Old days Prydwen: economics

[Krill]

I'm not sure if many will remember me but I played Prydwen for a good two years or more from open beta on. I doubt many know but in real life I work in a University doing research and teaching and toward the end of my days I got interested in writing about what happened during my time on Prydwen. Academic work is slow to appear and this is the first time anything has gotten into the public domain but I thought it might be worth letting you know it exists. Of course, academic work also mainly speaks to other academics so you may find this even duller than doing ml1 again. It's about the economics of buying gold for real world money back a year or so ago when you could still do that on Prydwen.

Find it here: http://www.fastcapitalism.com/, look for edition 1.2 article called 'Virtual Economics and Twenty First Century Leisure'. Enjoy or ignore as you will.

And hello to any who still remember me. I can be found in Warcraft these days, under the iron rule of Roo's guild, for those who remember him.

 

[Heta]

I remember Krill!!

 

[Heta]

but I dont get it, where is something about prydwen?

 

[Krill]

Click through to edition 1.2, (sorry I didn't design the site and they don't provide a way of linking directly to the article) and look down for an article by Tim Jordan called 'Virtual Economics and Twenty-First Century Leisure', if you scroll through it you'll find fascinating facts like in August 2004 you could buy 247 pryd gold for one British pound.

 

[Straef]

Direct link here.

 

[Bag]

Hey Uncle Krill

 

[Kalgarn]

heya krill,not missing your thane to much?say hello to roo and the others there

 

[SkarIronfist]

Get your ass back online you lazy git. We still have your pipe and slippers in the guild house ready for your return.

 

[Krill]

Get your ass back online you lazy git. We still have your pipe and slippers in the guild house ready for your return.

Hah Skar, you say that to all the oldtimers! I bet you can cut and paste it now. I miss realmwar but otherwise, I'm a happy where I am.

 

[Kryin]

/salute Krill

btw you might wanna check out some info about "Project Entropia" only MMORPG sofar except Poker where you exchange IRL money for ingame money via the gamehost .

 

[Oldbone|Ramble]

Hi Krill!

How are you old friend? still got contact with Ayam?

 

[Cylian]

hrm, Krill, Kalgarn and Kryin ... there's something odd about the posters in this thread!

a) their names start with a "K" !
b) they're from the stoneage of DAoC!

sooo, where exactly do you hang around now ?

Hi Krill!

How are you old friend? still got contact with Ayam?

and what happened to the imaginary pink elephant ?

 

[xenia-]

Hey Krill

Skar is right, we have all kinds of stuff waiting for you

I only just renewed myself after 6 months or so away due to work but nothing quite like logging into that silly game again

Hope you are doing well in whatever other worlds you travel

 

[Krill]

Oooh, so many old friends. Hope you're all well in your various worlds. I currently hang out in Warcraft <hears boos and hisses from the back rows> on Shadow Moon server, guild called Ancient Shadows in which you'd find quite a few old Nyd and Fedayken hands. I'm called Iagdtod there, though there is a Krill as well who wanders out occasionally. Oldbone asked about Ayam and he's there, though I think the pink elephant may have got lost on the way. If I had three lives I'd still be in DAOC, but the time commitment from mmpogs is making it hard for me to stay happy even in Warcraft.

Project Entropie is very interesting, the space station sold for what $100,000? And an island for $20,000 or so? I might have them reversed but I haven't looked at it closely yet. Sony let you sell and exchange stuff via a site they run for some Everquest II servers, you might have seen Mythic heavily criticising Sony when it was announce.

 

[Mobius]

Hey Krill. I remember you running around Yggdra alot.

 

[Kalgarn]

hrm, Krill, Kalgarn and Kryin ... there's something odd about the posters in this thread!

a) their names start with a "K" !
b) they're from the stoneage of DAoC!

hehe,i'm actually thinking of comming back soon if i get hold of a credit card (they should have prepaid cards like WoW )
should keep me busy for a while,need to check out housing,ToA,NF,catacombs and get to rr10...2 year is a long time

 

[Krakatau]

The letter K rocks

 

[klavrynd]

it most certainly does!

Hi there krillmuffin my beloved zucchinithane

... ehm since everyone allready said and asked all that i had in mind i'll stick to ... daoc is bad for you!

 

[Kryin]

@Cylian this is where im been hiding out mainly

@Kalgarn abuse your mothers creditcard it atleast worked a few years ago
http://www.rogue.com/images/UpdatedLabels/CrustyXS.gif

 

[Jonaldo]

Fight The Daoc!!

 

[Kalgarn]

@Kalgarn abuse your mothers creditcard it atleast worked a few years ago

hehe,i used a rl friends cc back then.he was in EoO too for a while,dwarf thane called leifgrid if you remember him.
but he doesn't have a cc anymore so can't use his.and i've been living alone for 6 years don't see my parents alot so that's no option

 

[St.Anger]

Hey Kal, good to see you might be returning, I just hope U don't want your account back ?

 

[Jimmae]

eh up krill good to see you kicking around the daoc forums

 

[Kalgarn]

Hey Kal, good to see you might be returning, I just hope U don't want your account back ?

haha,nah you can keep that account.good to see you're still around eroma

 

[Tasslehoff]

Nice to see you Krill!

 

[Borf]

call me nuts, but I actually read the whole article

I myself am a student at the technical university of Delft (The Netherlands) and being a technical student you could say i'm "naturally" interested in computers and it's software.

I've played DAoC from beta till ToA, when RL forced me to leave the scene and never come back. Like you, Krill, i've enjoyed my time and questioned the scene concerning ebay and real versus virtual money.

It's nice to see that people actually take their time to think and write academical articles about these things and I hope/think that within the next few years the word "marketing" might be a little broader with the growth of virtual comunities like you wrote about.


Personally I think your story makes alot of sense and I think more and more people will put 'their lives' into the game to make some real money. When people need/want something, there is a market!
I'm eager to read more about this subject and I hope you'll keep 'studying' these phenomenoms onces again

Greetz,

Borf


Ps: Sorry for any misspelling, English isn't my native language.

 

[Krill]

Nice to see so many familiar faces. I was rifling through a load of screenshots a while ago and feeling very nostalgic, I'll never play again as much as I did DAOC because like Klav says it can be bad for you.

Thanks for reading it Borf and I'm glad it made some sense. I'm hoping to do more of this kind of work, trying to set up an even bigger study of Wow economics along the same lines. It's interesting there's no public evidence at all about whether gold farmers drive prices up or not. Most of us assume they do but some claim they can drive prices down by providing more rare items in a game.

 

[Borf]

Thanks for reading it Borf and I'm glad it made some sense. I'm hoping to do more of this kind of work, trying to set up an even bigger study of Wow economics along the same lines. It's interesting there's no public evidence at all about whether gold farmers drive prices up or not. Most of us assume they do but some claim they can drive prices down by providing more rare items in a game.

I'm eager to read more of this. So if you ever write another article, please let us know!

About WoW and it's market. My brother had one account and I had the chance to look over his shoulder and see the marketing in his view.

Still the fact is the same like you bescribed it in your article. People put effort to gain virtual money/goods and sell them for real cash. The question you might ask yourself is whether the "standard" marketing rules apply in these area. What I mean with this is, does the quantity of demand influences the price and vice versa: does the quantity of prividers influences the price?
In the real world we all learn this in basic economy lessons. The more goods there are to sell, the cheaper they are. that's the main reason why monopolists have such a strong hold on the market and thus it's price, they are the only one!

Now in MMORPG's you can't have a monopolist, nor even olygopolistical system, where two or three people 'own' the market of selling 'their hours of gameplay and thus virtual money' for real cash. the reason is simple; A lot of player can easily join the market as provider AND/OR buyer. There are no regulations, no step to make or infiltrate the market by going under the usual price to make a stand, because you don't have grand basic investments, you don't need to make alot of commercials of yourself to make a name. Just put your goods on the market and people will buy it, whether or not your name is familiar with them. This is different then in the real world. Why? Because in the real world you have a differents between goods. They are never identical, allways there is some quality differents or the ingredients are different.

In virtual games the gamemakers already exterminated that variable. All goods are of the same quality. If it says it the 'Red handed Bandit Axe' then it IS that Axe. And all axes wearing that name have the same quality. So it doesn't matter whether or not you buy the good from a familiar name or not, simply because you can trust the quality of others aswell.

conclusion: Prices aren't that fluent like a stockmarket or like in some marketingraces. Prices are simple and direct. It's being influenced by two main factors:
1) What are buyers willing to pay for it (as low as possible)
2) How much do the providers want to get for their effort (in money/hour) (the higher the better ofcourse)

Where these two lines cross eachother you have the 'final' price. This will ofcourse fluctuate a little when people are in a good/bad mood. But overal the final price is swift to settle and won't chance much.
(sidenote: this price is VERY depended on it's server. You often saw differents in prices between Prydwen and Excaliber, it depends on the two variable given above)


This is how I see it, hope you agree (atleast a bit )

Greetz,

Borf


Ps: English still ain't my native language, my apoligies if I miss spelled something and I hope you understand what I say

 

[mordsythe]

Just read the article sitting at work. I was wondering the exact same things that your article wasa talking about. Just yesterday i paid "Real life" cash for "in game" cash.

to be totally honest the prices varied depending on where i looked for it. if you go to "recognized" sites then you know for sure that when your money is recieved by them then your goods will be delivered to you no matter what.

if you go through a "middle man" or buy it off a player there is no gaurantee that the money you pay will get you the goods you require. therefore the market will fluxuate dependant on the amount or "ledgitimate" businessmen and "crooks".

i will admit that i was a little worried as it was the first time i had done this and therefore was not entirely sure of how it would work and if it would go ahead but after the transaction i was most relieved. i think this feeling could contribute also to a fluxuation in the prices as a lot of people will not want to pay large amounts of real money to "JOE BLOGGS" as they are not gauranteed to get their goods.. and if you dont get your goods who can u complain to?? if you moan at goa/mythic they will just tell you that it serves you right and possibly even ban your account for trying to (in their eyes) "cheat".

well thats my thoughts on the matter and i would love to hear you guys feedback on it all :worthy:

 

[d34k]

The Krill!