News Hmm....

[Aoami]

BBC NEWS | Technology | Pirate Bay founders found guilty

what does this mean?

 

[Moriath]

BBC NEWS | Technology | Pirate Bay founders found guilty

what does this mean?

not a lot .. they said it will keep on keeping on just means it has to be hosted outside of sweden which it has been since they raided it

 

[old.Tohtori]

Yeah, just last attempts of the trademark ghoul to bring someone down with it.

Harsh though, harsh.

 

[Xandax]

It means that criminal people gets punished.

No respect for such people from me at all. They deserve every hit with the law-mallet they get.
Piracy is a crime, it costs people money. People live off the products others take without paying.

 

[Corran]

It means that criminal people gets punished.

No respect for such people from me at all. They deserve every hit with the law-mallet they get.
Piracy is a crime, it costs people money. People live off the products others take without paying.

these people werent involved in act of piracy directly though, there nothing to say that they made pirates of copy right meterial etc i mean by that. All they done is hosted a server that people put torrent links on. Links would be both legal and illegal and they didnt charge any money etc.

The appeal will be interesting, this clearly is a politically motivated judgement which means it can be argued as being unsafe. And how the hell do they expect them to pay a fine of that magnitude, it is insane.

Piracy doesnt cost people money, it costs firms money. Firms that actually dont lose the money most the time, I know i watched movies online that i would never watch otherwise. Sometimes having watched it i will go out and buy it, however i would never rent/buy it without having seen it.

Movie firms get a chunk their money from cinema's buying right to see the film. This wont change the amount of money they get from that, if anyone losing money it the cinema companies, not the studios. Actors get paid regardless of how well a movie does (in general they have flat fee and it not related to the success of film/merchandise).

Anyways, this doesnt really matter to me. TPB has been focused on for so long anyone involved in it was crazy, sooner or later a legit or bogus charge was going to be thrown at them to try bring them down however you will never stop torrent sharing of movies. You can take one down but there be a hundred others to take its place, and the best ones know how to stay under the radar.

 

[megadave]

torrents are so last year anyway

 

[Ctuchik]

not a lot .. they said it will keep on keeping on just means it has to be hosted outside of sweden which it has been since they raided it

no it hasent, they had to move the servers back to sweden because the former country they had the servers on didnt want trouble with USA.

and thats all this case boils down to. they got convicted because USA wanted them to be convicted. its a "good will" case meant to please USA.


with that said, i cant say i feel awefully sorry for them. i was following this as much as i could at the start but they even managed to piss ME off, and i loved these guys. but they were so fucking smug i just ended up wishing them get burnt. and is probably why they did to, i bet they pissed off the jury.

 

[Dahakon]

It pissed me right off, they got given a year in jail when they did nothing technically wrong. They didn't make any illegal copies themselves, all they did was provide a service for people, which while many have used illegally; it's the same as charging a gun seller for murder if someone was killed by a gun that they sold (bit of an extreme example i know, but you get the point). This was just the big record labels being unable to grasp that their short lived (compared to how long music has been around) business model is dying, and a new one, with less money in it (and most probably much better music because of that) is on the rise. They are going down and they know it, but they want to hang on making as much money for as long as possible.

 

[Thorwyn]

They didn't make any illegal copies themselves, all they did was provide a service for people, which while many have used illegally

Wrong.
They didnt´provide a Service, which people might have used illegally. They provided the Service while being fully aware that the people were using it exclusievely for illegal purposes. It´s pretty naive and cheeky to say "hey, *technically* I havent´done anything wrong". They got lots of legal threats and suits and answered them all, so it´s pretty obvious that they were aware of their site being abused for that kind of stuff. They just didn´t care.

Your analogy about the weapon dealer is flawed. If you´re dealing with weapons and you´re aware that some, most or all of your customers are using the weapons to kill people, you ARE responsible to do something. You can´t just play the "I´m just selling stuff, not my problem what AlCapone is doing with it" card too.

 

[Cemeterygates]

it's the same as charging a gun seller for murder if someone was killed by a gun that they sold (bit of an extreme example i know, but you get the point).

They wouldn't be charged with murder for selling a gun, they would be charged with dealing in illegal firearms, which, if i recall correctly carries a heavy penalty.

 

[Lamp]

What did these people expect? A slap on the wrist, confiscate their servers, don't do it again, and off you go ? The music & film industry has been moaning for years about getting people like this, now they've had their day in court. What makes a mockery of the whole thing is that putting them in jail won't recover their millions of dollars of lost intellectual property revenue. The guys don't have that kind of cash and even if they did didn't they say they wouldn't pay it? So end of the day, the industry still has lost its revenue, 4 people are in jail, but its still gonna go on and on and on until they start targetting every single person who downloads stuff - the ordinary joe six-pack like you and...err...

 

[pikeh]

You can't really argue that they weren't intending for the service to be used for illegal activites, when they named the damn thing 'Piratebay'.

 

[Lakih]

You can't really argue that they weren't intending for the service to be used for illegal activites, when they named the damn thing 'Piratebay'.

There's a book publishing house in sweden called piratförlaget (pirate-publishing)... it's managed and owned by some of swedens most popular authors.

You cant say that by nameing something someway what their intentions was with the service. Now, im not so naive that im saying the piratebay people knew exactly what they where doing or what was going on on the site, but what this sentence is telling us is that it is illegal to supply links to torrents that contains copywrited material... try search for torrents on google.com, ill bet you find a few. So will the media circus try to battle Google? No effin' way, they got some real power and cash to put up a fair fight so its pointless...

Its alot easier to buy the legal system of a small country with a goverment with no backbone... like they did in this case.

 

[Fuggz]

I am suffering from déjà vu. Am sure I just posted about this elsewhere. Oh I did:

Lets face it I bet everyone uses some dodgy software or other. I may as well throw my computer (s) out the window cos without the dodgy stuff it (they) sure as hell wouldn't work. Not gonna get a knock on my door now am I? It is so rediculously easy to get any software you want without having to pay forrit. Beats me how these file sharing websites have ever been allowed to operate. Being 'lenient' doesn't always work. Look at the sodding state of our country and where it is going. Someone somewhere has to put their foot down and take control. It ain't right that you can get hold of any software without paying forrit - what the hell is hard to figure out about that? Once these controls are in place you accept them without hesitation. Prior to this you take advantage. Until I am made to stop I will carry on just like zillions of people like me. Ain't my responsibility to stop it either. Someone somewhere needs to take control and stop it altogether. Maybe this is the first step.

I is the most common sensible person I knows.

 

[Ctuchik]

You cant say that by nameing something someway what their intentions was with the service.

no your right, but the whole purpose of TPB was to make it easy for ppl to download illegal software.

 

[fettoken]

i bet they pissed off the jury.

You might have it mixed up with something, as there is no jury of that kind in Sweden.

Still, i bet they would have lost even if they swapped the prosecutor for a monkey. Which they should have in the first place.

The ones prosecuted did not think they had done anything illegal, and they have not done anything illegal. But their attitude towards it probably made them loose. They only provided a place where people could share media.

Much like Ebay renders services to those who wants to sell goods. If someone happens to sell stolen goods, its not the "Ebays" fault but the seller. But the Ebay staff would certainly cooperate to sort that kind of activity out if they were asked to.

While Thepiratebay owners does nothing to remove "stolen" media if the copyright owners would ask them to remove it.

So i think the fault tilts over to TPB.

And legally, there is no excuse for being "blissfully unaware" of things. They should have been aware of it and they should have taken action..... legally speaking ofcourse.

 

[Ctuchik]

And legally, there is no excuse for being "blissfully unaware" of things. They should have been aware of it and they should have taken action..... legally speaking ofcourse.

but they are aware of it. they are just trying to change how this stuff is handeled, in all the wrong ways.

this isnt gonna make the industry change one bit, its just gonna make them fuck things up for the legal consumer even more with even more DRM shit.

 

[fettoken]

but they are aware of it. they are just trying to change how this stuff is handeled, in all the wrong ways.

this isnt gonna make the industry change one bit, its just gonna make them fuck things up for the legal consumer even more with even more DRM shit.

*nods*

My personal opinion, they got what was coming to them!

 

[Everz]

It means that criminal people gets punished.

No respect for such people from me at all. They deserve every hit with the law-mallet they get.
Piracy is a crime, it costs people money. People live off the products others take without paying.

Oh yes, those poor poor people who will have to settle for 2months in the Bahamas rather then that luxury around the world cruise.. oh the humanity!

So what? One down about 2million sites left to go, i'll still download and not pay crap for overpriced movies/songs.

 

[Xandax]

these people werent involved in act of piracy directly though, there nothing to say that they made pirates of copy right meterial etc i mean by that. All they done is hosted a server that people put torrent links on. Links would be both legal and illegal and they didnt charge any money etc. <snip>

Doesn't matter. They willingly and knowingly build a service facilitating illegal operations.
And don't bring the "omg Google" argument. Their service isn't build to facilitate illegal material, and they try to prevent it by removing reported links.

<snip>
The appeal will be interesting, this clearly is a politically motivated judgement which means it can be argued as being unsafe. And how the hell do they expect them to pay a fine of that magnitude, it is insane.
<snip>

By being in debt the rest of their lives. Don't do crime, if you can't do the time.

<snip>
Piracy doesnt cost people money, it costs firms money. Firms that actually dont lose the money most the time, I know i watched movies online that i would never watch otherwise. Sometimes having watched it i will go out and buy it, however i would never rent/buy it without having seen it.
<snip>

Nonsense and ramblings.
It costs companies a shit load of money. It causes legit customers like me endless problems because companies have to put all sorts of DRM stuff on my legally purchased products making them sometimes unplayable or only usable via much hoop jumping. I'll be forced to pay higher prices because they have to cover the hole from the ones who still don't think they'll have to pay for the products they take.

Just read for example this recently released bit for a random computer game I saw the other day:
Demigod: Day 1 Status Report Forum Post by Frogboy
Sadly, most of the ~120,000 connections are not customers but via warez. About 18,000 are legitimate.

And countless examples like this can be found to show the effect pirates have. Yet they live in la-la land where the rules of society doesn't have to apply to them at all.

My especially favorite "i R p1ratez" argument is that "oh I wouldn't have bought the product anyway, so the company doesn't loose anything by me taking it without paying".
Nonsense. Wanting the product enough to take it without paying and thus breaking the law .... just because it is easy? And then saying you didn't actually want it? Yeah - that makes sense.
I'm sure most every criminal tries to justify his crime.

The world is increasingly more and more digital. Taking stuff without paying simply because you can and somehow don't think it is a real product - then you should surely get smacked upside down with fines and prison. I applaud punishing these jerks to the full extend of the law.

And yes - it is oh so unpopular to say but it is real life, it is real life money, it is the lively hood for people these guys are playing with.

They broke the law, they facility breaking it knowingly, with consent and with intent.
Who cares if the server in itself didn't contain the material. They knew what they did, they got busted, they get smacked around.
Time to step up and take it like men, instead of whining like a kid who got caught with the hands in the cookie jar.

 

[Thorwyn]

Much like Ebay renders services to those who wants to sell goods. If someone happens to sell stolen goods, its not the "Ebays" fault but the seller. But the Ebay staff would certainly cooperate to sort that kind of activity out if they were asked to.

Wrong again!
If people are selling pirated or otherwise illegal stuff on Ebay, Ebay is required to take the auctions down. They can´t lean back and say: we´re just a platform. Ebay has a HUGE staff to take care of exactly that.

 

[fettoken]

Wrong again!
If people are selling pirated or otherwise illegal stuff on Ebay, Ebay is required to take the auctions down. They can´t lean back and say: we´re just a platform. Ebay has a HUGE staff to take care of exactly that.

If its found out to be illegal, then yes. My point was, that they actually look into this.

 

[Thorwyn]

The thing is: they´re required to look into this, they don´t have a choice.
If you´re hosting a website and a forum, you´re legally responsible for all the content. That´s true for forums as well as any other service/site. I don´t know whether that law applies to UK and SE too (I think it´s EU law, not sure thouigh), but in Germany, if someone decides to post an illegal comment on a forum, the forum host is legally responsible. And on Ebay, if someone tries to sell a copy of "Mein Kampf", Ebay is legally responsible too.

 

[fettoken]

So, to conclude. The moral in this story = Self responsibility for property owners!

 

[nath]

Just read for example this recently released bit for a random computer game I saw the other day:
Demigod: Day 1 Status Report Forum Post by Frogboy
Sadly, most of the ~120,000 connections are not customers but via warez. About 18,000 are legitimate.

And countless examples like this can be found to show the effect pirates have.

Actually all you can take from that is that ~120,000 people pirated the software. To derive meaning from this statistic is purely assumption, more research is needed to demonstrate that this number represents lost sales. It's incorrect to just jump to that conclusion.

My especially favorite "i R p1ratez" argument is that "oh I wouldn't have bought the product anyway, so the company doesn't loose anything by me taking it without paying".
Nonsense. Wanting the product enough to take it without paying and thus breaking the law .... just because it is easy? And then saying you didn't actually want it? Yeah - that makes sense.
I'm sure most every criminal tries to justify his crime.

While I agree there's no doubt people out there who pirate media that they would have otherwise paid for, to dismiss the idea that some people simply wouldn't have purchased the product otherwise is absurd. The fact is, there is pirated software readily and easily available - it's entirely reasonable that people may want to download something but not pay for it. If they genuinely had no intention of buying the product in the first place then pirating it can be completely morally neutral.

Given the way torrents work, it's not quite as simple as that though - the act of downloading assists others in pirating the software, some of whom may well have paid for it if they had no opportunity to download it. However, my point is that I think it's a very simplistic view to say "piracy is always bad, and every pirated copy represents a lost sale". That's just not the way it works and there really needs to be some properly conducted research to display just how much of an affect piracy is having on the industry. In fact, I saw recently some evidence that suggested the PC gaming industry is stronger than it's ever been and still growing. Retail sales are down but overall sales are up - people are just moving to digital distribution services such as steam.