combat vs Sub rogue!!

[Jerbear]

hey all i was just woundering what might be better after this patch was set into effect? i was always being told before the patch hit that Combat rogues was alot better than Sub rogues but i was reading in the patch that they made ambush do more dmg! is this enof to change the tides of things or will it still be the same as where combat still owns?

 

[Urme the Legend]

I think Sub is better at lvl 60 and in 1vs1 fight.. but Combat it's better for grinding and Zerg vs Zerg perhaps..

 

[Nugusta]

Define "better"

 

[Urme the Legend]

Define "better"

You do more dmg without using stealth Running from target to target spamming SS with sword/dagger or sword/sword :>

 

[Mithradir]

i dinged my rogue 60 with 11 on ass, 35 on combat and 5 on sub and pvped some with that spec. Then i respeced to see how a dagger spec rogue looks like and i havent changed it so far (and i am not going to). Ambush/bs combo is very powerful and with cb and preparation it becomes lethal. My current spec is 21/7/23.

 

[Cozak]

30/8/13 seems to be a good all round spec good ambush's and backstabs whilst still being able to get combo points fast etc.

 

[Naetha]

Optimum 30/8/13 spec. I'm loving it atm - high crits, high burst damage and super fast combo point build-up. You gimp your survivability a little, but rogues are all about damage aren't they? Currently 25% chance to crit with Devilsaur set - not 60 yet though

Assassination Talents (30 points)

# Improved Eviscerate - 3/3 points
Increases the damage done by your Eviscerate ability by 15%.

# Malice - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.

# Ruthlessness - 3/3 points
Gives your finishing moves a 60% chance to add a combo point to your target.

# Murder - 1/2 point
Increases your chance to hit while using your Sap, Ambush, Garrote, or Cheap Shot abilities by 3%.

# Relentless Strikes - 1/1 point
Your finishing moves have a 20% chance per combo point to restore 25 energy.

# Lethality - 5/5 points
Increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Sinister Strike, Gouge, Backstab, Ghostly Strike, or Hemorrhage abilities by 30%.

# Improved Expose Armor - 3/3 points
Increases the armor reduced by your Expose Armor ability by 45%.

# Cold Blood - 1/1 point
When activated, increases the critical strike chance of your next Sinister Strike, Backstab, Ambush, or Eviscerate by 100%.

# Improved Kidney Shot - 3/3 points
Reduces the cooldown of your Kidney Shot ability by 5 seconds.

# Seal Fate - 5/5 points
Your critical strikes from abilities that add combo points have a 100% chance to add an additional combo point.



Combat Talents (8 points)

# Improved Gouge - 3/3 points
Increases the effect duration of your Gouge ability by 1.5 seconds.

# Improved Sinister Strike - 2/2 points
Reduces the Energy cost of your Sinister Strike ability by 5 Energy.

# Improved Backstab - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Backstab ability by 30%.



Subtlety Talents (13 points)

# Master of Deception - 5/5 points
Reduces the chance enemies have to detect you while in Stealth mode. More effective than Master of Deception (Rank 4)

# Opportunity - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt when striking from behind with your Backstab, Garrote, or Ambush abilities by 20%.

# Improved Ambush - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Ambush ability by 40%.

 

[exponentiaL]

Optimum 30/8/13 spec. I'm loving it atm - high crits, high burst damage and super fast combo point build-up. You gimp your survivability a little, but rogues are all about damage aren't they? Currently 25% chance to crit with Devilsaur set - not 60 yet though

Assassination Talents (30 points)

# Improved Eviscerate - 3/3 points
Increases the damage done by your Eviscerate ability by 15%.

# Malice - 5/5 points
Increases your critical strike chance by 5%.

# Ruthlessness - 3/3 points
Gives your finishing moves a 60% chance to add a combo point to your target.

# Murder - 1/2 point
Increases your chance to hit while using your Sap, Ambush, Garrote, or Cheap Shot abilities by 3%.

# Relentless Strikes - 1/1 point
Your finishing moves have a 20% chance per combo point to restore 25 energy.

# Lethality - 5/5 points
Increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Sinister Strike, Gouge, Backstab, Ghostly Strike, or Hemorrhage abilities by 30%.

# Improved Expose Armor - 3/3 points
Increases the armor reduced by your Expose Armor ability by 45%.

# Cold Blood - 1/1 point
When activated, increases the critical strike chance of your next Sinister Strike, Backstab, Ambush, or Eviscerate by 100%.

# Improved Kidney Shot - 3/3 points
Reduces the cooldown of your Kidney Shot ability by 5 seconds.

# Seal Fate - 5/5 points
Your critical strikes from abilities that add combo points have a 100% chance to add an additional combo point.



Combat Talents (8 points)

# Improved Gouge - 3/3 points
Increases the effect duration of your Gouge ability by 1.5 seconds.

# Improved Sinister Strike - 2/2 points
Reduces the Energy cost of your Sinister Strike ability by 5 Energy.

# Improved Backstab - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Backstab ability by 30%.



Subtlety Talents (13 points)

# Master of Deception - 5/5 points
Reduces the chance enemies have to detect you while in Stealth mode. More effective than Master of Deception (Rank 4)

# Opportunity - 5/5 points
Increases the damage dealt when striking from behind with your Backstab, Garrote, or Ambush abilities by 20%.

# Improved Ambush - 3/3 points
Increases the critical strike chance of your Ambush ability by 40%.

Though what do you do when someone blinds you? You blind him back to bandage up aswell. Then when he uses preparation to gain another 15 seconds of 'immunity' and another blind and vanish you'll probably eat dirt.

Yes, your aim is to take him down before though you can't possible stunlock a target so he will get his blind in. Then he could go for a runner or bandage, vanish and cheapshot etc you.

It might work for you though I have had alot of duels and always found myself needing an extra evasion/blind/vanish/coldblood. Prep4tw imo.

 

[Naetha]

I'd rather generate combo points twice as fast and hit damn hard than spec for an ability that is needed to beat one class of one particular spec. I know people say that prep is good (and thats good, not absolutely necessary) for fighting other classes, but to be able to do a 5 point Eviscerate in 2 or 3 hits, and then keep on racking up the CPs super fast.

Also, if you're considering duelling a specific class such as a rogue, then there's other ways you can prepare, such as using deadly poison to stop him bandaging (sure, it stops you blinding him as well, but I'd rather have control of the fight that way.)

Personally for my play style as well I prefer passive abilities rather than arguably more powerful abilities on a timer. Sure, you may be unbeatable once every ten minutes, but I'd rather have a good chance of winning all the time.

End of the day, its each to their own.

 

[mirieth!]

i played a rogue up to 55 as combat spec and i much preferred it to sub. in pvp i found with a combination of cheap shot and 5-point kidney shot, i could pretty much kill most classes (well, not warriors and palas obviously ) without them being able to hit me as they were constantly stunned. also, fighting more than one opponent, improved parry rate and blade fury were really usefull. i think it's the most 'well-rounded' spec (combat, that is) as you don't rely on stealth so much. saying all this, i never played a sub spec for more than a few levels post 50 to try it out, so i'm obviously biased .

 

[mirieth!]

Personally for my play style as well I prefer passive abilities rather than arguably more powerful abilities on a timer. Sure, you may be unbeatable once every ten minutes, but I'd rather have a good chance of winning all the time.

word! so true. hi naetha by the way . long time no see, i'll give you a poke on msn sometime .

 

[Naetha]

word! so true. hi naetha by the way . long time no see, i'll give you a poke on msn sometime .

Yeah I keep on missing people on MSN cos I'm "busy" playing Wow

Changed by talent spec btw to 31/8/12 with the extra point in vigor (+10 max energy) - its the equivalent of one point in improved cheap shot (sub tree) but obviously you've got it all the time. Makes stunlocking a fair bit easier and its just nice to have that little bit extra. Will be even more valuable if I ever get 5 pieces of Nightslayer armour...well I can dream

 

[Afran]

30/2/18 for the win~~

Ambush with dagger theny use stancesets add-on to swap to a sword/mace, mace/sword or whatever you have for SS \o/

 

[Naetha]

30/2/18 for the win~~

Ambush with dagger theny use stancesets add-on to swap to a sword/mace, mace/sword or whatever you have for SS \o/

How would you spend your 18 points on Sub?

And whats the point of going dagger spec if you don't go improved backstab? oO

 

[Afran]

How would you spend your 18 points on Sub?

And whats the point of going dagger spec if you don't go improved backstab? oO

Just for ambush. Amb > CS in most cases.

Sub:

Master of Deception 5/5
Opportunity 5/5
Improved Ambush 3/3
Initiative 5/5