Mythics coding vs. GOAs translation

[old.Prof]

I know there are several other similar threads running, but here come some facts :

Mythics release calendar :

1.45 : 07-02-2002
1.46 : 21-02-2002
1.47 : 05-03-2002
1.48 : 17-03-2002

GOAs release calendar (couldn't find back exact dates) :
1.45 : end of march
1.48 : end of june

It took Mythic LESS then 40 days the code + test it, it takes GOA 3 MONTHS to translate + test translation - and that's when all goes "as planned" !!


Can someone rationally explain why translation takes MORE THEN TWICE as long as the original development, coding + testing ? Why it takes GOA over a month to simply test a translation of that code, when Mythic clearly tests the original code at far higher speed ?

What's even worser is that GOA take FAR LONGER to translate then Mythic is coding stuff, so instead of making the gap between USA & EU version SMALLER, it's increasingly WIDENING, and at a frustratingly fast pace.

 

[cHodAX]

It's because GOA are French and they don't have to work hard, it is their god-given right to be a lazy arse over there....

 

[thefunkrocket]

Originally posted by cHodAX
It's because GOA are French and they don't have to work hard, it is their god-given right to be a lazy arse over there....

I'm not french, but does them being French really have anything to do with it?

Sorry bout not answering the question Prof

 

[Silence]

GOA are run by hamsters.

and i wish they would just give a straight reason why they are soo slow.

they have got there prioitys completly wrong.

 

[thefunkrocket]

It would be funny though if their servers were hamster powered though.

 

[Flimgoblin]

Check the camelot herald.
Check the number of huge bugs/unknowns that got through Mythics testing on 1.50.

I think DAoC is a superb game.. but mythic doesn't seem to believe in testing

GOA might be going overboard but I think they're trying to avoid the patch to patch the patch that patched the first patch patch of the new patch.

I'm still gutted that it's gonna take 6 weeks though

 

[cHodAX]

I base it on the fact that the French are known to hate living fast paced lives, they are far more relaxed than most people EU and do everything in their own way at their own pace. Maybe lazy wasn't right word, awkward is closer to the mark.

 

[thefunkrocket]

Be glad the servers aren't run by us Australians then

 

[old.cerebus]

From what I gather and I may be wrong, GOA started with a very small staff for such a large project. Either they didn't realise the size of job before them or like most companies, they tried to do everything as cheaply as possible.

They have stated that they are increasing staff numbers, so hopefully we may see patch times coming down. I doubt that with translation requirements, that we'll ever get to sync with the US servers though.

There has been lots of people stating how quickly translation should be so I don't think anybody can honestly answer why GOA are taking so long with it.

US Test Servers are open to the public, making tests quicker than having in-house developers doing it as in Europe. GOA have stated that they are going to open the test server to a few of us over here so that may bring down patch times as well.

I personally, am going to watch GOA carefully over the next 2 months. They are going to be releasing a lot of new features soon and introducing many things that will hopefully bring down patching times.

Lets just see how they do............

btw/ I think this forum is kinda full up of flames, use the other 97 threads to complain if that's what you want to do, I quite like the idea of having a thread where we all talk rationally about this subject.

 

[SoWat]

Maybe if Mythic had had the foresight to realise that their game would need translating, and coded it accordingly, we wouldn't be in this situation (tho' I refuse to get wound up by what is supposed to be a pleasurable activity).

If GOA have to alter the source code to translate, then some of the blame must be laid at Mythic's door.

 

[Ardwan]

Plus you could also argue that GOA are having to translate the patch twice..so in theory that is like writing 2 patches...

Plus they are lazy assed French people

 

[old.Grymshadow]

Originally posted by fingoniel

GOA might be going overboard but I think they're trying to avoid the patch to patch the patch that patched the first patch patch of the new patch.

I may be totally wrong, but all Goa are testing is the translation. Mythic are handing them the completed patch's.
Basically 3mths work to translate 3 languages... 1 in english (requires none)..1 french, should be a breeze.. and 1 in german.
Bit of a farce really.

 

[old.stroke]

Can't they just use babelfish damnit?

 

[Ardwan]

Originally posted by stroke
Can't they just use babelfish damnit?

Hmmm, I can hear the sound of a thousand french people booting up internet explorer now....expect the patch date to change to end of May anytime now

 

[Flimgoblin]

Maybe the expansion pack will include a refactor of the code to make it more easily translatable....

*rofl*

ok well I'll go catch my pigs before they fly out the window...

*sighs* I like our little european servers... I'm hoping this extraordinarily long patch translation (7 weeks + 5 weeks testing) is going to be a one off due to training new staff/using new equipment etc.

Note the 5 weeks testing...

On the US servers:
Version 1.50 started in testing 24/4/2002
Several changes/revisions were made up until the final one:
Version 1.50H (Test) on evening 7/5/2002
Version 1.50 went live on 8/5/2002

I.e. Chuck it on the server, quick once over by the 50 people that play there (ok its over 100 at peak times I admit it but hardly a 2k server population) then roll it out.

Version 1.50B went live on 8/5/2002 to fix lots of issues
Version 1.50C went live 16/5/2002 to fix more...

At least GOA are being honest about their 5 weeks testing Mythic are still running theirs on the live US servers.

Not that I'm saying 12 weeks for a patch is good .. it's pretty shoddy, 5 weeks testing is probably a shade on the over-cautious side too...

(though this 3 weeks player testing is going to be mostly sorting out characters if they're porting them - at least I hope they're porting them else it's not gonna be a good test)

Ho hum here was me hoping the news would say 'we're finished! it'll be put on the servers next friday!'

 

[old.Trine Aquavit]

As to why it takes longer to test the translation than the patch:

1. 3 different versions
2. fewer testers
3. need to test patch + translations

also we have know idea how 'easy' Mythic made the software to translate. I suspect that most of the localisation stuff was a bit of an afterthought.

Not an excuse, just an explanation.

 

[Ardwan]

Originally posted by Trine Aquavit

also we have know idea how 'easy' Mythic made the software to translate.

Aye, bloody hate those damn yanks, so GOA prolly have to translate from yank to english...and then to French and German

 

[old.chesnor]

Mythic have a policy to test patches on a test server with a limited playerbase followed by a quick rollout to production servers. This results in some 'bugs' sneaking out but hey, so what, they can be fixed almost instantly, with very little disruption to the community. So the turnaround is quick but the risk of bugs is high.

GOA have planned a generously long testing phase, presumably to ensure that the patch is right first time. This is a risky test strategy ( I am a software engineer by trade, and specialise in testing, so I know what I'm talking about ) as things invariably are never right first time, and it is difficult determining how quickly a bug can be repaired (the downtime after 1.45 as an example perhaps). Also it should be made clear that Mythic test the game mechanics, the code. All GOA do is test their translation is consistent and correct. At a guess GOA do not and probably can not change or tweak any code. This is the ultimate problem. The amount of text in a game such as this is massive. The translation job and its subsequent testing is a huge task. But this aint no nuclear power station. Its a game. It really doesnt matter if a few clangers slip through, as long as there is an efficient bug reporting system and an equally efficient re-patch team.

Mythic appear to understand that games such as this one can only keep its customers by offering new content on a regular basis, and this should be as often as you can manage. GOA either doesn't understand this, or does'nt care.

The patching/testing strategy GOA adopts will determine the success of this game in the long run. They appear to have chosen a strategy radically different from Mythics. Big error.

 

[SFXman]

Is quite amazing... you'd think that making a patch takes multiple times more effort than translation.

 

[old.Cf-]

It'd be nice if they translated the game into English. Some nice examples are:

Gray - Erm, Grey please.
Sulfer - Sulpher please.

And of course the Celtic Liches:

"You feel as if a scorpian has stun you"

 

[Ardwan]

Originally posted by Cf-
It'd be nice if they translated the game into English. Some nice examples are:

Gray - Erm, Grey please.
Sulfer - Sulpher please.

And of course the Celtic Liches:

"You feel as if a scorpian has stun you"

So that's why it takes them so long to translate it....thier English/German phrase books won't list yank spellings

 

[Shaki/Aeis]

I've said it before, I will NEVER forget GOAuke:

 

[old.Tartanyak]

Back at GOA HQ, the training and installation is complete...

The system admins put down their celebratory wine (only slightly better than the lunch or breakfast wine) and walk out onto an enclosed balcony above a factory floor.

The Head Admin starts talking (in a dodgy Gerard Depardieu style accented English, for the audience).

"Everyone knows the old idiom, but due to budgetary constraints we could not afford an infinite number. We did however get..."

Shutters sweep back from the windows, casting harsh light into the room. Quickly things become clearer....

"ONE THOUSAND MONKEYS SITTING AT ONE THOUSAND TYPEWRITERS!!! If everything goes to plan, these simian employees will be able to translate the patches for us! We have an infinite amount of time, as those silly people will carry on paying us, there's no worries about us not being able to afford wine for our children."


And that, my friends, is why the translation takes so much time, and why they can never give us an ETA.