FAO Raid leaders

[Golena]

Can we try to come up with a better way of posting raids.

A title of: Sidi Raid!!!
or: ARTI RAID!!!

is next to useless when trying to either see what's on you want to attend or when to plan a raid.
By far the best thing to do is start the thread title with the date of the raid, that makes it very easy for people to quickly see what events are happening on a given day. If your running an event or events over multiple days, create multiple posts or list all the days in the thread title.

22nd November Sidi Raid
Sidi Raid

Which of the previous 2 thread titles would you be most likely to visit on the 21st of November when thinking about what you might want to do tommorow?

The arti raids run by Psyco being an example, a thread title with an incorrect date, and then 4 seperate dates hidden within the thread body.. I actually had to sit down and read it carefully to spot them, an initial skim of the text missed them completely. Multiply this by the 10 sticky's we have at the moment and finding out what's on today becomes a complete nightmare nevermind trying to work out what date is free to actually host a raid. Even if I had wanted the artifacts listed and though psyco was an excelent leader I wouldn't of attended because when the day arrived and I skimmed the FH stickys to see if anything was happening I was interested in that night, his post wouldn't of given me any clue that this was important for today. (not picking on you here psyco, it's true of a huge number of recent threads, yours was just the one I picked at random cos I clashed with you)

People at the moment are complaining of too many ML's and not enough attendances to raids posted. I'm actually not surprised.. 50% of the ML raids posted are probably because the leaders haven't realised the exact same ML is actually being run 2 days earlier, because the only mention of it is 2 pages down in a 3 week old thread, and the lack of attendance it therefore gets is because people on the date the raid is being hosted actually have no idea it's even happening.

 

[Rickie]

Rep ofc! :worthy:



https://forums.freddyshouse.com/showthread.php?t=199068

^^ Any of the raidleaders ever read this?

:touch:

 

[Necromaniak]

I know how to post

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/showthread.php?t=193103

all my post had a clear topic tho

I was actually thinking of a calendar for raids that u can see the marked days etc

just a tought

 

[Shannesa]

yes read it and try my best make my topic as they should be richie know it as well

when come to mls i allways been call them offical ml rusehs

 

[Alan]

IMO refuse to sticky posts that don't match your format they will soon learn.

If a post needs the date changed - PM a mod and it will be edited, but for the love of god dont just say "can you change my raid from 6 to 8" give a link to the bloody thread !

 

[psyco]

yes, it was late at night, and when sceduleing i looked at the wrong week, and when i realized it was 2 late to change(well actully i forgot i could edit title, and didn't notice it in there till after) anyway

though due to the nature of the raid, i wouldn't give dates and time in thread header...

but yes sorry, i fucked up

tbh, i thought i was a bit incompetent at the time, as i didn't alow people enough time to stick, and didn't keep the BG well enough informed, will try to do better tomorrow... but also, was one of the first bg's i lead(and one of the first set of arti's i activated, and probbly pushed WAY above my weight when organizing this) as a result, i didn't know JS had to be killed within his little cave, i do now

also i dont seem to be able to control a bg very well, i said charge, and i had to smite to pull with my cleric>.<(could be related to the fact that i only had 30 in bg, but we'll see)

this said i still dont excuse my self, and will try better tomoz

but yes on topic, raid leaders need some kind of universal(free of spam) chat group or something, to avoid raid clash's ect... and maybe reduce the ammount of ml rush's by haveing lots of co-leaders or something

 

[Golena]

Few quick points...

though due to the nature of the raid, i wouldn't give dates and time in thread header...

Why not? What your doing is making it much harder for people to actually find out when your raid is occuring. I (and i'm sure alot of other people) just don't have time to read every thread every day to find out when a raid is.. if it's not in the title, then lots of people won't know about it.

Your actual thread title was:
Arti Raids over the next month(E) - 7pm uktime - starting from Thusday 16th

A thread title something like:
Arti raids 7pm uk time - 16/11th, 22/11nd, 28/11th 7/12th

would of given the same information, but people could of seen easily when the raids were taking place. As it is I doubt on the 7th of december many people are going to click on a thread with the only date being 16th, so your attendance will probably be much lower than it could of been.

also i dont seem to be able to control a bg very well, i said charge, and i had to smite to pull with my cleric>.<(could be related to the fact that i only had 30 in bg, but we'll see)

This has been the bane of raid leaders since day 1. It doesn't matter if it's your first or your 100th.. you can yell charge all you want, 90% of the time the BG will only move when they see you move..
Either ask someone in your group to pull for you, and actually say "ok X pull that one now" or learn how to look like your charging when your actually only moving 2ft forward.. by the time they realise they will already have pulled.
The most important aspect of a BG leader is to know what they arn't good at so they can ask for advice on how to do it better, and since you've already identified stuff that went wrong i'm sure your next will be more successful. Another important thing is to find out what your doing before hand, you probably realise this.. if you don't know everything about an encounter, say that before hand so the people that do can inform you of stuff that you will need to know in advance.

but yes on topic, raid leaders need some kind of universal(free of spam) chat group or something, to avoid raid clash's ect...

That's still not going to help if people expect you to dig through posts for the times of the raid.. either post it in the title, or expect people to organise clashing raids. The last thing we need is another place we need to look.. We have a universal place, it's called the sticky's, but it only works if the information there is uncluttered and easy to see.

and maybe reduce the ammount of ml rush's by haveing lots of co-leaders or something

Lots of co-leaders (in fact even one co-leader) is almost always a bad idea. Everyone has their own slightly different ways of doing things.. The worst possible thing that any BG can have if something needs doing or goes wrong is more than one person giving orders (because they are almost bound to be different). Co-leaders just don't work! Having someone more experienced along as a new raid leader to give tips or advice is fine, as long as the BG knows who to follow when things go tits up.

 

[psyco]

Your actual thread title was:
Arti Raids over the next month(E) - 7pm uktime - starting from Thusday 16th

A thread title something like:
Arti raids 7pm uk time - 16/11th, 22/11nd, 28/11th 7/12th

This has been the bane of raid leaders since day 1. It doesn't matter if it's your first or your 100th.. you can yell charge all you want, 90% of the time the BG will only move when they see you move..
Either ask someone in your group to pull for you, and actually say "ok X pull that one now" or learn how to look like your charging when your actually only moving 2ft forward.. by the time they realise they will already have pulled.
The most important aspect of a BG leader is to know what they arn't good at so they can ask for advice on how to do it better, and since you've already identified stuff that went wrong i'm sure your next will be more successful. Another important thing is to find out what your doing before hand, you probably realise this.. if you don't know everything about an encounter, say that before hand so the people that do can inform you of stuff that you will need to know in advance.

That's still not going to help if people expect you to dig through posts for the times of the raid.. either post it in the title, or expect people to organise clashing raids. The last thing we need is another place we need to look.. We have a universal place, it's called the sticky's, but it only works if the information there is uncluttered and easy to see.

Lots of co-leaders (in fact even one co-leader) is almost always a bad idea. Everyone has their own slightly different ways of doing things.. The worst possible thing that any BG can have if something needs doing or goes wrong is more than one person giving orders (because they are almost bound to be different). Co-leaders just don't work! Having someone more experienced along as a new raid leader to give tips or advice is fine, as long as the BG knows who to follow when things go tits up.

actully my thread was for the 9th whereas the body was for 16th, i got tears/alan to change it not 1 hour ago
and yes, thats a great idea, i never thought about that, ill pm him now
that was my first raid where the majority of the info wasn't in the header... so dont get on me about it

i guess i would've learned that over time, but thanks for the tip
i read vos for the info, and there was no specific info about that aspect of the encounter, so i guessed it didn't matter... i spent hours writing down what was required of each encounter, so dont say i wasn't prepared!
example 1, vos said for BoZ start the encounter, and goto the arena( i didn't know where that was so i followed people who knew what they were doing) it also said you didn't have to say 'ready' each time... luckly someone said you have to say it... though i was still knew alot about the ecnouter, about who to speak to ect. but without previous knowlage, i wouldn't have known some things
and FS, i didn't know where the gorgon was, i asked in bg and was told the needed info
but atleast i dont act 'god' when leading bgs

thats obviously not good enough, 2 weekends ago i did a co5, then allmighty goes and organised a ml rush on the same day, my thread was clearly labeld and everything...

well was only a suggestion, imo, raid leaders need to co-operate more often... and having a actual chat group of some kind, would be the start to more efficient raids ect

 

[Necromaniak]

Great solution

Im working on a great solution wich im gonna introduce soon!

 

[psyco]

Im working on a great solution wich im gonna introduce soon!

your the king:worthy: i take it your on msn... will pm you in 5 mins

 

[Golena]

that was my first raid where the majority of the info wasn't in the header... so dont get on me about it

Hope your not mis-interpreting me.. I'm not trying to get at you, it's just your thread made a good example of how things could be improved. I'm not trying to put you down, just offer advice that can help out for future and make raid planning easier for everyone.

i read vos for the info

While VOS is a great source of information it's also several years out of date.. most of the stuff from recent patches isn't included in there, so it's always an idea to check if the info there is up to date if your not sure. It's your first raid however and you only find most stuff like that out from experience, so again i'm not critisicing.

but atleast i dont act 'god' when leading bgs

I wasn't there, and haven't talked to anyone that was, so i'm certainly not in a position to say if you did a good or bad job, or wern't prepared (it actually sounds like you did a fair bit). I'm just throwing out advice that you can choose to follow or not depending on if you think it's useful based on my experiences when I started leading stuff. I'd caution against assuming that because VoS says do it X way then that's the best way to do it however. The best advice I can offer at the end of the day is to go to other peoples raids and see what they do badly or well. The best raid leaders are normally those who have attended lots of raids in the past and seen the different ways everyone else has done it. Depends on how much time you have free however.

thats obviously not good enough, 2 weekends ago i did a co5, then allmighty goes and organised a ml rush on the same day, my thread was clearly labeld and everything...

Something you also learn quickly is that no matter how much you do, it's not always going to go according to plan. Not every raid will be successful or get the numbers. All you can do is re-post it and try again.

well was only a suggestion, imo, raid leaders need to co-operate more often... and having a actual chat group of some kind, would be the start to more efficient raids ect

Certainly no harm in making suggestions.. I'm unsure what you mean by chat group however.. an in game chat group wouldn't really help since only the people in game at the time would be co-ordinating, and another forum would just be another place to go look, and probably not used by everyone just leading to another set of arguments. Care to elaborate on what you actually mean here?

 

[thergador]

Lots of co-leaders (in fact even one co-leader) is almost always a bad idea. Everyone has their own slightly different ways of doing things.. The worst possible thing that any BG can have if something needs doing or goes wrong is more than one person giving orders (because they are almost bound to be different). Co-leaders just don't work! Having someone more experienced along as a new raid leader to give tips or advice is fine, as long as the BG knows who to follow when things go tits up.

i would like to point that 99% of the raids i run i have a co leader (pinkey) how ever she's sat next to me and she types while i drive the bg and bash stuff etc and she grants credits after the step so it can work but in most case's i would agree with your self. if your not able to speak to them with out typing your just making more work for your self.

and maybe a raid request system might be handy so us bg leaders know if peeps want us to lead raids ie when i said i was coming back i got pms asking for another ml1 to 8 day and now with ml rush each weekend either side of it i'm not sure its still needed/wanted as i could have re-planned and done a sidi raid instead

also i seem to be sensing a feeling that some peeps think that running a ml raid gives you some kind of status above other people and tbh i really think if that why people are running them they should think again. not being a brown nose but allot off people seem to try and be eggy, by just leading ml raids i do admit it was eggy that got me in to running them (by attending his and ask his advice) but that dont make me an eggy clone, for one eggy and many other didnt just do ml rush they did the real work too rvr organisation and imo if you want a status, rvr raid leader like some of the old names

/rant off

 

[psyco]

Hope your not mis-interpreting me.. I'm not trying to get at you, it's just your thread made a good example of how things could be improved. I'm not trying to put you down, just offer advice that can help out for future and make raid planning easier for everyone.

While VOS is a great source of information it's also several years out of date.. most of the stuff from recent patches isn't included in there, so it's always an idea to check if the info there is up to date if your not sure. It's your first raid however and you only find most stuff like that out from experience, so again i'm not critisicing.

I wasn't there, and haven't talked to anyone that was, so i'm certainly not in a position to say if you did a good or bad job, or wern't prepared (it actually sounds like you did a fair bit). I'm just throwing out advice that you can choose to follow or not depending on if you think it's useful based on my experiences when I started leading stuff. I'd caution against assuming that because VoS says do it X way then that's the best way to do it however. The best advice I can offer at the end of the day is to go to other peoples raids and see what they do badly or well. The best raid leaders are normally those who have attended lots of raids in the past and seen the different ways everyone else has done it. Depends on how much time you have free however.

Something you also learn quickly is that no matter how much you do, it's not always going to go according to plan. Not every raid will be successful or get the numbers. All you can do is re-post it and try again.

Certainly no harm in making suggestions.. I'm unsure what you mean by chat group however.. an in game chat group wouldn't really help since only the people in game at the time would be co-ordinating, and another forum would just be another place to go look, and probably not used by everyone just leading to another set of arguments. Care to elaborate on what you actually mean here?

not at all, i know you intentions are good... but its likely that that(this) will be the only series raid i plan(unless a ml rush), as i needed allot of different artis on my alts

i know, but there's not really any other site i can use... also i knew that some arti's methods have changed, although there not vastly different... if you get me:-/ while i agree its a good place to start off, but generally if i did an encounter wrong someone would put me right, witch is fine

the only place i lack is experience is in arti's... but in the process of gaining that
and it was only poorly lead to my standards, at the end of the bg everyone said that i did a good job

i actually delayed it 24 hours went great, but people obviously didn't take much notice of the rules... they didn't inform me as to how many group leaders there where and they didn't form groups properly... then people started to blame me for it... but i didn't make a issue about it, until now

like a msg board of some kind, or a chat room(outside daoc) where there would be msg's... like a irc room, with a bot... but FH is so widely used, its like trying to find a needle in a hey stack... the irc room would be moderated, so that only leaders could get in and view msg's(i have irc @ experience, so could do that if needed)
side note: i also believe that Albion as a realm need some organization(due to the fall in numbers) avyseth started, but fell at the first hurdle(unfortunalty)

 

[thergador]

the only place i lack is experience is in arti's... but in the process of gaining that
and it was only poorly lead to my standards, at the end of the bg everyone said that i did a good job

if i can ever help with artie advice m8 feel free to get in touch have done them all bar NSB loads of times in small grps to large zergs i have got some note's and fraps videos of how to do arties which i'm sorting for the GnD weeby (which i'm changing from a guild website to a Daoc info site thats why its not up to 1.85 )

if you want you can have my msn

may be thats something regular raid leaders might wanna do so if a bg hits a problem we can ask some else if they have had the bugg etc before and if they managed to fix it

 

[psyco]

if i can ever help with artie advice m8 feel free to get in touch have done them all bar NSB loads of times in small grps to large zergs i have got some note's and fraps videos of how to do arties which i'm sorting for the GnD weeby (which i'm changing from a guild website to a Daoc info site thats why its not up to 1.85 )

if you want you can have my msn

may be thats something regular raid leaders might wanna do so if a bg hits a problem we can ask some else if they have had the bugg etc before and if they managed to fix it

i used that website a while ago(stole the crafting leveling guides)
and for some of my presteps(before i became a seasoned profesional)

i guess the irc thing would be a good idea then?
if you can give me the server that alb uses ill start making

also, i guess having your msn wouldn't hurt, drop it to me in a pm

 

[Phule_Gubben]

Here's a great source of information about a lot of things.

Cliketyclick

 

[psyco]

Here's a great source of information about a lot of things.

Cliketyclick

problem with that site is, you need to submit info for that... and

At 4000 15500 in Arbor Glen, cyclops that are red and grape con protect the entrance of a canyon. Further in are two named mobs, Basali and Cyrek. To get encounter, you need to kill Cyrek. However, Basali needs to be killed first before you can agro the other named mob, and Cyreks difficulty in killing is dependant on the number of cyclopses in the canyon. Best way is to bring a bg with you, preferably with lots of PBAoE nukes, and clear the cyclopes then kill Basali then Cyrek. They cannot be kited outside the canyon, so you need to run inside and kill him.

we got him outside his canyon...
although, didn't know anything about the basali thing... maybe thats why we didn't get cred:-/

edit: theres no AT

 

[Phule_Gubben]

Well it gets updated now and then, and you don't have to type anything in there to be able to recieve any info. just click links and read.

Atlantis Tablet is an easy enc. which I think most ppl have done once or twice. So that shouldn't be a big problem.

Ie. kill guards outside the temple, move bg inside, move up to the ceiling, fop up and all. Have someone ungrouped swim down and click a chest at the time. If it's the wrong one a guardian will appear, kill him off and do next chest until the right mob pops. There's one thing the mainmob is doing but info on that you should find out on VoS.

Note! I've read your raidrules, why make it so hard for yourself? Try to enjoy and have fun instead. I think Golenas posts are really some of the best advice I've read for someone who wants to learn how to lead raids. Learn from the good raidleaders and listen carefully to them. Setting up that many rules like you've done would prolly make things more difficult then they are imho.

Not to put your effort down or anything, more to give you some ideas on how to make it easier.

 

[psyco]

Well it gets updated now and then, and you don't have to type anything in there to be able to recieve any info. just click links and read.

Atlantis Tablet is an easy enc. which I think most ppl have done once or twice. So that shouldn't be a big problem.

Ie. kill guards outside the temple, move bg inside, move up to the ceiling, fop up and all. Have someone ungrouped swim down and click a chest at the time. If it's the wrong one a guardian will appear, kill him off and do next chest until the right mob pops. There's one thing the mainmob is doing but info on that you should find out on VoS.

Note! I've read your raidrules, why make it so hard for yourself? Try to enjoy and have fun instead. I think Golenas posts are really some of the best advice I've read for someone who wants to learn how to lead raids. Learn from the good raidleaders and listen carefully to them. Setting up that many rules like you've done would prolly make things more difficult then they are imho.

Not to put your effort down or anything, more to give you some ideas on how to make it easier.

i know how to do AT just saying that vos is better for that reason...

its not hard for myself, most of it is pritty much common sence imo, i am listening and welcome it all

 

[Necromaniak]

Can we try to come up with a better way of posting raids.

How about a detailed Calender?? like this:

http://213.46.136.107/Calendar/week.php

Its public now, u can plan anything u want on a date/time

u can also make the event weekly/enabled

search on content

Its a nice sript, so tell me what u think and i might spend some time making it more graphical

Greetz!

 

[Sparx]

I was actually thinking of a calendar for raids that u can see the marked days etc

Took all of 5 mins

http://my.calendars.net/freddyshouse

i know there is a calendar on FH already but no-one uses

 

[Sparx]

i've stuck some of the Stickys on it now looks fine to me. I dont mind maintaining it. But peeps can add their own if they want

 

[Alan]

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/calendar.php?c=3&do=displaymonth

FH has its own calendar system, and one was setup for Pryd/Alb ages ago.

 

[Sparx]

i never knew that existed and neither did anyone else by the looks of it

 

[Necromaniak]

Oo!! FFS!! use it!!!

 

[Sparx]

How about a detailed Calender?? like this:

http://213.46.136.107/Calendar/week.php

Its public now, u can plan anything u want on a date/time

u can also make the event weekly/enabled

search on content

Its a nice sript, so tell me what u think and i might spend some time making it more graphical

Greetz!

seems there is 3 to choose now LOL

http://213.46.136.107/Calendar/week.php

http://my.calendars.net/freddyshouse

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/calen...o=displaymonth

Which one would ppl prefer to use?

 

[Sparx]

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/calendar.php?c=3&do=displaymonth
even

 

[Golena]

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/calendar.php?c=3&do=displaymonth
even

Any chance we can sticky this link and try to get raid leaders using it.
Looks like a great tool if people start to know about it!

 

[psyco]

Any chance we could drop ml rush's for a bit after these 3 please?

 

[thergador]

Any chance we could drop ml rush's for a bit after these 3 please?

ill not be running another till the new year gunna do a sidi raid sometime in december and may be some artie riads not sure if those needed though