Large scale RvR tactics

[Hotandsandy]

Whilst most people would think the title of this thread is a contradiction in terms, and I personally prefer 8v8......

The frontiers expansion, BG chat groups and some of the TOA abilities may all lead to larger scale warfare (as seems to be the desire of Mythic).

Now, please don't turn this into a thread on the merits of 8v8 vs the Z*** word, what I'm asking is:

Is it possible in DAOC to have large scale warfare tactics?

For example, rows of meat shields protecting a bank of archers. Swift moving mincers/bards/skalds acting as mobile 'cavalry' (smirks at the thought...) Clerics etc at the rear performing last rites... Box/square formations, flanking attacks....

1) Would collision be a pre-requisite?
2) Is it outside the realms of possibilities?
3) Does the DAOC system preclude this possibility?
4) Is the SI/TOA engine likely to enhance large scale fights or will enhanced graphics in TOA make Mythics dream even less achievable?
5) Does the individual's deisre to farm RPs mean 20% will never get involved even were it possible?
6) Are there sufficient high calibre leaders to pull it off?

Your thoughts please...

 

[NightyP]

always wanted to see a row of 32 scouts take down Mids like the battle scene in lotr at helms deep
here a FWOP FWOP FWOP

Savage in distance: Zee the buffs! Zay do nothing!!!!

 

[rg-zorena]

Originally posted by Hotandsandy

1) Would collision be a pre-requisite?
2) Is it outside the realms of possibilities?
3) Does the DAOC system preclude this possibility?
4) Is the SI/TOA engine likely to enhance large scale fights or will enhanced graphics in TOA make Mythics dream even less achievable?
5) Does the individual's deisre to farm RPs mean 20% will never get involved even were it possible?
6) Are there sufficient high calibre leaders to pull it off?

1. dunno
2. yes
3. yes
4. dunno
5. depends if it would be fun but probably just laggy and "tactics" would come down to numbers in the end.
6. probably :>

 

[Arnor]

aoe


cc

 

[Snake.ster]

collison control would so much change this game into something better imo, that way tanks could actually protect there casters/healers.


oh but we can only dream.

 

[thorwyntf]

collison control would so much change this game into something better imo, that way tanks could actually protect there casters/healers.

I agree there. It would be a great improvement and drastically change tactics and strategies. However, I fear that it might also add a lot of difficulties to the game (and a lot of exploit possibilities too.. imagine people blocking mobs, so the alts can merrily kill them from the distance ).
Look how hard it is to take a defended Lordroom or milegate room, even though the doors are basically open and everybody is free to step in. With collision, the defending side could now also block the door and make it almost impossible to break that defensive stance.

 

[vintervargen]

Originally posted by Snake.ster
collison control would so much change this game into something better imo, that way tanks could actually protect there casters/healers.


oh but we can only dream.

that would also make assist harder - max 2-3 tr0lls

 

[Nugusta]

Originally posted by vintervargen
that would also make assist harder - max 2-3 tr0lls

be more life like...although u could understand how a lurikeen could go under a firbys legs too shove a skewer up a trolls bum hole

 

[Aussie-]

CAMP THE ROOM - Walker™

 

[Sharp Thing]

Originally posted by Aussie-
CAMP THE ROOM - Walker™

WHINE WHEN LOSING - Aussie™

 

[old.Sepiritz]

All large scale warefare I have seen have been lineup and standoff and the occational caster going up to blow off some bolts and aoe dot'ers revelling in deathmessages.. I doubt it will be much different in the future especially after the resist system redesigns..

 

[VodkaFairy]

with collission detection albs couldn't get out of apk

 

[Arnor]

Originally posted by VodkaFairy
with collission detection albs couldn't get out of apk

hahah


also, collision detection would bring us back to square one again, maybe even a bit before square one.

Heres how:

Meet enemies, tanks form a circle around casters/support, casters nuke the fuck out of everyone while tanks keep tanks busy (who cant do shit else but hit on tanks, with guard+heals etc)

 

[Kallio]

It would be cool but the game should be totally different, too bad

 

[borf]

Personally I think the real large scale warfare isn't possible with daoc.
I think this cos we are to manouvreble in the frontier to get a sort like warhammer > archer / healers groups etc ...
This kind of warfare did exist cos ppl knew where the enemy were but couldn't reach them, so they slowly made 1 step ahead and trying to get in range.

In daoc mach5/6 is to fast to create such battles...
Though with upcomming ToA I do think we will get larger fights. Not only at keeps, but also on open ground.
This will probably create a sortlike situation as you said. Archers / healers in the back with some defending tanks, mages blasting eachother away etc .

so I don't think the 'real' warfare we know of old times is possible in the daoc world, but I do think we'll get some larger fights soon with ToA / new frontier


Borf

 

[xplo]

10 wizzies, VP, everything dead.

 

[xplo]

10 wizzies, VP, everything dead.

 

[duact]

10 wizzies . baod . destruction

 

[Sichama]

Originally posted by Hotandsandy

1) Would collision be a pre-requisite?
2) Is it outside the realms of possibilities?
3) Does the DAOC system preclude this possibility?
4) Is the SI/TOA engine likely to enhance large scale fights or will enhanced graphics in TOA make Mythics dream even less achievable?
5) Does the individual's deisre to farm RPs mean 20% will never get involved even were it possible?
6) Are there sufficient high calibre leaders to pull it off?

Your thoughts please...

1) Yes if tactics like the ones you describe are in question Colision would be extremely important, not to mention that it's a good idea anyway.
2) No, its all a matter of design, testing and improving a system.
3) It is very possible that yes, maybe not DAoC as a system but as a product that sells it's self as a system with low hardware pre-requisites it is, plus that home Internet access isn't very good yet at many places.
4) Dificult to say
5) No 20% is very optimistic, i would say only the 20% will get involved, for the reason you mentioned.
6) No, at least not as long as the few high ranking respected members of each realm at this point will be between the people that cba to do anything that isn't as RP rich as possible.

Combat will change but i must remind everyone that especially the RvR expansion we will not see it untill at least next year this time and that is beeing optimistic.
Untill then there are quite a few new games coming out that look promising, so it probably is a matter of todays new players to worry about them too much.

 

[acei]

Originally posted by NightyP
always wanted to see a row of 32 scouts take down Mids like the battle scene in lotr at helms deep
here a FWOP FWOP FWOP

I saw this once when dozen's of archers were at mmg along with a couple of fg's as something important was happening (can't remember not it was ages ago), lol the mids tried zerging through but were slaughtered by the scouts.

 

[Sichama]

You know that practically speaking if something big like this should happen, then the normal fg setup policy isn't the appropriate one, this would practically mean that people would make groups of similar classes.
If you gona have rows of archers protecting an area for example, they all need to be in the same groups and in the same cg, every group maybe have a druid in, that is stationed with the rest "Rangers" druids and in the same cg, their leader should be grouped with the rest leaders and in the same cg, etc etc.

It would be very hard to organize, but if it could be pulled off at this moment, there is no reason what so ever to do it and i don't just mean low RP farming, i mean nothing not even relic raids need this much of organizing the way things work today, it would probably only result in a major server crush that would kick everyone out of the game.

It would be very cool to do it though, have a few large guilds organize this kind of warfare, it would very much resemble a match of chess.

 

[dazam]

it wud be noce but the battle is over to quick so its just Surround and destroy Alb rtactin number 1. And 8fg vs 8fg Hibs Obv beat albs then albs like rite theres only 1 thing for it lets not improve our tactics lets triple our numbers. wud like it but wud never work

 

[sorusi]

daoc engine doesnt support large fights imo. gets too laggy to "control" the large fights at good rate

 

[ilienwyn]

Originally posted by NightyP
always wanted to see a row of 32 scouts take down Mids like the battle scene in lotr at helms deep
here a FWOP FWOP FWOP

Savage in distance: Zee the buffs! Zay do nothing!!!!

That would be really funny to watch. Someone make a video with that (whatever realm)

 

[Divinia]

what is healerclasses supposed to do in those large battles? heal the shit out of the people that actually can do anything with the range/the tanks who run to fight?

i as bard would be able to cast ae lull with my range.. rest of the things would be limited to curing/healing grp members.. sounds like fun.

 

[Arnor]

Originally posted by Divinia
what is healerclasses supposed to do in those large battles? heal the shit out of the people that actually can do anything with the range/the tanks who run to fight?

i as bard would be able to cast ae lull with my range.. rest of the things would be limited to curing/healing grp members.. sounds like fun.

play end ffs!

 

[Sharp Thing]

Originally posted by Divinia
what is healerclasses supposed to do in those large battles? heal the shit out of the people that actually can do anything with the range/the tanks who run to fight?

i as bard would be able to cast ae lull with my range.. rest of the things would be limited to curing/healing grp members.. sounds like fun.

DOH, i thought healerclasses where supposed to heal. thank god you set that straight!

 

[Stallion-]

hmmm best tactic? bring more ppl?

 

[iluvatur]

look at some of the lineage 2 siege warfare videos >>>>> daoc siege

 

[Belomar]

Originally posted by Arnor
Meet enemies, tanks form a circle around casters/support, casters nuke the fuck out of everyone while tanks keep tanks busy (who cant do shit else but hit on tanks, with guard+heals etc)

Hey, man, I don't recognize you, why would this be bad?