New lag?

Milky

Fledgling Freddie
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Jan 8, 2004
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Last couple of days I suffer a constant yellow/red (middle box) lag.

Im from Holland and have ADSL (planet)

Does anyone have the same problem ?


Sollers
 

Berthold

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Milky said:
Last couple of days I suffer a constant yellow/red (middle box) lag.
Im from Holland and have ADSL (planet)
Does anyone have the same problem ?
Sollers

Yup from UK went Ld several times this week for no reason often getting red and yellow boxes
 

majik

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I did but my modem restarted a few of these times, so I presumed it was hardware problems.
 

Flimgoblin

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not had much lag - hte occasional spike over the past week - but it's not constant yellow...

run a traceroute or download pingplotter, can't remember the IPs off hand though - I'm sure someone who's not about to start a raid will be able to find them :)
 

IainC

English WAR Community Manager
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Flimgoblin said:
not had much lag - hte occasional spike over the past week - but it's not constant yellow...

run a traceroute or download pingplotter, can't remember the IPs off hand though - I'm sure someone who's not about to start a raid will be able to find them :)
Excalibur:- 193.252.123.177
Prydwen:- 193.252.123.33
Camlann:- 193.252.123.147
 

majik

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Also the lag I had only occured in ml9 dungeon and when I threw the modem off the desk.
 

Milky

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UndyingAngel said:
are you surprised ? :eek7:
in a way, since I thought they fixed that bullshit :(

I'm even more sad though, because I know how long it took them last time, and back then it was the whole community suffering. So I doubt they'll be in much of a rush when it's only a handful of people :(
 

UndyingAngel

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Milky said:
in a way, since I thought they fixed that bullshit :(

I'm even more sad though, because I know how long it took them last time, and back then it was the whole community suffering. So I doubt they'll be in much of a rush when it's only a handful of people :(

well we have had this lag on and off since 1.69 now.. I dont think its gonna go away anytime soon :E what ever someone did screwed it up.... tbh I think there is a probelm with the link between OT and GOA server.. a miss configured router/switch. heh for all we know one of the ppl @ GoA has P2P software runnig downloading that Goat Porn again ;) or ever a virus that keep flooding the network with random packets. We will probely never know.. but mabey just mabey they might find and fix the probelm ! :cheers:
 

old.Whoodoo

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majik said:
Also the lag I had only occured in ml9 dungeon and when I threw the modem off the desk.
LOL! :clap: First person to admit their lag was caused by something other than GOA, priceless :)

Shame others dont add the truth too:

"I was just finishing my pr0n download"
"I share a connection with the rest of the warez guys I live with"
"56k is kewl to play on these days, very retro ya know."
"Mt 486 was OK before TOA..."
 

Gear

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Milky said:
in a way, since I thought they fixed that bullshit :(

I'm even more sad though, because I know how long it took them last time, and back then it was the whole community suffering. So I doubt they'll be in much of a rush when it's only a handful of people :(

It is not even close to the lag we used to have sometime back. Yes there are a few spikes, but it is quite bareable. The only thing that's really pissing me off is having to follow a lag ghost for half a minute :p
 

Milky

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old.Whoodoo said:
LOL! :clap: First person to admit their lag was caused by something other than GOA, priceless :)

Shame others dont add the truth too:

"I was just finishing my pr0n download"
"I share a connection with the rest of the warez guys I live with"
"56k is kewl to play on these days, very retro ya know."
"Mt 486 was OK before TOA..."
1) I never download pr0n, I have a girlfriend for all of my sexual needs
2) Me and my girlfriend live together, no one else lives in our house
3) We have ADSL
4) My girlfriend and I both use a P4 with a Raedon 9800 pro


So kindly shut up, it's bad enough that I'm not getting what I am paying for; I don't need some teenage kid acting popular drawing (idiotic) conclusions without knowledge of the matters going.


Sollers
 

IainC

English WAR Community Manager
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Milky said:
1) I never download pr0n, I have a girlfriend for all of my sexual needs
2) Me and my girlfriend live together, no one else lives in our house
3) We have ADSL
4) My girlfriend and I both use a P4 with a Raedon 9800 pro


So kindly shut up, it's bad enough that I'm not getting what I am paying for; I don't need some teenage kid acting popular drawing (idiotic) conclusions without knowledge of the matters going.


Sollers
You can have a 10MB line witha rock solid ISP, a ninja computer and still get lag connecting to a server without the lag being the fault of either us, your ISP or your PC configuration. If those three things where the only elements in connecting across the internet the work of network admins would be a whole lot simpler.
 

Milky

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Requiel said:
You can have a 10MB line witha rock solid ISP, a ninja computer and still get lag connecting to a server without the lag being the fault of either us, your ISP or your PC configuration. If those three things where the only elements in connecting across the internet the work of network admins would be a whole lot simpler.
That's most likely the reason why we all pay high monthly fees, to keep this 'complex' system running. And since I pay good money, I expect results as well. I Sent emails and made phonecalls to the companies I pay well for their services, it's up to them to fix stuff if the service is broke. I couldn't care less whether it's rocket-science material, I assume people at those companies know what they are doing.

Sollers
 

IainC

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Milky said:
That's most likely the reason why we all pay high monthly fees, to keep this 'complex' system running. And since I pay good money, I expect results as well. I Sent emails and made phonecalls to the companies I pay well for their services, it's up to them to fix stuff if the service is broke. I couldn't care less whether it's rocket-science material, I assume people at those companies know what they are doing.

Sollers
Nope you're paying for them to maintain the bits they are responsible for. You pay us to keep server up and in good order, you pay your ISP for conecctivity from your house to their backbone. Between your ISP and our servers are a whole bunch of companies that neither you nor we pay a penny to. TYhe point I made is that your ISP can be working perfectly, our network can be absolutely perfect but if there is a random hub in the middle of Europe having problems you may still get lag. Not your fault, not your ISP's fault, not our fault and there's nothing that any of us can do to resolve it directly. It's to do with the way that the internet works which is out of the hands of any one person or company.
 

Milky

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Requiel said:
Nope you're paying for them to maintain the bits they are responsible for. You pay us to keep server up and in good order, you pay your ISP for conecctivity from your house to their backbone. Between your ISP and our servers are a whole bunch of companies that neither you nor we pay a penny to. TYhe point I made is that your ISP can be working perfectly, our network can be absolutely perfect but if there is a random hub in the middle of Europe having problems you may still get lag. Not your fault, not your ISP's fault, not our fault and there's nothing that any of us can do to resolve it directly. It's to do with the way that the internet works which is out of the hands of any one person or company.
So what you say is that there is a whole bunch of companies whose services we use, but that we don't pay a penny to. That seems rather unlogic.

Point of it all is, I Pay you money to play DAoC in a normal way. If it doesn't work, you are the people I deal with. Not the other companies, I'm dealing with you. And you in your turn are undoubtedly in contact with other companies on which your service relies on.

If I was to buy a washing machine at company A and they promise to deliver it to my house and the Delivery company (company B) crashes their truck and thus my waching machine, it's company A I deal with. Them I made a deal with, whatever happens between their store and my house is their responsibility.
 

Quinlan

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Milky said:
So what you say is that there is a whole bunch of companies whose services we use, but that we don't pay a penny to. That seems rather unlogic.

Point of it all is, I Pay you money to play DAoC in a normal way. If it doesn't work, you are the people I deal with. Not the other companies, I'm dealing with you. And you in your turn are undoubtedly in contact with other companies on which your service relies on.


If I was to buy a washing machine at company A and they promise to deliver it to my house and the Delivery company (company B) crashes their truck and thus my waching machine, it's company A I deal with. Them I made a deal with, whatever happens between their store and my house is their responsibility.
There are alot of companies inbetween your ISP and GOA that you go thorugh. Those companies basically get paid by the ISP's/countries. So seeing your logic your not gonna deal with GOA but with your ISP. Now aint that funny

And before you start saying but i pay for daoc. You didnt get your internet connection so you could play DAOC. You got your internet for pron downloading and happened to also be able to play DAOC thanks to having your connection.
 

IainC

English WAR Community Manager
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Milky said:
So what you say is that there is a whole bunch of companies whose services we use, but that we don't pay a penny to. That seems rather unlogic.

Point of it all is, I Pay you money to play DAoC in a normal way. If it doesn't work, you are the people I deal with. Not the other companies, I'm dealing with you. And you in your turn are undoubtedly in contact with other companies on which your service relies on.

If I was to buy a washing machine at company A and they promise to deliver it to my house and the Delivery company (company B) crashes their truck and thus my waching machine, it's company A I deal with. Them I made a deal with, whatever happens between their store and my house is their responsibility.
But that's not how the internet works.
We are responsible for maintaining servers and keeping our network open to connections. Your route to us is not part of that responsibility. Your analogy with the washing machine company isn't valid as we aren't responsible for the connection from your house to our servers. We don't 'deliver' the game to you, we make it available and you have to arrange your own connection to our servers.

The nearest analogy is to imagine the DAoC servers as a shop and the internet as the road network between your house and our shop. If the roads are busy or there's been an accident and traffic is going very slowly through a major junction, we aren't responsible for that as we have nothing to do with the state of the roads. The internet is the same, there are very large companies who operate the internet infrastructure across which you connect. Those companies are nothing to do with our service or your subs. you connect across them becuase their part of the internet is between you and us but you don't pay for them to run it and neither do we. They mostly get money from governments and very large ISPs/service providers.
 

Milky

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Quinlan said:
There are alot of companies inbetween your ISP and GOA that you go thorugh. Those companies basically get paid by the ISP's. So seeing your logic your not gonna deal with GOA but with your ISP. Now aint that funny
"Not your fault, not your ISP's fault, not our fault and there's nothing that any of us can do to resolve it directly" - Requiel

Company A in my example can be both GOA and my ISP of course, so I took the problem to them both. However, what annoys me is that one of the companies I deal with is desperately trying to blame others.

"You can have a 10MB line witha rock solid ISP, a ninja computer and still get lag connecting to a server without the lag being the fault of either us, your ISP or your PC configuration."- Requiel

It's always someone's fault, and either my isp or GOA is responsible.

And ain't it funny that someone damn well knows that they are responsible, but still try to bullshit their way out? Or didn't you suffer from the OpenTransit lag the past months? :eek:
 

Milky

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Requiel said:
But that's not how the internet works.
We are responsible for maintaining servers and keeping our network open to connections. Your route to us is not part of that responsibility. Your analogy with the washing machine company isn't valid as we aren't responsible for the connection from your house to our servers. We don't 'deliver' the game to you, we make it available and you have to arrange your own connection to our servers.

The nearest analogy is to imagine the DAoC servers as a shop and the internet as the road network between your house and our shop. If the roads are busy or there's been an accident and traffic is going very slowly through a major junction, we aren't responsible for that as we have nothing to do with the state of the roads. The internet is the same, there are very large companies who operate the internet infrastructure across which you connect. Those companies are nothing to do with our service or your subs. you connect across them becuase their part of the internet is between you and us but you don't pay for them to run it and neither do we. They mostly get money from governments and very large ISPs/service providers.

Tell me Requiel then please, how can you be dependent on them without having any contact/insurance? What if their 'roads' will be closed for a year without them fixing it? That would mean the end of your game, that can't be the case can it?
 

Quinlan

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Milky said:
"Not your fault, not your ISP's fault, not our fault and there's nothing that any of us can do to resolve it directly" - Requiel

Company A in my example can be both GOA and my ISP of course, so I took the problem to them both. However, what annoys me is that one of the companies I deal with is desperately trying to blame others.
Trust me when you call planet internet you will here the same thing from them. That their network is fine so something else is wrong. Welcome to the real world.

And fyi i am dutch too and havent had any problems lately.

Milky said:
"You can have a 10MB line witha rock solid ISP, a ninja computer and still get lag connecting to a server without the lag being the fault of either us, your ISP or your PC configuration."- Requiel

It's always someone's fault, and either my isp or GOA is responsible.

And ain't it funny that someone damn well knows that they are responsible, but still try to bullshit their way out? Or didn't you suffer from the OpenTransit lag the past months? :eek:
Yes it is someone's fault. If i recall right you said opentransit was the reason in your pingplot. Well opentransit <> Goa. Get that in your skull and think again. Goa try to get it resolved but they are not able to say fix now. Maybe if some high France Telecom person says to opentransit fix it now it works. But if they dont Goa is kinda at a loss

Stop thinking your living in an ideal world
 

Quinlan

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Milky said:
Tell me Requiel then please, how can you be dependent on them without having any contact/insurance? What if their 'roads' will be closed for a year without them fixing it? That would mean the end of your game, that can't be the case can it?
Jezus. Let's take the A2 near eindhoven. Just redone. Traffic jams around that area where horendous at times. The only things the companies who's people where in the traffic jam could do is complain. If those complaints dont get picked up not much they can do
 

IainC

English WAR Community Manager
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Milky said:
"Not your fault, not your ISP's fault, not our fault and there's nothing that any of us can do to resolve it directly" - Requiel

Company A in my example can be both GOA and my ISP of course, so I took the problem to them both. However, what annoys me is that one of the companies I deal with is desperately trying to blame others.

"You can have a 10MB line witha rock solid ISP, a ninja computer and still get lag connecting to a server without the lag being the fault of either us, your ISP or your PC configuration."- Requiel

It's always someone's fault, and either my isp or GOA is responsible.

And ain't it funny that someone damn well knows that they are responsible, but still try to bullshit their way out? Or didn't you suffer from the OpenTransit lag the past months? :eek:
It's not a case of trying to blame others. We may not know where the lag is coming from but we do know where it isn't coming from. We can't monitor every hub in Europe but we do monitor our own network and I can assure you that any lag you are getting is not coming from us.

I've explained how the internet works multiple times, twice in this thread and many, many times in other threads. I really don't want to keep having to say the same things over and over again. If you don't believe me ask around, Google for it, educate yourself. You will find that what I said is true and that it's entirely possible for neither Goa nor your ISP to be at fault when you get lag. When you have understood this fundamental point, you will have done youurself a favour as well by not holding to easily disprovable ideas.

milky said:
Tell me Requiel then please, how can you be dependent on them without having any contact/insurance? What if their 'roads' will be closed for a year without them fixing it? That would mean the end of your game, that can't be the case can it?
No because ISPs would route through a different set of 'roads'. There are a lot of different ways to get between any two points on the internet and the actual route you take may very well be different each time. Only if our host shut down would we be unreachable and then we'd obviously find a different host.
 

Milky

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Quinlan said:
Trust me when you call planet internet you will here the same thing from them. That their network is fine so something else is wrong. Welcome to the real world.

And fyi i am dutch too and havent had any problems lately.



Yes it is someone's fault. If i recall right you said opentransit was the reason in your pingplot. Well opentransit <> Goa. Get that in your skull and think again. Goa try to get it resolved but they are not able to say fix now. Maybe if some high France Telecom person says to opentransit fix it now it works. But if they dont Goa is kinda at a loss

Stop thinking your living in an ideal world

Well actually, I did call my ISP last night and they said they had more calls with the same complaint. The mechanic explained a thing or two to me about those companies in between and he told me they had a service-contract with them: whenever the connection broke down, mystery company had to fix it in a certain amount of time, if not.. KPN could start claiming. That's the real world, and since GOA is a real company as well, trust me.. they have these kind of contracts
 

Quinlan

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Milky said:
Well actually, I did call my ISP last night and they said they had more calls with the same complaint. The mechanic explained a thing or two to me about those companies in between and he told me they had a service-contract with them: whenever the connection broke down, mystery company had to fix it in a certain amount of time, if not.. KPN could start claiming. That's the real world, and since GOA is a real company as well, trust me.. they have these kind of contracts
If they dont fix it in time not much KPN can do besides send QQ mails. the small letters of those agreements protect both sides so trust me KPN wont claim anything. It is a Service level agreement they have. The company has to make sure it is all fine 99.9% of the time FE. Doesnt mean it cant be choppy for a week now and then
.

O and your basically saying your ISP has had more calls with the problem. So it seems they dont have something in order. BTW the 'mechanics' you get on the phone there arent mechanics..they are students/uitzendkrachten making some bucks
 

Milky

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Quinlan said:
If they dont fix it in time not much KPN can do besides send QQ mails. the small letters of those agreements protect both sides so trust me KPN wont claim anything. It is a Service level agreement they have. The company has to make sure it is all fine 99.9% of the time FE. Doesnt mean it cant be choppy for a week now and then
.

O and your basically saying your ISP has had more calls with the problem. So it seems they dont have something in order. BTW the 'mechanics' you get on the phone there arent mechanics..they are students/uitzendkrachten making some bucks
How would you know who I spoke 2? I did in fact talk to a mechanice after I kept nagging to a uitzendkracht to connect me through.
 

Quinlan

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i wouldnt but i am 95% sure you just spoke to uitzendkracht 2 ;p

a well musta made a nice story for them at the coffee machine
 

Puppet

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Ik had gisteren anders wel de mooiste lag mezzes van Prydwen Quin :p

"Bard: Where are you?"
"Fighting Beno guards"
"WTF how u get Beno guards"
"You pulled em"
"Im near Berk OTW tho xD"
 

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