CTF League Maps

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Zak

Guest
With some strong feeling (ahem) amongst clans atm about the current state of ctf league maps in general I think a thread for suggestions to BW, for any changes people would like to see to the maps used in the league is warranted.

Please, we'd like to hear your opinions. Contrary to popular belief the maps *are* chosen on some kind of merit basis and aren't part of some master plan to annoy all right-thinking ctf players. :}

--
zak
 
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bigfoot

Guest
My own early thoughts for next season map rotation would be something along the following lines

CTF2
CTF3
WCTF1
WCTF2
WCTF3
Harshg

And possibly some of the new 3wave maps later on in the season that should be out round about the same time the next season starts.

Some "contentious" points which may be raised by that pool i will try to answer from my pov -

"Keeping CTF3?" - Yes, because despite its defensive nature 5v5 it can still produce some very good games and not just boring drawathons.

"Dropping MLCTF4?" - Yes, because whilst its a reasonably decent map the over water spawns seem to annoy the hell out of people, and it does have some other flaws.

"Keeping Harshg?" - Yes, because of all the custom maps we've played i feel this one offers a different set of challenges to most other ctf maps, and whilst injecting some variety it also isn't completely insane.

"Dropping Gefsctf2?" - Yes, because its a snore-a-thon pretty much and far too big on reflection.
 
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old.PloP

Guest
OMG

I just can't believe NO ONE in the western world can see that harshg is SO UNFAIR for the red team.

well actually insanity from VS noticed too(and the rest of CN ofcourse)
 
B

bigfoot

Guest
Yes PloP it is harder when your red, which is why we would do exactly what we did this season and play it twice on the same night, once as each colour.
 
Z

Zak

Guest
I prefer being red on harshg, sorry but I do. You have to play someone in flag room because it's easier to sneak in. But it's got much nicer defending areas with height advantage.

Whoops, erm, I should go...

--
zak
 
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old.PloP

Guest
ANYWAY...

dump the custom maps and c3 and pray to God that the new 3w maps will be released mid-season :)
 
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old.Necro

Guest
Keep HarshG

I like harshg because it is one of those maps which seperates the clans that plan and practice from the ones that don't. Ok, its unbalanced, but swapping sides sorts that out.
 
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old.The_Stranger

Guest
bah
I was 3rd on this until I timed out (some lame ass isp I dont recall who) :) any how...

I like q3 for what it is...
give me any map and bring it on

I'll defned against you, I'll attack you, I'll hold you off in the midfield, whatever takes your fancy, just give me a week to learn the map and I'll do me best!
 
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old.Empedocles

Guest
Harshg has tried to do something orignal with a ctf map and i like it it brings added flavour to a ctf game
the maps list for next season looks pretty good more 3wave woulda been nice but hey what can U do.

Hopefully the new 3wave "alike" maps will rock and make there way into the leagues making BW the #1 online gaming community

Q3a rox Cs rox Cpm is ok
:)
 
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old.Tino

Guest
My opinion

Yust Q3CTF2 - Q3CTF3 and all the Threewave maps...

Those were the most enjoying matches we have played this league so.....
 
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old.Gibz

Guest
Hmm I'm still not a fan of unbalanced maps. The main issue for me is the fact it depends on which clan you get to play on that map. Ie u may still lose points from being disadvantaged during that game. If u happen to 'draw' an easier clan, you will prob win both. Just feels wrong to me.
 
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old.PloP

Guest
You are so right Gibz.... actually you are the first 1 i have ever seen in these forums who noticed that problem.

we played VS on harshg this season and NEO got a default on that map. so we lost points just cause it's a shitty unbalanced map. NEO might have won both maps anyway, but it seems to me it's all about luck wich teams you face on wich maps.
 
C

Chameleon

Guest
I like harshg cos it's so different to the others. Each colour requires a different tactic and this make for 2 very different 20 minutes I reckon.
'GEF-whatever' map is a real bore. It seems most people agree on that one.
Personally, I find ctf2 a little silly with 10 players on it. If it was 4v4 then maybe it'd be more enjoyable, but I find the map too small for 5v5.
Trouble is, there are few enough maps already it seems :(
I have no idea how to make a map, but I see talented, knowledgeable people all about the q3 community. It amazes me that there is such a lack of good CTF maps, when there's such an abundance of talent. It seems to me that 'we', as the obvious ctf enthusiasts should try to do something ourselves. Some of the ML maps for example and the 'GEF-thingy' map are lovely made maps (looks wise), but they lack form. There must be some way to get some heads together amongst those with good ideas on map layout and those who can do the textures and the complicated stuff?
Savage (doh! I said it!) have a similar thread and mention a few possibilities there. Maybe these should be explored for bw too?
Roll on the new 3w maps and team arena!!

Ch@m
 
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old.[WC]Eer0

Guest
Drop..

All the custom maps. If you want more maps
use converted q1- & q2-ctf maps i.e. Q2CTF2 Stronghold opp.
?!
ctf2
ctf3
wctf1
wctf2
wctf3
is enough.
 
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old.NJ_SteveyT

Guest
Next seasons map choice

I also do think that Harshg map is unfair to one of the sides, but if both teams play on reds then what's the problem? both get a fair shot surely? IMHO it just needs different tactics like cham says...

Also think that there are some very good ctf maps out there, but like someone else said b4, they're mostly just good looking...

NJ_SteveyT
http://www.nomad-jedi.com
 
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old.PloP

Guest
POLLS!

Maybe a poll for some maps like savage had?
Only i would make the poll so every div1-2 clan had a say about the maps in their div, and then next 2 div had a say about the maps used in their div.
 
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old.ketaMine

Guest
well, many thanks for dropping mlctf4 that is without doubt the silliest spammiest map going. spawn in water, get spammed, repeat.

im happy with the maps
 
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bigfoot

Guest
Plop i'm not going to split up the maps, it would be a nightmare for certain clans.
 
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old.Gib

Guest
Hmm I don't think anyone is questioning Harshg fairness over the course of 2 games playing either side. Its the fairness within the league itself as I mentioned in previous post. The point is for one game in that season you are disadvantaged and if you happen to draw a clan of a similar skill level, you will likely lose 3 points. Another clan could win the league as they have drawn an easier clan and the disadvantage they have is outweighed by their skillz. Or as pointed out, a clan gets a default on that map, and an equally skilled clan loses 3 points because of their draw.

Personally I would like to see BW or Savage, set up a server with some of the decent custom maps and have them tested with good even clans on them. I've tried and failed with Savage, would like to see something happen for BW. I know E set up a server for custom maps to be tried, I don't know if it's still there but it would be good to get a couple of clan matches on each custom map to test the maps for their playability. For me the key to Q3CTF playability is the maps. It's funny how I can play Q3WCTF2 and enjoy every game every time, and not maps like q3ctf3, geths etc. When I play a map, I at least like to think there is some remote chance of getting a flag out of a base ;) I think that was one of the ideas of CTF anyway.

If that doesn't happen, personally I think stick with the current default maps with a view to slapping the new threewave maps in their assuming they are pretty good. (I have a feeling they will be)
 
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old.Gib

Guest
Just to add, I am not sure splitting up the maps between divisions would be a good idea, I have a feeling this was maybe suggested after Savage gave a map poll, and there was not really any choice, because a lot of the clans would not have downloaded and tried some of the better custom maps, so they couldn't be voted for.

I see maps like japanctf played a lot in the US as a good and practically standard custom map. I have never played it in a serious game tho, but that one and couple of others in the Savage threads maybe worth a peek.
 
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Chameleon

Guest
Please can we try and get some new ones tested and introduced?? If I have to play CTF2 or 3 one more time, I might just explode!!!! :mad:
At least the 3W maps look and feel like CTF and you can have some fantastic games (i.e. BW 3W pubby too, not just league or arranged friendlies), but the ID ones were poor from the start and are really becoming a pain in the arse now imo. They're sucking away my will to live!!!!
Please save my sanity and setup some server where we can go test these custom maps out. BoP would be glad to play another clan who want to test any out.
CTF seems to be dying out a little. Just look at the pubbies most evenings. It's rare to find much beyond Demon UK with 16 clients arranged in teams of 12 v 4, all called 'Newbie' or 'Fragbait' running around trying to shoot their own feet off!! We need to find a common set of new maps which we can interest people in and as can be seen from Savage, if it's gonna work, someone has to set these up somewhere and get people on the servers!
Come on BW!! There's a lot of dedicated CTF'ers out there, but it's all becoming a bit stale imo.

Ch@m
 
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Chameleon

Guest
Originally posted by Gib
I know E set up a server for custom maps to be tried, I don't know if it's still there but it would be good to get a couple of clan matches on each custom map to test the maps for their playability
Click to expand...

They still have a list of maps here actually. Might be worth considering some of these?

Ch@m
 
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old.Gibz

Guest
I'm sure I could coax UC into testing some maps with BOP and other clans if BW can chuck up a test server mebbe?

After all Ch@m is the BW Threewave CTF server ho and deserves some variety in his life ;)

/me takes off his gamespy aliases of fragbait and newbie ;)
 
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old.Gibz

Guest
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bigfoot

Guest
I will see about getting one of the q3 servers altered to a "test" server or something.
 
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old.PloP

Guest
i'd like to test japanctf too
dunno if its on any servers though :(
 
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old.*LuX*El-Tuko

Guest
cft map harshg !

I don't think harshg should be used. It's not a fair map even if it's played twice on a evening. Blue side is easier to defend. That way a pretty weak clan can win or draw 1 map ... that can cost a promotion or even the league title to a strong clan.

my list:

ctf2 , ctf3 (still sux) , wctf1-3 , mlctf4

mlctf4 is more fair than harshg ...

i really hope that ctf3 and harshg will be replaced in next season =)

1 thing i did not understand is this: Why do we need 6 maps?
I think 5 maps are enough ... or am i wrong ?
 
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Chameleon

Guest
Originally posted by bigfoot
I will see about getting one of the q3 servers altered to a "test" server or something.
Click to expand...

Any news on that yet?
 
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