Ideas for ressurecting DAOC Old-Lands zones

[Killswitch]

Been thinking about this for a bit. If nothing else, we (the players) are paying our hard-earned money to GOA (and by association Mythic) to run, maintain and upgrade servers to run zones that might get 8-16 people per week in them. Lynn Barfog springs to mind, as does Dartmoor. Salisbury Plains is pretty much uninhabited except for horse routes and people running to the Barrows.

I'm sure this is the same in Mid and Hib. Anyway, I have a few ideas I'm thinking of submitting to Sanya's Recycle Bin (errrr...I mean Feedback Form). I'd like to know what people think about them...I doubt any of them will happen, but it'd be nice to see SOMETHING happen.

1) TOA ROG Engine for all zones

With the upcoming release of Catacombs, isn't it about time we extended the TOA Random Object Generator to drops in all zones? I can't think of a single drop item from Old-Lands or SI that would get into a modern template, with the exception of the Unique-SI-Quest Item (80 Util Neckie) and maybe some Sidi drops. This would be a great way to encourage people to play lower levels and to help new players get useful gear and bonuses for PvE and Battlegrounds.

2) 'Co-op' zone

Not sure what else to call this. Take the 'Epic Zone' from each realm (Lynn Barfog for Alb) and freshen it up. Up the level of the epic mobs to Artifact Encounter-esque levels. Put some decent camps of mobs in there. Now, the interesting bit. Put a NPC-controlled keep there. When your realm controls this keep, you get extra bonuses in PvE (increased drop rates, higher camp bonuses, shorter free-level timers). Put a NF-porter in the keep. This would be great news for PvE fans who get to 50 and want something challenging to do, but don't like conventional RvR.

3) Epic Quests

Change these around a bit. Improve the quality of the gear you get as you progress, maybe work it round the new class-specific free Hauberks you get from your trainer. Make the 50 epics harder (ie so they can't be solo'd by an ML9 sorc) and change the rewards to a full-set of unique-skinned MP AF102 armour but give it higher imbue points than crafted items (or more imbue slots). Maybe 35 imbue points instead of 32. This would again provide an incentive to play and explore more of the game.

4) Crafting Changes

We need to make crafting skills useful again. I have an LGM Alch and an LGM ACer and I rarely get any work. It's certainly not viable to make much money from it anymore, not unless you do it full-time. I think Legendary Weapons should be spellcraftable, for starters. Increase the variety and effectiveness of Alch procs/charges/reactives. Allow some +cap to be crafted into PC items, requiring ingredients from Alch, SC and AC/WC/Fletching lines. Make some kind of Legendary Armour available, with decent skins and maybe some variety of designs (different helm looks for example).

5) Introduce Artifact Quests

Rather than make Arti-levelling a pure grind, have quests that take time and effort to achieve that will give XP on artis rather than characters. For example, a level 50 quest that involves getting a drop from Golestandt and maybe getting some crafted item to produces a "Dragon's Flame Jerkin" or something like that. When you hand the item in, your artifacts get the equivalent of 1,000,000,000 XP or something. Don't make them repeatable, so you might be able to get 2-3 levels from quests and 7 levels from "normal" levelling.

That's all I've come up with so far. I don't think it will really appeal to the hardcore RvR player, but I know many players who would only need OF Emain and maybe a Sidi porter in their house to be happy! If Mythic aren't going to do something to liven up the old zones, I wish they'd just remove them to free up resources for unlagging the remaining zones that DO get traffic. Let's face it, Diamondback Toad glowies just aren't as awesome as they used to be.

If I get enough suggestions and feedback, I might look at writing some proper proposals to send to Mythic (although I'm not sure they'll be interested as long as wel keep buying the expansions).

J

 

[Flimgoblin]

They do listen to the feedback, they just don't always agree...

Good stuff there worth sending in anyway.

 

[Shanaia]

I like most of your ideas...

Don't underestimate Mythic's feedback forum ... they read that shit I actually got an e-mail back thanking me for my suggestions when I send in a form a long time ago...

Now lets get ready for people who turn this thread around to how useless Mythic and GOA are

 

[Flimgoblin]

Since they've ditched the Classic client post-catacombs it allows them to rejig the environment a bit too (things like cliffton just won't work in the old client, now that it's no longer in need of support they can put that sorta stuff in ) so hopefully the old places will get a makeover.

 

[Shanaia]

we r stlong posters flim

maybe we need to ... I don't know .. work ... while we're at ... work?

 

[Flimgoblin]

we r stlong posters flim

maybe we need to ... I don't know .. work ... while we're at ... work?

interesting concept....

 

[old.Whoodoo]

Great ideas, all except the idea of drop armour being better than crafted, IMO items created by an LGM should be far superior to drops. ATM MP takes a 1:50 chance, how easy is it getting these days to obtain artifacts and ML drops in comparison?

 

[Killswitch]

Great ideas, all except the idea of drop armour being better than crafted, IMO items created by an LGM should be far superior to drops. ATM MP takes a 1:50 chance, how easy is it getting these days to obtain artifacts and ML drops in comparison?

Totally agree. Problem is that the Epic armours are now utterly useless (unless you want something to trash between 40-50). I think the reward from the 50 epic should be something that a level 50 should actually, you know, be able to USE for something. How about a standard, MP, AF102, 32-imbue random armour/weapon piece (so you get a sword OR gloves OR hauberk) with a random, better-than-alch proc pre-imbued, but with the item able to be imbued by an SCer.

So you might get a spellcraftable set of chain arms for your cleric, with a 180pt Heal Proc or an 80pt group spreadheal reactive. Something like that, not overpowered, but something that might get used. That would avoid making crafted gear worthless. They'd probably have to be non-tradeable as well now I think about it.

 

[Killswitch]

Great ideas, all except the idea of drop armour being better than crafted, IMO items created by an LGM should be far superior to drops. ATM MP takes a 1:50 chance, how easy is it getting these days to obtain artifacts and ML drops in comparison?

Forgot to mention. I made 4 MP AF102 armour parts and 6 99% ones in about 20 crafts earlier this week!!! Sucks that they were all for guildies (except one MP studded crown for me) and being done for free.

 

[Dakkath]

Must admit, the epic stuff needs a bit of a workover...

I don't know anyone who actually makes the effort to do these now...
They stuff just isn't good enough to warrent getting and the xp you get from the quest can be gotten faster by grinding...

Kinda kills the point...

 

[Void959]

Nice suggestions, unlike most of these type posts, I think that all of your ideas are good ones. Not only are they practical and relatively easy to implement, but they won't involve nerfing or otherwise diminishing the gameplay for any other type of player. I agree that they won't appeal appeal to the most hardcore RvR players, but neither will those players be opposed to them; and for the majority of the population who does not play exclusively RvR, they will make the game more enjoyable.

 

[Fana]

Having PvE goals that actually affect the realm is a good idea Also like Killswitch idea for Epic armour, something like that would be a great way to balance the need for crafters vs the need to have useable drops and questrewards.

 

[York]

I like your ideas but i cant help but think about how mythic would respond .. many of the new drops you get in the expansions are specific to those expansions, wouldnt putting content from those expansions into the old zones detract from the value of the expansions themselves thus giving people reason not to bother buying some expansions?

 

[Raven]

tabled - need specifics

 

[Kami]

Make sure you send it in anyway, one main thing that would help perk the game up would be more advertising by GOA and Mythic. Get the game in mags more often and on those annoying flash adverts on gaming websites - annoying but they do work!

 

[Krakatau]

Great ideas - nice to see something constructive here too

About the epic armor stuff...
Only reason to do epic these days is if you wanna have it for a lowbie alt, you're short of cash to buy better armor, for salvage etc etc...

Don't think the exp for doing epics is any better than doing other quests in catacombs/TOA either - so they really should look that "epic" stuff over...

My advice: Send your suggestions in at once

 

[Killswitch]

I like your ideas but i cant help but think about how mythic would respond .. many of the new drops you get in the expansions are specific to those expansions, wouldnt putting content from those expansions into the old zones detract from the value of the expansions themselves thus giving people reason not to bother buying some expansions?

Yup. I can see the reasons for keeping the new-type ROGs in the new areas. That said, we're about to have Catacombs, which is full of new ROGs with new effects that "won't have any effect on the balance of RvR" <cough>BULLSHIT<cough>. I don't think that having level 22 ROGs with +2 dexcap or just some decent stats dropping in Salisbury Plains or SI would make TOA less used. AFAIK you can still buy TOA drops and get the bonuses, even if you don't have TOA installed.

Think the reason people 'need' to buy TOA is for Artis and MLs. I just think it's stupid that you can farm drops (or even get ROGs) in TOA that are better than anything that drops in Old-Lands or SI. My scout uses Bane at the moment, that used to be the best Thruster in the game (or one of them). Now you can pay 100g on CMs for a ROG harpoon with better stats. It's just ridiculous. I think putting TOA-style ROGs in Old-Lands, SI and TOA would really help to fix this. Maybe stick some TOA bonuses on Sidi/Dragon drops too. We'll still have the latest and greatest Catacombs drops to make us buy the latest expansion. uke:

 

[Flimgoblin]

won't have any effect on the balance of RvR

Given that none of the new catacombs bonuses work against realm enemies they'd be hard pressed some of the drops from catacombs have nice stats (think ring of zahur or whatever) but that's it. Nothing like artifacts.

 

[Killswitch]

Given that none of the new catacombs bonuses work against realm enemies they'd be hard pressed some of the drops from catacombs have nice stats (think ring of zahur or whatever) but that's it. Nothing like artifacts.

I bow to your superior knowledge. That said, it's probably the case that 5000 rabid Europeans >> Mythic's Devs. If there's some way to abuse them or get some benefit from them in RvR, I reckon they'll be found. If not, the new skins and the nice drops (5x6% resists+hits+haste charge) rings/belts from the Instanced Dungeons will be nice to have. Maybe not worth totally redoing your template for, but still nice.

 

[Shike]

Great ideas, all except the idea of drop armour being better than crafted, IMO items created by an LGM should be far superior to drops. ATM MP takes a 1:50 chance, how easy is it getting these days to obtain artifacts and ML drops in comparison?

I disagree, Drops from _uber_ mobs should always be better, otherwise there is no reason to actually kill them more than the thrill.

And, if crafters can make the best shit ever, everybody will run around in it. 20p to make a set of armor isnt much really. Now, to make it more interesting why not use a dropped component from an ubermob to craft the best shit ever? Id say that would be a good solution. (hi WoW tho... :/ )

For me Id be happy if say a helmet was craftable and use a dragons head for example, to craft a really cool helmet with horns and maybe even some funky special ability? etc

Dunno why they never made the crafting in daoc interesting :/

 

[old.Whoodoo]

Dunno why they never made the crafting in daoc interesting :/

Perhaps because they thought something like this:

I disagree, Drops from _uber_ mobs should always be better, otherwise there is no reason to actually kill them more than the thrill.

And, if crafters can make the best shit ever, everybody will run around in it. 20p to make a set of armor isnt much really. Now, to make it more interesting why not use a dropped component from an ubermob to craft the best shit ever? Id say that would be a good solution. (hi WoW tho... :/ )

For me Id be happy if say a helmet was craftable and use a dragons head for example, to craft a really cool helmet with horns and maybe even some funky special ability? etc

You fail to see my point entirely, us crafters spend hours and days to get good enough fo MP high items, its a really long slog to LGM in any craft, and these days unless you get lucky with MP, really not worth doing. On the other hand, 1fg, 10 minutes and presto, MP drops, major utility, why bother. Heck even some ROGs have better procs and stats that make crafted look crap, thats plain sick.

 

[Syri]

Perhaps because they thought something like this:


You fail to see my point entirely, us crafters spend hours and days to get good enough fo MP high items, its a really long slog to LGM in any craft, and these days unless you get lucky with MP, really not worth doing. On the other hand, 1fg, 10 minutes and presto, MP drops, major utility, why bother. Heck even some ROGs have better procs and stats that make crafted look crap, thats plain sick.

I think the drops referenced were things like dragon drops, elite mobs like in barfog. give them a low drop rate, toughen up the mobs so that they're as hard as they used to be, after all, players are stronger now, especially in pve, the epic encounters need bringing in line. this wouldn't impact crafting, especially if drops are rare, but would give new life to the old areas

 

[Shike]

You fail to see my point entirely, us crafters spend hours and days to get good enough fo MP high items, its a really long slog to LGM in any craft, and these days unless you get lucky with MP, really not worth doing. On the other hand, 1fg, 10 minutes and presto, MP drops, major utility, why bother. Heck even some ROGs have better procs and stats that make crafted look crap, thats plain sick.

Crafting in DAoC is actually very very easy aslong as you have the cash to skill up to LGM. My wife did it in 3 weeks or so as an armorcrafter, it aint much tbh.

And 10mins for an _uber_ mob? Comon now

I mean _uber_ mob when I type _uber_ mob and not some sissycrapmob. The day they make really hard encounters I'll be very happy. Instances are actually very suited for just this.

Example:

Enter a dungeon that takes about 3 hours to clear for a really really good group with hard mobs all the way (BUT, 1 FG can manage if they are good as hell in PVE), face a couple of bossmobs on the way that are even harder, meaning, if you do one slight fuckup on the encounter, you wipe and begin from zero, period. Then finally some major encounter with alittle thinking involved, an extremely hard endmob (one minimal mistake from anyone and you die horribly), and finally a reward for all the bloody work, that probably just took a full group 4-5 hours to complete. Endreward could be some really good drop, a key that is needed to go to next dungeon with similar setup but a better reward, etc.. Im not talking TOAshitdungeons here.. Im talking really really hard stuff all through the way for one really competent group. Now thats a challenge imo, and if endreward justify the difficulty, I'd go there, over and over and over again.

And mind you, crafting in combo with a dropped item is the way to go imo to make it all more interesting.. Crafters should be able to finetune drops to make them alil better, and so on...

 

[old.Whoodoo]

And 10mins for an _uber_ mob? Comon now

I mean _uber_ mob when I type _uber_ mob and not some sissycrapmob. The day they make really hard encounters I'll be very happy. Instances are actually very suited for just this.

Ill name a few:

The dragon, doable in 25 mins with 3fg (max 96% qual)
Mariasha's gloves - solo, 6 seconds (skald + SOS)
GOV - 1fg 12 mins
Shiatan Wind Bracer - 1fg exactly 10 mins
Ebon Hyde bracer (high util and very nice) Solo, 1 hour, solo+skald, 20 mins
Braggarts bow
Scarab vest - solo, ok farming is long winded, but still a doddle.
Immolated ring - 5 mins 3 ppl, same for Immolated bow
etc etc

All these items have high imbue, great procs / charges, some that cant be made by alchemists like lifetap and POM charges, most are MP, all fit templates very well... you can in fact kit out a toon with MP / 99 gear. How can any crafter compete with that?

 

[Shike]

Ill name a few:

The dragon, doable in 25 mins with 3fg (max 96% qual)
Mariasha's gloves - solo, 6 seconds (skald + SOS)
GOV - 1fg 12 mins
Shiatan Wind Bracer - 1fg exactly 10 mins
Ebon Hyde bracer (high util and very nice) Solo, 1 hour, solo+skald, 20 mins
Braggarts bow
Scarab vest - solo, ok farming is long winded, but still a doddle.
Immolated ring - 5 mins 3 ppl, same for Immolated bow
etc etc

All these items have high imbue, great procs / charges, some that cant be made by alchemists like lifetap and POM charges, most are MP, all fit templates very well... you can in fact kit out a toon with MP / 99 gear. How can any crafter compete with that?

dragon is doable with 1fg hibbis, gov is duoable, Shaitan is random drop, easy as pie aswell, ebonhide is easy, scarab is dreadful to lvl afaik, braggart is duoable, immolated is easy to farm...

You cant compete with it, impossible yep, and I really never said otherwise mate. Reread what Im saying please, craftingconcept is easy in daoc, all you need is cash and alittle time and you are done. Id like to see ALOT harder encounters and I mean ALOT and deffo more thought through, I dont like zergmobs that nothing else than a zerg can take down due to the to-hit code and easy stuff is also boring, catacombs for example was supposed to be hard, we ran through the hardest instance in 2 hours and didnt really have a hard time during it.

Id like to see hard encounterdrops be used in combo with crafting, that would deffo give something for crafters to do, and also bring in some fun pve with a good purpose and would also mean that if mythic used alil creativity, lots of new items could be brought in, possibly with different skins etc so it aint as it is now, everyone running around with GoV or Erinys etc.. that just sucks tbh.

edit: a problem is obviosly that americans cant pve.. they just plain suck at it and think everything is too hard to complete.. whereas a good eurogroup shrug and say, wtf that didnt even made me use 70% of my toon.

 

[Shanaia]

Immolated ring - 5 mins 3 ppl, same for Immolated bow

rofl I know a lot of people that don't quite agree with that statement...

 

[Kicks]

Immolated ring - 5 mins 3 ppl

If only

 

[Shike]

think he means per round of 1.1

 

[Gribz0r]

Revamping old zones is a good idea, however that doesn't mean that the entire world will be used by the players. Only a small minority of players enjoy running around while exping.

How many of us have done (I'm talking alb now) Mithra-Sals plains (and not entire sals plains nooo slavercamp and broken bridge) - Keltoi - Barrows - Lyonesse and this with all chars? What happened when SI was added with its 6 new zones? We replaced high level Lyonesse with Avalon City, the rest stayed EXACTLY the same.

We complained classic camelot mobs had dumb A.I. SI brought rooting, nuking and teaming mobs. You think anyone touches those to xp on?

I do agree on changing the dropsystem of Classic tho. I mean how unfair that I have to run around in AF4 tattered when if I start the same char in SI i can get AF6 and it can even be studded!.

 

[Olgaline]

would also be great to see DF renewed,
no one really goes past the gate keeper dommel anymore.
I mean you have a epic rvr dungeon with mobs carrying tiltes like
"Legion, Behemoth, Beliathan, the 3 prince's, Grand Chancellor Adremal, dukes, earls, high lords and so on, but there is really no incetive for anyone to venture there anymore, exept mearly to see it once, since the challange / reward just isnt worth the time, and i really find/ found that a real shame, and it's basicly been this way since the release of Si,