Casters useless in rvr?

[old.giriam]

Ok. Try to stay with me here and read the entire thing before you respond, also please avoid the usual "whine/gimp" reply's - i got actual concerns here that i present in a civil manner, i'm entitled to expect the same from replys.

There used to be a time when casters could kill tanks and even survive a few hits from them, and life was good (although rangers and assasins would 1-shot us that was sort of ok - we realized we should have enemies aswell). Gradually this changed, instead of reducing the effectiveness of mez mythic gave tanks the abillity to remove negative effects, resist them more and have their duration shortened. thats all negative effects, not just mez that was the tanks main complaint at the time. On top of that the tanks got their dps raised, and all realms got resistbuffs to magic damage.

With melee-damage resist-caps at 26% and the cap for magic damage at something like 60% the situation is now this: tanks deal more damage than casters, cannot be interrupted and sure can take much more of a beating without going down.

What is the purpose of a damagedealing caster in rvr now? (utillity-casters is a different issue, they serve a purpose noone else can fill - but any class can deal damage) They deal the least damage of every class, and drop the easiest.

We might have been to good before (i cant really tell - as i play one i fear i'm biased) but we sure have very little going for us now. If i could have mythic implement one single thing in 1.6 it would be to hardcap all resists at 26% - end of story.

This is supposed to be more of a question than a whine - do the other classes feel that casters have been reduced in efficiency to a point where you might aswell just leave them in ligen, or is it just our former uberness (if you can use such a word on something that dies in a single hit) that is playing tricks on us?

One more EZ drop and my caster is complete - then im off to level a LW champion.

(on a more happy note: give crafters the abillity to make crowns!)

G

 

[Wuren]

Nuclear casts a spell!

You are hit for 698 damage!

 

[Tyka]

I'm sure this will get fixed, resists are way out of hand at this moment. Agree with you that hard cap for resists should be 26%, just like melee resists.

Mythic always wants us to group in this game (so every class have their role in rvr), so if you setup a good group you usually wont have a problem with the resist thingie. For example get a mana chanter to debuff for you.

Don't reroll a "class of the month", all classes will go through the same stuff, im sure mythic will give mage classes some help soon

 

[Tyka]

Originally posted by Wuren
Nuclear casts a spell!

You are hit for 698 damage!

Heh, you were debuffed, that kind of dmg debuffed is pretty low imo, and its with a crit.

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Wuren
Nuclear casts a spell!

You are hit for 698 damage!

First of all that means your energy-resists are horrible and if you dont cap them out then thats your own fault. I realize you dont use resistbuffs for a duel - I am talking about RvR.

Either get with the program and present arguments or go elsewhere.

G

 

[Eleasias]

<- got 4 shotted by a darkness runie with ~2 sec cast time, 32% cold resist. yeah, casters suck.

 

[Wuren]

No I was not debuffed, its with 29 % energy resists.

But anyway, since they implented the group resists buffs things got a little bit out of hand, I get hit more from meele then magic in normal rvr and thats a bit wrong imo. But then again, If u look at it how it was before the loving, tanks where just there to be farmed.

 

[Tyka]

4 shots to take down a ranger imo is way too much, u should have been max 2 shotted.

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Tyka
I'm sure this will get fixed, resists are way out of hand at this moment. Agree with you that hard cap for resists should be 26%, just like melee resists.

Mythic always wants us to group in this game (so every class have their role in rvr), so if you setup a good group you usually wont have a problem with the resist thingie. For example get a mana chanter to debuff for you.

Don't reroll a "class of the month", all classes will go through the same stuff, im sure mythic will give mage classes some help soon

I hope you are right, since albion got some caster-love in this patch I guess its midgard next and then hibernia. Still think mythic went around this the wrong way though - IE why not simply nerf mez rather than giving some of the classes (in the right group) a 80% reduction in the effectiveness.

Im still going to level the LW champ though

G

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Wuren
But anyway, since they implented the group resists buffs things got a little bit out of hand, I get hit more from meele then magic in normal rvr and thats a bit wrong imo. But then again, If u look at it how it was before the loving, tanks where just there to be farmed.

I agree, mythic just missed the "middle ground" by a mile or so.

G

 

[Tyka]

Originally posted by old.giriam


I hope you are right, since albion got some caster-love in this patch I guess its midgard next and then hibernia. Still think mythic went around this the wrong way though - IE why not simply nerf mez rather than giving some of the classes (in the right group) a 80% reduction in the effectiveness.

Tbh this is how i think it will be, mythic give albion caster love and migdard whatever, then when its time for hibernia they add a new bind stone at innis, thats about it.

 

[Eleasias]

Originally posted by Tyka
4 shots to take down a ranger imo is way too much, u should have been max 2 shotted.

this was on my hero

 

[Tyka]

then its fine lol

Seriously 4 shots from range that takes alot of time, about 6-8 secs to cast, i think you or someone else in your crew should get to the caster in time to interrupt him, if i get 4 shots in a row in a fight im lucky. And its not often someone have their resist buffs faded wich i guess happened in your situation.

 

[old.Odysseus]

A few casters are so lucky that they have more in their arsenal than nukes

 

[finbahr]

nerfed

yep i full light eldritch time to delete and get a tank

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by old.Odysseus
A few casters are so lucky that they have more in their arsenal than nukes

So does a lot of tanks and hybrids.

If you could be as kind as to give examples then I will have a chance at countering them, as your statement stands now it is rather useless.

G

 

[oblivion_6]

Speaking for myself a voidey

I find i can one-shot rangers other mages and sometimes stealthers.

However with the cack bolt nerf this is tough to do in grps however dont underestimate the power of the casters as we can damage several enemies at the one time even if it is for less dmg it still helps

Also GTAOE is possibly one of the most handy of RvR tools as I can use that to seek out stealthers or camp gates

 

[Kobold]

Originally posted by old.giriam


So does a lot of tanks and hybrids.

If you could be as kind as to give examples then I will have a chance at countering them, as your statement stands now it is rather useless.

G

Afaik he was talking about theurg pets

 

[Kobold]

BTW mages are far from useless in RvR. I'm full light ment and sure own other casters in a few secs. Tanks with resist buffs can be a bit hard, but they go down after a few blasts anyways

Get mom and wp up and maybe a mana chanter to resist debuff and poor enemies!

 

[old.Xanthian]

Ive given up on my Eldritch for now, nuking for 150(-250) takes the piss.
Leveling a Luri Chanter Bomb atm, gonna abuse the heat debuff + light base DD.
Get MoM & WP up high and it can be quite nasty im sure

Does anyone know if the debuff crit RA works for Chanter resist debuffs?

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by old.Eternal[EW]
BTW mages are far from useless in RvR. I'm full light ment and sure own other casters in a few secs. Tanks with resist buffs can be a bit hard, but they go down after a few blasts anyways

I can take down casters aswell my point isnt what can be done in the odd situation - the point is that all the other classes drop anything we can kill just as fast. so what are we getting in return for our lack in healthpoints and the fact that we get interrupted if a mild breeze sets in?

with the overly resistant people running around these days the answer is very little in my opinion.

G

 

[Kobold]

It's true that a tank with capped resists, resists buffs and AoM will be close to impossible to kill for a mage (I admit taht bothers me a bit ), but you know SC will cost hell of alot and far from everyone is gonna get a uber set of SC stuff to cap everything I'm pretty sure of

Buuut the ritch dudes will be a pain

But on the other side, show me a tank that can stun and kill another lvl 50 char from 1500 range :merlin:

/EDIT
of forgot, witch tank class can give damage to 50 peeps in 2 sec(unless they implemented pulverize, tauron abilety from WC3)? AE damage ownz hehe

 

[boni_ofdavoid]

I agree totaly with this topic. Here are the options as I see them:-

a). A cloth wearing 'elf', that can deal 2-400 pts at range, has around 1khps and dies whenever anyone reaches melee range.

b). A scale wearing 'celt' that can deal 2-400 pts in melee. has about 2khps and takes about 1 minute to take down.

basically if a tank notices me casting, then I AM dead.

Hero alt now almost 45... Elph in retirement...

 

[Qte Eth]

tank takes mages down very easy too ,and u want to say mages are needed to take down enemy mages?heh.

 

[Arnor]

With melee-damage resist-caps at 26% and the cap for magic damage at something like 60% the situation is now this: tanks deal more damage than casters, cannot be interrupted and sure can take much more of a beating without going down.

Thats why you can DEBUFF magic-resists, and not melee resists. You've had your hour of power, and the hells angels chapter had their way...tonight! Its MY turn! <begins singing>

only thing mythic really fucked was how variable accessibility the group-resist buffs are in each realm.


oh, and give casters bigger power bar

 

[old.Odysseus]

Originally posted by old.giriam


So does a lot of tanks and hybrids.

If you could be as kind as to give examples then I will have a chance at countering them, as your statement stands now it is rather useless.

G

OK, 2 weeks ago a skald got the drop on me.
He died.


That was the short version. Long version;
qc mezz, get range, petspam. he even popped IP - guess he should have bought purge instead

What I mean by more than damage is something in the line of:
PBT
Haste
EB
Root
Mezz
Pets (they dont suck as much as ppl say)

edit:
The arrogant note:
I can kill any tank in a 1v1 if I start at distance and 75%+ power. Even if they have IP and purge.
And yes, I have tested this against all tank types in albion, including most of what hib and mid has to offer.

 

[Pempulla]

I don't even want to bother with reading through all the posts in this thread, but the answer to the question in the topic is simply:

NO!

 

[old.chipper]

i agree resists are stupid atm i hit a caster with a nuke and hit for 117 and im a full light spec mentalist
this is just plain stupid a tank can hit me for 600 if he gets lucky more with a crit it was my thinking that casters could always take down any class in 2 bolts couple of nukes or 4-5 nukes that isnt the case any more it can take over 10 casts to kill a tank and thats without counting resists they should hard cap all resists to 26% and merely deal with the issue that annoys people more than any other instead of skirting round it like always that issue is mez

short run down, a caster should be able to kill a tank before he gets to you or at least have them on low power all these RA ip and FA it should be a case of one or the other not both killing a tank two and a half times is stupid and as for paladins well whats point of even attackin them u aint gonna kill a high Realm ranked one who can have up to and over about 6k hitpoints with FH IP and FA

 

[-Nuked-]

imo a caster same con as a tank should be able to kill the tank in the same amount of nukes as it takes to kill a mob of the same con (not including the resistance debuff) at current i find a tank with 19+% cold resist of con yellow stature takes 2 bolts a cold debuff 3 dd's and a stun! .. a con yellow mob goes down nice and easy in 2 bolts and 1 dd. no stun needed usually.
i believe nukers are getting slightly screwed! (as if void isn't getting screwed enough as it is atm) my experience in pvp with the void eld atm is minimal but thx to duel challenge i was able to depress myself with these findings

 

[old.giriam]

Originally posted by Arnor2
Thats why you can DEBUFF magic-resists, and not melee resists. You've had your hour of power, and the hells angels chapter had their way...tonight! Its MY turn! <begins singing>

yeah i can see the debuff cold resist as an argument but doesnt that leave the group with two casters one person short? one has to debuff for the other and have little time to do anything else. Thats an overstatement ofcourse but there is a lot of timing etc going on if two casters want to debuff for eachother, certain classes dont match etc, would have been a lot better to just cap resists at 26 imho etc.

G