Just a question

[armado]

Does Hibernia and Midgaard have more "tactics" than us?
Are they more organised, or is that how they feel about us to?

Wouldent RvR be much more fun if things were abit orginased..?

Please admins, if flames blush, delete thread.

 

[Generic Poster]

I would say the Hibs and Mids communicate better then we do. Although some Mids would tell you they have the same problems... etc.

 

[Wizzzy]

isnt bg meant to be for sinle players just to go out and gank other realm members though!? so surely there isnt a need for "tactics" ??

When going on guild hunts and raids, there is a hell of a lot organisation going on behind those kind of things!

 

[armado]

hm..

bg you mean battle gounds, thats not for 50 I guess..

Only thing I hear in main chat is "charge" "thanks" "np"
when somebody yells charge often only half do..
and if its a cg there... "where did you die, so my group can get there", and have some rps, then res and run of with speed again.

maybe just my lack of experience to.. but thats how I feel it..

 

[Turamber]

Depends what type of RvR you are doing Armado. If it is skirmishing (or zerging) in Emain then the scope for tactics is quite limited, other than people saying where the enemy is and then you either go support/hide.

Much more strategy is involved in defending our own realm though. Next time there is a call to arms to defend come along, I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

Oh and you will find in small scale skirmishes guild only groups rule as the people in them know each other well and can be more creative in terms of tactics.

 

[Validus]

maybe the fact albion has the most players on this server causes ppl 2 know less about their realm mates, and as mentioned above if you know ppl well (I.E. guildies) and play with them you will be more effective

 

[- Pathfinder -]

Originally posted by Validus
maybe the fact albion has the most players on this server causes ppl 2 know less about their realm mates, and as mentioned above if you know ppl well (I.E. guildies) and play with them you will be more effective

Albion 5,939 (35%)
Hibernia 4,682 (28%)
Midgard 6,123 (37%)

Total 16,744

Oh yes, we have so many more people than the Mids

 

[armado]

Will do Turamber, good point there...

 

[Sharma]

Mids yell CHARGE!!!!!

90% move

casters/healers stay back a bit

Hibs yell CHARGE!!!!!

100% move

TEH ZERG(tm)

Albs yell CHARGE!!!!!

5% move

Mids/hibs yell CHARGE!!!!! albs die running away.

 

[old.windforce]

sadly but true

last night was a perfect example of lack of organisation.
we got owned by mids at relics

 

[minnie]

Mids yell CHARGE!!!!!

90% move

casters/healers stay back a bit

Hibs yell CHARGE!!!!!

100% move

TEH ZERG(tm)

Albs yell CHARGE!!!!!

5% move

Mids/hibs yell CHARGE!!!!! albs die running away



The above is TOOO true but I laughed when I read it

To be serious tho we Albs need to be far less afraid of dying and go and get stuck into to the enemy even when we can see we are outnumbered. A little more patience too at APK would be good and people need to wait until others port in so that the Alb force is much stronger. We do have some good mezzers now in Albion, we need to try and protect them a little more to give them a better chance of doing the work we need done in order to kill the masses we often face.

I'm not a mezzer but it's amazingly easy when the mezz has been cast. The arms can really kill so many and thats the way to win

Mezzers mezz, tanks fight, healers heal = a good start to win a battle.

 

[robillard]

Originally posted by sharma
Mids yell CHARGE!!!!!

90% move

casters/healers stay back a bit

Hibs yell CHARGE!!!!!

100% move

TEH ZERG(tm)

Albs yell CHARGE!!!!!

5% move

Mids/hibs yell CHARGE!!!!! albs die running away.

I hate it when these pillars of righteousness stand up and start declaring people in their own realms cowards

firstly this is totally non-constructive it own makes existing problems worse through inaction.

secondly instead of bitching on here why dont you try and do something about it, If all the people who regularly bitch here about a lack of organisation in albion actually got their groups to follow the prementioned charge there would be no problem for them to moan about.

 

[old.chesnor]

Originally posted by robillard


I hate it when these pillars of righteousness stand up and start declaring people in their own realms cowards

firstly this is totally non-constructive it own makes existing problems worse through inaction.

secondly instead of bitching on here why dont you try and do something about it, If all the people who regularly bitch here about a lack of organisation in albion actually got their groups to follow the prementioned charge there would be no problem for them to moan about.

Thats your problem right there.

Noone said the 95% of Albs who do not charge are cowards. It is more likely that the 95% have no faith in the moron shouting "CHARGE!!!11", whereas the Mids and Hibs do have that faith.

Shouting "CHARGE!!!1" is easy. Anyone can do it. That is a big problem, because some maniac wannabe general decides that Albs can win if they all charge, whereas the wiser heads probably think "feck that, we'll all die", so they hang back.

All you need is a leader. Even cowards will follow a leader who they respect.

 

[robillard]

Theproblem with leadership in Albion is a serious one, and it comes from a combination of bitterness and jealousy. Once we had a good alliance but it broke down for the above reasons, hopefully soon we'll have a new alliance where people will put these things aside and forget past agreivences.
There certainly are a fair number of well respected people in albion, but the problem is some people in our realm refuse to be organised by someone in another alliance again for the afore mention reasons.
I truely believe our only hope is to reform the realm wide alliance and to start a cultureof trust and rganisation within albion

 

[Gabrial]

Originally posted by - Pathfinder -


Albion 5,939 (35%)
Hibernia 4,682 (28%)
Midgard 6,123 (37%)

Total 16,744

Oh yes, we have so many more people than the Mids

Are they players or chars?

 

[Fafnir]

Think alb got more players, and mids more alts.

 

[old.Eynar_Vega]

Originally posted by Generic Poster
I would say the Hibs and Mids communicate better then we do. Although some Mids would tell you they have the same problems... etc.

I'm quite sure this problem exists in all 3 realms, and a lot of people acknowledge this issue. Sad thing about it, is when someone tries to do something about it, he'll be flamed like hell in no time ("Ego-tripper" etc.), resulting in him refusing to take the responsability on future occasions. People can be very hypocritic about this, they moan about lack of organization, while the same people refuse to accept "commands" by realmmates and are the first to start flaming them. Yet you don't see them taking initiative to try organizing a bit by far... Can't be that hard imo tho...when you have issues with someone leading our forces, then by all means step up and show everyone how it's supposed to be done. And when you succeed, THEN you have the right to start criticism, and otherwise stfu

Just my point of view...

 

[CliffyG]

Admittedly i haven't played proper RVR and only have experience of Thid but have faced similar situations. Basically our PK was camped after a while a few of us got organised and everyone charged, although outnumbered and having taken a beating all night we killed most of them and pushed the remaining few back to the CK.

If we hadn't got lairy and tried to push on over the bridge we'd have been able to get camped there and let the freshly porting people to join us there. We charged once more as a big group and managed to camp the bridge for a short while too. After that the group fragmented and we got slaughtered again. Just shows the difference a bit of organisation can make. Yes a lot of us died but at least we took some of them with us. Makes it a hell of a lot more fun.

EDIT

Should say previous to us charging it was a case of casters/bowmen trying their luck, getting hit/killed so rezzers have to come down etc etc, got a little stupid after trying the same thing for 10th time considering not one of the mids died.

 

[old.Hellskor]

naw, the reason is this :

when a Hib dies he'll get reincarnated immidiatly and can hug his beloved trees all day long

when a Mid dies he goes to Valhalla ... Fights'n'Party all day long ! YAY !

when a Alb dies he goes to Heaven ... sit around with silly wings on his back with silly instruments playing silly music.

No surprise Albs are afraid of death

 

[The Fifth Man]

Once again, all these posts highlight is the fact that there's two wars going on in DAoC. There's the Emain FPS game and the rest-of-the-world RvR game.

You won't find consistent leaders, tactics and co-operation in Emain because it's filled with individuals chasing RPs. Emain is mob war. Mobs don't have leaders, they're a disparate collection of individuals, flowing this way and that way with the herd. It's quite possible for one part of the mob to be scared and fleeing while another part is bullish and charging.

Then there's RvR. This takes place everywhere else. There are recognised leaders, there are guilds and alliances co-operating in a structured manner and there are tactics. You want leaders ? Jupitus, Laird, Casbardh, Kyra, Aethelstan, Larsa, Choppy, Steveh and others command large cross-guild armies almost nightly. And there's no flaming or arguing about it. They and their guilds back each other up and they work together.

Spending all your time in Emain with the mob and then whining about it is like banging your head repeatedly on a wall and complaining that it hurts. Next time there's an Albion keep in enemy hands, try going there instead of just getting back on that pad to Emain for your next FPS spawn. Join the cg and enter the world of organised RvR.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by Fafnir
Think alb got more players, and mids more alts.

Why do mids think they all have all char slots filled and albs just have one char each? There's loads of alts in all the realms. Using that as an excuse to say you don't have a population advantage is BS.

 

[lacroix]

Being a clear rvr newbie myself, I have been wondering about Armado's question myself, from the little observation / experience I got in this matter. So, can't say I am in any way equipped to answer any question on this issue, but rather like to add my impressions for further discussion (oh, and I am not talking Emain here, only, but any skirmish that involves at least a handful of ppl in which Albs are not clearly dominant ):

I tend to think that leadership is an issue. Although there are renowned ppl with good command experience available, it seems they got their organisation well in hand. Question is what to do with all those not "linked" up accordingly - and getting into cg is not always that easy or helpful (even provided there is one), as even there can be contradictory "commands", plans etc. Personally, I don't mind following orders, only I find it sometimes difficult to find out whose - so, is there a general way to solve this by "spreading" the established leaders far enough to organise other "subgroups" efficiently or does it always come back to the guild issue? Are there some ppl generally to "listen" to?

Had the discussion last night about "self-organisation", too. It was suggested if everybody knew their class well and would do their "class related" job, it would work sort of automatical (plus other "ifs", such as: if casters could wear chain, we had less rvr solo artists, .... etc.). Maybe it is true that not everyone knows how to make most of their class in rvr (I most certainly don't - trying to make most of my roots and petsnares, but don't have much time to experiment, as I normally find myself dead within seconds ).
I also understand that the idea is, for example, for devensive tanks to protect the casters so that we can do our job (mezz/root, nuke). I understand the principle, but am wondering if this really works in practice? - If Mid/Hib tanks go straight for casters (which they seem to), I doubt that any reasonable no. of tanks protecting me could actually keep them off me ... (still many tnx to Cal, he tried hard enough /kiss)- they only need 2-3 hits to finish me off before engaging the tanks... Even quickcasting doesn't get me out of harm's way quickly enough. So, my only chance is to root them before they even get close - but even that only works for tight groups - for spread ones, I don't seem to have the time to get more than 1 maybe 2 roots off before I bite the dust as they are all over me - and this normally costs a cleric's insta (maybe I am just too slow or way too cute but still, the result is pretty much the same )...


So, am always looking for helpful suggestions, if anyone can enlighten me here on how to contribute best, it would be appreciated. I just think that my personal confusion on these issues - along with Armado's question - probably indicates that there are loads of similarly curious/confused/wondering pps about ...

PS: Sorry for the long post ....

 

[Gabrial]

Defensive tanks - I've heard lots of talk on the boards about this matter. Many people say that the tanks should go forth and whack the casters - ignore other tanks heading for our casters cause like you rightly said, they arent likely to kill them before they finish off your protectees.

However, are'nt sword and shield tanks usefull for guarding casters? Even if they block 1/2 hits, that is gonna be enough to save someone life maybe?

 

[armado]

Think problem with tactics not always are what people do, rather that there are so many more casters than there are tanks in this game, so everyone who have to go hand to hand with someone got a little problem. The best way to stay alive and get rps is to be a suportive and defence tank.
But some of the charm of playing an tank disapers when the best way to get rps and survive is group with an wizard and let him do the fighting...

This goes for large battles of course

 

[Pixie.Pebr]

Originally posted by Gabrial
However, are'nt sword and shield tanks usefull for guarding casters? Even if they block 1/2 hits, that is gonna be enough to save someone life maybe?

Since you partially block bolts as well, staying at safe distance from DDs with your casters, while using Guard, and let them nuke/bolt the other sides Tanks, playing it defensive is a Good Thing(tm).
Then again, if all did we would have pretty boring battles, much more fun to see 50-60 people charge into each and duke it out

 

[Turamber]

Originally posted by Gabrial
However, are'nt sword and shield tanks usefull for guarding casters? Even if they block 1/2 hits, that is gonna be enough to save someone life maybe?

Sadly we don't block anything like that much as yet - but we can block arrows and, as Pebr rightly says, bolts from other casters. So there is a place for defensive tanks in RvR.

You would be surprised how often the enemy tanks -do- stop to fight the defensive tank, particularly if the caster sprints off a bit. Tanks like their styles so don't often sprint after the caster and waste that precious endurance.

There have been various moaning posts by casters complaining that tanks are killing each other and not the enemy casters -- but that is, in all likelihood, the defensively specced tank defending his casters.

 

[minnie]

said by old.chesnor:

Noone said the 95% of Albs who do not charge are cowards. It is more likely that the 95% have no faith in the moron shouting "CHARGE!!!11", whereas the Mids and Hibs do have that faith.

I agree totally with you and with your further comment about leadership and the lack of it.

I reckon that's a big part of where we go wrong.

It seems to be when well known players of Alb take the lead and give the orders we do well and win battles. The word charge is usually preceeded by the command that we will charge in X number of secs. Then the charge order is given and we go with a lot of confidence.

Problem is though that too often no one well known enough takes the leadership role. If a lower level shouts charge no one listens and thats understandable I guess.