but you wouldnt last 20secs in a 1v1 fight because the dmg output now caused by the artis is off balance. Not to mention all the nice little "procs" you get from the artis.

Your idea of RvR might be standing around in number "x" tower or keep for several hours, in which case yes a Sc'ed char would be ok...but it aint my idea of RvR...infact id rather watch paint dry.

I don't do 1v1. I do siege warfare with may Pally and 8v8 with my Cleric. Standing around in a keep for hours is boring which is why I don't do it. On both my main RvR characters I have a total of about three spellcrafted items, the rest are drops, quest items or artifacts. It's not hard to put together a good suit these days without having to put in a lot of farming time.

hmm dunno which CMs u been looking at...but i bought a pair of 99% crafted cloth boots the other day for 20g...but yet the cheapest TOA random drop boots were 200g.

Since TOA prices have been silly...ppl think they can charge silly amounts for the crapest ROG.

Then you have the spellcrafting to add to that. I bought a ML2 hauberk for my cleric for a plat off a CM. No way I could make a MP chain hauberk with my own LGM crafter for close to that price let alone get it imbued.

If your willing to wait around days to find the right stuff for ur char, then yes you can get them cheap enough, but saying you can get "TOA" without having to put the hours in, is just plain bollocks.

1) You can farm the drops you need yourself, but might take some time
2) You can buy the said items from a CM but might take time for the items to show up on the CMs
3) To be able to do "2" your gonna need cash, if you havent got the required amount then ur gonna need to put in a few hours maybe farming

Whichever way you do it..to get "TOA" as you called it..is gonna take some time and effort, whether its getting the drops or the cash to buy them

Not a lot more than it did before. MP suit in pre ToA days was 15-25p. 99% suit was around 4. Add in anything from 2-10 plat for spellcrafting and alchemy etc and that's a lot of money when the best source of income was still DF. Nowadays you can get ROGs or just normal drops which crap all over the utility of SCed gear for a few hundred gold off CMs or by farming encounters for less time than it would have taken to farm and hinge all those seals.

 

[NeonBlue]

I never cried about it. I tried it didn't like it. Tried it a different way, still didn't like it. For me and the vast majority of players who don't run in set groups, OF was crap. NF didn't miraculously give us a chance against the gank groups, it didn't suddenly make a group of randoms equal to a opted group, it gave that group of randoms more choice and a chance to avoid the gankgroups. In NF if I get rolled by a RR9+ hib or Mid grup I can go somewhere else and still have a good chance to find some action. In OF that was pretty impossible..

Yes NF gave the random/casual players more chance to RvR without getting steamrolled...but as with anything in these types of games.TEAMWORK is more important to a degree than being in a set group. To say OF was crap for you because you didnt/couldnt run in a set group to me sounds like an excuse for not trying with friends and trying as a TEAM rather than a set group..but yes ill be 1st to admit that especially with Albs there had to be certain core classes in a group.

Hmmm in OF you could port Hib/Mid or go out in Alb frontier..dont see how u say it was impossible to avoid gank groups..if you knew the gank groups were out say in Emain...then you port Odins. Yes in NF you have bigger areas so therefore more chance to avoid such groups, but ur making it sound like in OF u didnt have a choice...which you did, to me ur saying u never took it.

But the templars never took RvR seriously anyways, they always took things laid back, so i really cant see the problem or why u feel the need to have "a go" at ppl just because they dont agree with ur opinions of TOA/NF.

Before i get jumped on for having a go at you, am not, am trying to put across points that i feel ppl are not seeing/missing with regards to OF/TOA etc

Because it's that easy isn't it? Different people play for different reasons. I play with my friends. If they are PvEing then so will I, if they want to RvR, I'll go with them. I never wanted to be in a group where I could pwn everything I saw, extending my e-peen was never one of my motivations. All I want when I do go and RvR is that I can enjoy it. Getting rolled repeatedly with no realistic chance to avoid it isn't fun. I don't expect to win against the best guild groups, I expect to be able to go out and find some fun. I expect to die a few times, win a few times and enjoy it..

I never went out to "pwn" everything either...i got my enjoyment out of playing with ppl who knew how to play as a TEAM, who knew what to do in a given situation etc, this resulted in us playing well and winning us fights, thus making it even more enjoyable.

As for getting "rolled" repeatedly there's 2 things you could of done there,

1) cry about it and give up
2) get a group of players together, learn to play as a TEAM and try beating those doing the rolling, if you had tried you might of been pleasantly suprised how fun it is trying to beat a group like that, and even sometimes actually beating them.

. I remember the whines about the FG RvR with another 3FG on stick that used to get thrown at every RvR guild on the server

nah that was just AOD, because as they say no smoke without fire


end of the day ppl are going to disagree on TOA/NF, each person plays it differently,each person has a different opinion on it.

Just annoys me when ppl slate others for their views on TOA/NF and use silly remarks like " extending my e-peen" or they should go back to "playing CS", just because they dont agree.

Yes OF to some ppl was no fun, but like anything else, for those who put in the time and effort of playing with set ppl and learning as a TEAM, they had fun, those who whined about OF ive found were either too lazy or too busy crying to do that and therefore in my view foooked up their own fun!

 

[chretien]

Yes NF gave the random/casual players more chance to RvR without getting steamrolled...but as with anything in these types of games.TEAMWORK is more important to a degree than being in a set group. To say OF was crap for you because you couldnt get into a set group to me sounds like an excuse.

But the templars never took RvR seriously anyways, they always took things laid back, so i really cant see the problem or why u feel the need to have "a go" at ppl just because they dont agree with ur opinions of TOA/NF

Hmmm in OF you could port Hib/Mid or go out in Alb frontier..dont see how u say it was impossible to avoid gank groups..if you knew the gank groups were out say in Emain...then you port Odins. Yes in NF you have bigger areas so therefore more chance to avoid such groups, but ur making it sound like in OF u didnt have a choice...which you did, to me ur saying u never took it.

Such a choice. I could either port back to Emain and hope to break through the MG again. 'C'mon boys, I know we got wiped by the 3fg+15 archers the last 17 times but this time we'll do it! For Arthur etc!' or I could port to Odins or run to Hadrians and wander round an empty zone for a while. Occasionally we'd try to spice things up by taking Bled but usually all that happened was we either took it and nobody cared or a couple of groups of Hibs would wait for a guard pop and wipe us out while we were on the doors.

I never went out to "pwn" everything either...i got my enjoyment out of playing with ppl who knew how to play as a TEAM, who knew what to do in a given situation etc, this resulted in us playing well and winning us fights, thus making it even more enjoyable.

As for getting "rolled" repeatedly there's 2 things you could of done there,

1) cry about it and give up
2) get a group of players together, learn to play as a TEAM and try beating those doing the rolling, if you had tried you might of been pleasantly suprised how fun it is trying to beat a group like that, and even sometimes actually beating them.

As I said we never played like that. Even when the Templars were a large guild, our RvR groups consisted of whoever was online at the time. We had some great individual players - Xyliana, Graendel, Shanaia, Levin and so on but we weren't interested in playing for the sake of winning - well most of us weren't anyway. We experimented with 'opted groups' but it never suited our playstyles. We never 'cried that we couldn't win' we just stopped because it wasn't fun for most of us. I guess it's hard to understand from your point of view. You see RvR as the main point of the game, I see the game as the main point of the game. I play for the sake of playing, whatever it is - crafting, PvEing, RvRing, sat in my house chatting to my friends or whatever. RvR is no more important to me than any other part of the game. I'd like to enjoy it and I found that NF changed a lot of the things I didn't enjoy about OF.

end of the day ppl are going to disagree on TOA/NF, each person plays it differently,each person has a different opinion on it.

Just annoys me when ppl slate others for their views on TOA/NF and use silly remarks like " extending my e-peen" or they should go back to "playing CS", just because they dont agree.

Yes OF to some ppl was no fun, but like anything else, for those who put in the time and effort of playing with set ppl and learning as a TEAM, they had fun, those who whined about OF ive found were either too lazy or too busy crying to do that and therefore in my view foooked up their own fun!

I've played in more or less opted groups, it's fun but it's not for everyone. I have a unreliable schedule which makes it impossible for me to commit to a set group. A lot of people are in the same boat, as I said we don't expect to win against Maelstrom or TDD, we just want to have the chance to go and have some fun. Think of it like a football league. If there was only one football league for everyone and you were in a local pub team and you repeatedly got drawn against Premiership sides, you'd not take too kindly to the advice 'well if you trained 100 hours a week with the same team day in and day out you'd maybe enjoy it more. And yes, I know there's a difference between professional footballers and being good at DAoC but the comparison stands.

 

[NeonBlue]

stuff

Like you correctly pointed out i bought the game and played the game for RvR...not to "pwn" everyone or anything but because that side of the game appealed to me the most and thats what i enjoyed the most.

So i may see things differently to you...and you will see things differently to me

like i said ppl will always beg to differ on OF/TOA/NF depending on how they play the game and for what reasons.

But instead of whine/argue/fight over these points id rather try and have a sensible debate over em, which i know is very hard to do on these boards

 

[Raven]

they should give us back old frontiers but keep the new keeps (get rid of the towers) and maybe make it so you can port near the emeny PKs, also get rid of the mile gates.

 

[Shanaia]

o0 so many suggestions... and we all want something slighty different.

Could it be that no matter what server GOA/Mythic makes/offers there will be people unhappy with it? Always people that want it a patch later or earlier? Old frontiers with new keeps .. new frontiers with old keeps ... no milegates more milegates...

Could it be that no matter how hard you try there is no way to make each and every person happy?

naaaah

 

[Phuzzy]

Personally I really liked OF.
There were a ton of places in Hib OF where you could go & XP undisturbed from 20-50. Nowadays you can go XP where you want in Hib frontier & guaranteed a RR8+ Minstrel will gank you within 10 minutes, even at L20.
But then, I knew Hib OF so well you could've dropped me there blindfolded by parachute & I could've told you within a pixel where I was just by the number of lost golf balls.
I even liked MGs.
When Hibtron was camping AMG I'd just go to Odins & roam.
Those were the days before artes/ML-abilities when a Warden was more than just a stressed-out rezz+rebuff+resistbot. We could contribute a lot to a decent group & actually beat a same-RR Skald or Minstrel or even an Inf!!! solo in those days if we used all our abilities skillfully & had a bit of luck.
Of course after ToA it became like most classes - wether or not you won 1-on-1 depended on how many I-WIN!!1! abilities you had from artes/ML-abilities.
No I-WIN!!1! buttons = no chance.
That's when the fun went out of RvR, and DAoC became a PvE MMORPG for me.