makes me sick

[old.windforce]

http://www.camelot-seer.com/handler.cfm?app=classes&method=rp50

looking at last week

worse hib class: nr 22 of 39: ranger

best alb class: nr 10: sorc


top 20

3 x alb
7 x mid
10 x hib


thank god for thanes


<spare me the cry more nOOb>

 

[Arnor]

Originally posted by old.windforce
http://www.camelot-seer.com/handler.cfm?app=classes&method=rp50

looking at last week

worse hib class: nr 22 of 39: ranger

best alb class: nr 10: sorc


top 20

3 x alb
7 x mid
10 x hib


thank god for thanes


<spare me the cry more nOOb>

nah, if you post this, you deserve THIS: Cry more noob




if you for INSTANCE looked at some other data, you would see that hib has (last I checked) NO relics, on all the US servers, so please: www.cheese.com and stfu

 

[Brannor McThife]

Re: Re: makes me sick

Originally posted by Arnor2
if you for INSTANCE looked at some other data, you would see that hib has (last I checked) NO relics, on all the US servers...

And that proves what?

That Hibs don't need the relics to be overpowerred?

Shows that the other realms HAVE to have relics to be able to stand up against Hibs?


Think about that Arnor2.



-G

 

[greenfingers]

Re: Re: Re: makes me sick

bwahahaha

pwnd
|
|
v

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
And that proves what?

That Hibs don't need the relics to be overpowerred?

Shows that the other realms HAVE to have relics to be able to stand up against Hibs?


Think about that Arnor2.



-G

 

[Hufner]

By the way - it's only 2 albs and 11 hibs...

 

[Falcon]

And that proves what?

That Hibs don't need the relics to be overpowerred?

Shows that the other realms HAVE to have relics to be able to stand up against Hibs?

Or rather the more blatantly obvious that Hib as a realm is struggling to take and hold relics. Check populations too perhaps, Hib/Pryd only had 350 non-anon a couple of day ago when there was 2001 people on the whole server, that means we account for probably less than 25% out of the 33% that we should ideally account for. This is the same pattern on many US servers also.

Hib not only has the most dull and poorly made landscape but nowadays even struggles to compete class-wise. The general pattern in US is that Mid is by far the most powerful and has been for some time, follow by Alb since 1.60 leaving Hib trailing behind. Perhaps *gasp* the reason Hibs getting love is because Mythic have done the research, crunched the numbers and realised the truth? Mids AE stun + PBAE has the potential to shit on bard Mezz + Chanter PBAE from a very great height, not to mention the damage a few zerkers in the group can do too, the problem is Mid never seem to try it - and that's hardly an excuse to claim Hibs are overpowered is it?

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by Falcon
...but nowadays even struggles to compete class-wise...

Um. No.

Your dear old champions outclass a warrior (pure tank, not hybrid) easily.
And, um... (pushes the boulder down the hill), you're telling me your enchanters and PBAE Eldritches are having a hard time?

You're telling me that scouts out melee rangers? Hell, my warrior has been out meleed by rangers.

You're telling me that a nightshade doesn't hold his/her own against a "like buffed" enemy?

Your bards having issues mezzing people?

No. I don't think so. Hibs have always ONLY "struggled" because of numbers on Prydwen. And WTF does numbers of players have to do with whether the "realm", i.e. the classes, not the people that play on X, Y or Z server, owns or not?

And who cares if Hibs "struggle" to hold their relics. Those stats he gave show that Hibs, without relics, still out-RP the other realms. And you saying that you're only 25% and that perhaps the US servers are the same, shows EVEN MORE that Hib has superb class (full realm, not induvidual) balance.

-G

 

[old.Pepsay]

the seer is fecked up, dont trust it.

 

[granny]

Well there's another way of looking at that data. If you divide the number of RP's earned in the last week (45+'s only) by the population of each class (again, 45+'s only) you get:

Which looks a lot more balanced, 3/3/4 alb/mid/hib in top 10. But I don't trust those numbers. They look very odd to me, highly likely I've b0rked the maths somewhere

Also not sure how meaningful this kind of analysis really is to be honest. Do those population figures reflect total number of characters in existence or just those that have been active in the last week?

ps. can you tell I'm bored at work?

 

[krait]

Originally posted by granny
Well there's another way of looking at that data. If you divide the number of RP's earned in the last week (45+'s only) by the population of each class (again, 45+'s only) you get:

Which looks a lot more balanced, 3/3/4 alb/mid/hib in top 10. But I don't trust those numbers. They look very odd to me, highly likely I've b0rked the maths somewhere

Also not sure how meaningful this kind of analysis really is to be honest. Do those population figures reflect total number of characters in existence or just those that have been active in the last week?

ps. can you tell I'm bored at work?

Things must be really bad in Albion if Scouts have gone over to Hib.

 

[granny]

Originally posted by krait
Things must be really bad in Albion if Scouts have gone over to Hib.

Oops I spose I just assumed Scouts weren't part of Albion since you never see them any more

 

[The Real Redi]

Originally posted by granny
Oops I spose I just assumed Scouts weren't part of Albion since you never see them any more

Well, the templars are slowly being overrun by scouts We have loads of them, and i like the little fellas...

 

[Falcon]

Your dear old champions outclass a warrior (pure tank, not hybrid) easily.

Why are you comparing Hybrids to pure tanks? I may as well compare zerkers to wardens in that case. Try comparing Hero to Armsman to Warrior and you'll see it's pretty well balanced. Try comparing Paladin to Thane to Champion.

And, um... (pushes the boulder down the hill), you're telling me your enchanters and PBAE Eldritches are having a hard time?

Not at all, but on the same note they sure as hell aint getting it any easier than any other PBAE class.

You're telling me that scouts out melee rangers? Hell, my warrior has been out meleed by rangers.

No but as a full melee spec ranger if a scout slams me and I don't have purge up he then shoots me twice he has a perfectly good chance of winning.

You're telling me that a nightshade doesn't hold his/her own against a "like buffed" enemy?

Yep, NS' are the weakest of the assassins, however in the grand scheme of things are still a good class.

Your bards having issues mezzing people?

Not at all, Hib has trouble AE stunning and rooting people though, in these days of high resists, determination and cheap purge, mezz doesn't cut it on it's own compared to having 3 forms of CC easily available.

WTF does numbers of players have to do with whether the "realm", i.e. the classes, not the people that play on X, Y or Z server, owns or not?

A hell of a lot, ask yourself why not many people play Hibernia as it's not just on Prydwen, it's a pattern seen worldwide. Poorly created world is the biggest fault here.

And who cares if Hibs "struggle" to hold their relics. Those stats he gave show that Hibs, without relics, still out-RP the other realms. And you saying that you're only 25% and that perhaps the US servers are the same, shows EVEN MORE that Hib has superb class (full realm, not induvidual) balance.

Not at all, everyone knows RP data doesn't show a lot, numbers of deaths:kills, how well Hib holds their keeps, how well they hold relics are MUCH better indication of how well a realm is doing seeing as it's that that game balance is built around.

As for scouts, go to AMG Emain, you can usually find 30 or so hidden behind the 50 or so Infs.

 

[Danya]

Lowest population realm gets most RPs. RPs are not neccessarily a good indication of relative power of classes.

That said I think Falcon paints an overly bleak picture of hib effectiveness. While people saying hib is just insta-win are wrong, it's not like hibs can't win or anything.

 

[Falcon]

Nah I agree Hibs can win Danyan, Nolby's proved how well mezz + PBAE spam can kill the enemy, my point is, if Mids got off their arses and tried it with their more damaging PBAE and their AE stun they could be even more effective than us at it. As of 1.61 Albs can be just as effective using that trick too. The problem is everyone only sees Hib really doing it atm so we get countless nerf cries upon us for this and this alone which is kinda unfair really when Alb can soon do it just as well and Mid can already do it even better.

 

[Arnor]

Not at all, but on the same note they sure as hell aint getting it any easier than any other PBAE class.

now THIS is complete and UTTER bullshit.

They have it MUCH easier than any other pbaoe class.
And they are even less of a onetrick pony than the others.

 

[Carlos Bananos]

yes, RPs earnt per class obviously show which realms are doing best, and not which class has more active rvr players.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by Falcon
...if Mids got off their arses and tried it with their more damaging PBAE and their AE stun they could be even more effective than us at it...

Well, that comes down to the usefulness of classes in a team.

Main CC used by Hibs in the Mezz/stun/Speed/PBAE is a bard. Someone that CAN, if they want, spec in a weapon, and get a DD shout (sure, it may be weak, but it's still a damage instant). Enchanters are a dime-a-dozen, so there's lots of PBAE going.

Mids rely on Healers for their CC, a class that really has 0 offensiveness, and probably gets boring hence why there are so few of them. Skalds, the second class that would make up the Mezz/stun/Speed/PBAE seem to be dying in Mid. Then there are SM-PBAE, and there aren't that many of those. So the 3 classes that Mid would need for this, are getting rare, or so they say.

Albs, would require a Sorc (cloth wearing CC) for CC, an Ice Wiz for PBAE and a mincer for speed. Again, 3 classes, relying on a cloth CC'r. One of which gets a healing song. So Hib and Mid have a healing class in their set up for if the PBAEr takes damage. Don't notice that many Sorcs about, nor Ice Wizzes. Fair amount of Mincers though.

Somehow, I think Hib got the "easier" CC/PBAE.

-G

 

[Sharp Thing]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
Well, that comes down to the usefulness of classes in a team.

Main CC used by Hibs in the Mezz/stun/Speed/PBAE is a bard. Someone that CAN, if they want, spec in a weapon, and get a DD shout (sure, it may be weak, but it's still a damage instant). Enchanters are a dime-a-dozen, so there's lots of PBAE going.

Mids rely on Healers for their CC, a class that really has 0 offensiveness, and probably gets boring hence why there are so few of them. Skalds, the second class that would make up the Mezz/stun/Speed/PBAE seem to be dying in Mid. Then there are SM-PBAE, and there aren't that many of those. So the 3 classes that Mid would need for this, are getting rare, or so they say.

Albs, would require a Sorc (cloth wearing CC) for CC, an Ice Wiz for PBAE and a mincer for speed. Again, 3 classes, relying on a cloth CC'r. One of which gets a healing song. So Hib and Mid have a healing class in their set up for if the PBAEr takes damage. Don't notice that many Sorcs about, nor Ice Wizzes. Fair amount of Mincers though.

Somehow, I think Hib got the "easier" CC/PBAE.

-G

are you telling me there are plenty of bards? please, play hib and tyr to form a good rvr grp before posting utter and total crap like that

 

[Tasans]

Why are you comparing Hybrids to pure tanks? I may as well compare zerkers to wardens in that case. Try comparing Hero to Armsman to Warrior and you'll see it's pretty well balanced. Try comparing Paladin to Thane to Champion.

Nice one.

 

[thegreatest]

The information provided on the site is like 3 weeks old by the way, the xml didnt get updated since 3 weeks or so...

 

[DocWolfe]

Brannor has had level 50s in all three realms actually not sure about alb

 

[Nonnier]

Originally posted by Falcon
Why are you comparing Hybrids to pure tanks? I may as well compare zerkers to wardens in that case. Try comparing Hero to Armsman to Warrior and you'll see it's pretty well balanced. Try comparing Paladin to Thane to Champion.

heros are the best pure tank, champs are the best hybrids.

Heros have LW and moose

armsman have polearm

warriors have nothing special

thanes, i admit next patch will become beasts in pve and grp v grp combat, but atm are the worst of the hybribs

paladins have end buff, insta heals and other buffs which makes em damn good defensive tanks and team

Champs have debuffs, LW,nukes,self buffs and more hits then a thane, and is the king of 1v1.

not very balenced atm imo

(btw, plz forgive if i made a mistake about pallys, not really sure what they have )

 

[Falcon]

Champs rock in 1 vs 1 but they lose it in open field somewhat due to low hps so no, in group RvR champs certainly are NOT better than pallys and thanes, they're on the same hp table as stalkers, NS and Rangers only difference is they got a str/const buff, which doesn't stack with other str/const buffs.

Again Hib has easier PBAE/CC just because more people play chanters and therefore our realm is clearly overpowered and doesn't need any help? It's not our problem that people aint playing the classes, the fact is they are there for you, you just have to be motivated to try them out. As Sharp Thing said, bards are a very dying species in Hib and when NP came to Hib/Pryd with their 3fg it pretty much doubled the number of active RvR bards we had, what does that tell you? It should tell you that we get it just as hard in getting people to play needed classes however organised guilds like NP will make and play them just because they're needed - perhaps Mid/Alb should find some players like that to make it work.

In well laid out groups the job of the chanter is to pretty much just PBAE so it's not even really valid that chanters are the best for it, not when SMs get to PBAE stunned not mezzed people and Wizzies get to debuff their own PBAE damage type.

Yes you're right that Hib could have speed and CC on one char, but at the same time if we want speed and end regen we need two bards or to drop speed in battle, whereas Albs can have a minstrel and a tank (paladin) offering the same features, not only that but you conveniently missed that you'd get a secondary form of CC - AE root for emergency which is something the Hib group you listed is vastly missing.

Get the following groups:
Paladin
Minstrel
Sorceror
Ice Wizzie
Ice Wizzie
Armsman
Cleric
Misc - Friar, Pally, Another Ice wizzie, or anything I've missed, maybe a PBT char?

Warrior
Healer
Shaman
Zerker
PBAE SM
PBAE SM
Skald
Misc - Or again anything I've missed, maybe a PBT char?, bonedancer?

Hero
Bard
Druid
Warden
Mana chanter
Mana chanter
Champion, BM or another Hero
Misc

I think you'd have to agree they'd be pretty equal, and if anything the Mid group would be most powerful, AE stun + PBAE + zerker = ouch. Perhaps this will illustrate that the only time Hibs are seen as being overpowered is something that can be pulled of just as well by the other realms? As I've said already it's not Hibs problem if the other realms don't try the tactics, it's not Hibs problem if the other realms don't have enough of a certain class and it's sure as hell not Hibs problem if the other realms can't be pro-active in bothering to counter Hibs tactics in something other than a 8fg Zerg.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by Sharp Thing
are you telling me there are plenty of bards? please, play hib and tyr to form a good rvr grp before posting utter and total crap like that

I have played Hib. And I know that there are quite a few level 50 Bards. But the rest of Hib so utterly verbally abuses them for not mezzing or playing the right songs that many stopped RvRing.

The crap is the fact that people get all verbal with a class they need.

-G

 

[MesS°]

Originally posted by reinnon
paladins have end buff, insta heals and other buffs which makes em damn good defensive tanks

Pallys have chants... And well a self buff...




Edit: forgot the self buff

 

[StormriderX]

Originally posted by old.windforce
http://www.camelot-seer.com/handler.cfm?app=classes&method=rp50

looking at last week

worse hib class: nr 22 of 39: ranger

best alb class: nr 10: sorc


top 20

3 x alb
7 x mid
10 x hib


thank god for thanes


<spare me the cry more nOOb>

less players = higher average rp

notice how bm's are near the top, yet bm's are the least played of the 'classic' client classes...

 

[StormriderX]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
Um. No.

Your dear old champions outclass a warrior (pure tank, not hybrid) easily.

Why compare main tank with hybrid - and either way a zerk > all hib tanks

And, um... (pushes the boulder down the hill), you're telling me your enchanters and PBAE Eldritches are having a hard time?

All mages are having hard time with out of hand resists

You're telling me that scouts out melee rangers? Hell, my warrior has been out meleed by rangers.

Either your warrior is low rr are you're crap slam and 2h weapon induces a world of hurt to people.

You're telling me that a nightshade doesn't hold his/her own against a "like buffed" enemy?

until they are high rr they are merely fodder for other realm assasins - the arguement that "they are the best at high rr" is stupid highlights the NEED for ra's to bring the class up to par.

Your bards having issues mezzing people?

No the issue is lack of secondary cc - insta + castable being on the same table means once its cast a bard cant do much cc wise - ie cc the tank chasing him. Insta has its uses but in the age of uber resists and cheap determination it doesnt last long on tanks.

No. I don't think so. Hibs have always ONLY "struggled" because of numbers on Prydwen. And WTF does numbers of players have to do with whether the "realm", i.e. the classes, not the people that play on X, Y or Z server, owns or not?

Erm - so being outnumbered by 10:1 for example doesnt affect anything? Right...

And who cares if Hibs "struggle" to hold their relics. Those stats he gave show that Hibs, without relics, still out-RP the other realms. And you saying that you're only 25% and that perhaps the US servers are the same, shows EVEN MORE that Hib has superb class (full realm, not induvidual) balance.

Less players = more rps on average. Chanters are fairly low on the list so does that mean they need more boosting?

 

[Solid]

Originally posted by reinnon
thanes, i admit next patch will become beasts in pve and grp v grp combat, but atm are the worst of the hybribs

Lets not get too excited.

Having a shit Str/Con buff instead of a capping Baseline is not exactly gonna make us "PvE and grp vs grp Beasts"

Nor is having a chan castable DD when our Powerpool and Spell damage is so low.

Yes they are improvments, no Thanes still are the worst Hybrid in the game.

Go check the RP data (IN ANY FORM) around the world, Thanes consistently performing BOTTOM 3 (out of hmm 33 Classes) of the pile however you analyze the stats.

Dont go talking nonsense, Thanes are no where near competitve in RvR yet so dont go counting your eggs just yet.

 

[xzz]

here is my oppinion:


Shut up and enjoy the game

all classes do well if played well, imo