Balancing Insta CC

[Alithiel]

In reading around the new RA list, the description of how purge will work in Frontiers is:

Level 1 purge is on a 15 minute timer but has a 10 second delay.

This got me thinking about applying delays to other 'instant' effects, and what effect it would have on game balance.

So my question to you all is this:

Would adding a 2 second delay (equal to the cast time for a Quickcast spell) to all forms of Insta CC help to create a more level playing field and improve balance between the realms in general RvR?

 

[old.Sko]

Unless crowd control is moved to cloth caster in hibernia and midgard this will make sorc always win mezzes.

 

[Antedeluvian]

Crowd control on RM and mentalists instead bards and healers, but then healers would have an inutil 3rd line in pacification (wait a moment, just like clerics?)

 

[judas]

Crowd control on RM and mentalists instead bards and healers, but then healers would have an inutil 3rd line in pacification (wait a moment, just like clerics?)

excelent idea.

 

[[NO]Magmatic]

Unless crowd control is moved to cloth caster in hibernia and midgard this will make sorc always win mezzes.

Yes bards and healers never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, win a mez fight now when not using insta's.... They always lose.... Oh wait, at least bard manages to get off a normal mez a lot (if he knows how to play his class)... And healers wherent that bad at it either...

So why would it have to be on a cloth char? Because they have more dex or something?

I like this idea myself... Or just give healers & bards a QC that only works on their CC spells...

 

[old.Sko]

mag i meant head to head, both start casting at same time etc.
Ofc not situation when you have afk /stuck sorc ~

 

[Vasconcelos]

I know this gonna sound funneh and piss mind sorcs but...


How about making Smite the main CC line of Albion giving it aoemezz n some utilities??? (clerics dont have quickcast)

Lotsa posibilities of setup groups suddenly opened

 

[rvn]

healer with ~300 dex, bard with ~300 - 320 dex, vs sorc with 350ish dex and 1875 range, i dont think we want instas removed or on timer. now with toa a sorc should allways win mezz if they spot the enemy fast enough (ie not being afk) so it has allready been balanced.

 

[vintervargen]

by the way, what will change with GP? will it be removed? or given to all realms?

 

[Nalistah]

just remove every insta CC from this game.

 

[Alithiel]

Unless crowd control is moved to cloth caster in hibernia and midgard this will make sorc always win mezzes.

No, you misunderstand... The mid/hib mezz would still be an insta, it just wouldn't take effect for 2 seconds after the button is pressed. You'd probably get a lot of tied mezzes, but that would be an indication of balance (imo).

 

[yaruar]

just remove every insta CC from this game.

and remove albs bolt range mez.

 

[Freppe]

just remove every insta CC from this game.

If u give the same range for normal cc to healers/bards.

 

[old.Sko]

No, you misunderstand... The mid/hib mezz would still be an insta, it just wouldn't take effect for 2 seconds after the button is pressed. You'd probably get a lot of tied mezzes, but that would be an indication of balance (imo).

Oh joy, spot teh sorc, insta mezz/stun it, as you wave hands with castable and get full mezz on your group. Or even worse - use ae stun as last resort and congratulate yourself with being mezzed and stun immunity on opposing group ~

PS. I think bonedancer with all features of pac in suppression line will be funny ^^
PPS. And none will tell then that supp bds take no skill to play =D

 

[Nalistah]

If u give the same range for normal cc to healers/bards.

or cap all CC to 1500

 

[Vindicator]

Its said time and time again by mids and hibs that they do not use Insta's. Infact some of them Claim not to even have them on the bar ^^.

The fact is Insta Aoe Stun + Casted Normal mezz is devasating. Before Toa it didnt matter sorcs had bolt range mezz, healer sprints insta stun + mezz or Just Mezz and cast Stun < sm grp etc >. With Toa they have a range increase < so do Healers for There Insta's> and ofc casting + dex raise. Bards and healers are able to land mezz perfectly fine and dont have to relie on Insta's all the time, as im sure most good healers or bards will say, just sometimes its used to get an advantage.

Some people moan about the fact your making the group immune to stun with that insta and it only last's a few seconds. Yes thats true...... In those few secs your savages / casters have killed the sorc and possibly a Cleric / Caster. Meaning they wont be CC'd unless sorc is rezzed fast in which case your ma shud see this before it happens. Same applies for hib, Chanters / Elds pick off the main CC in that short Insta mezz Duration. Its a great advantage to start off, no 2 ways to look at it.

As for change to it ? I dont see 1 that wouldnt result in somebody whining or it being actually unfair to some Realm / Class either.

If they just boosted the 2nd mezz lines of the other realms you would have more than 1 CC'er and alb / hib could be like mid to a degree while still having different class's. Air Theurgist for Aoe mezz, Light Eldritch for Aoe Mezz. Ice Theurgist for Aoe Root and imo only ofc giv Light Chanters Aoe Stun . There bloody useless as is now. Would mean both alb and hib could field more than 1 class than can actually CC, Im aware droods arent half bad it either but its an exception to the rule.

 

[judas]

hmm or remove hybrids whit det

 

[[NO]Subedai]

in something as fundamentally important as rvr it wuld be a good idea to homogenise the messes of each realm.
like give sorc healer bard basically the same messes. make game alot better

 

[Asha]

I don't want some kinda pac line on clerics, it would mean sorc is what...? Also cleric w/o insta stun/qc/insta ranged mez is going to be at a disadvantage in mez wars. I don't think mids or hibs have some huge upper hand with instas. There is NO reason albs can't use instas too, like on mincer or reaver if you decide to play with one to stop casting - just means you cannot all afk on sorc and expect to win a mez fight. Sorc has its good points, healer and bard have thiers...

What does bother me is that a pac healer can spec high enough pac to be very effective (am not looking up the number) and still have spread heals. They should have to chose, good healer or good CC'er. They should either increase the spec needed in pac for decent pac healers or increase the spec points into mend for the first spread heal or decrease the spec points needed on cleric/druid for first spread heal so that when buff shearing comes we can have a buff shearer w/o giving up a spread heal. Or give clerics 2x spec poinst per level and ability to fly. Which will happen first? :x

 

[rvn]

would love to see sorcs have insta mezzes, most of them playing now would completely waste all instas and get batted down even harder

for you albs who havent played hibb and think instamezz vs midds is even an option think again. instamezz lasts like 2sec and if you arent heat debuffing the savages instanly it will be the same outcome as not have mezzed at all.

 

[Fedaykin]

would love to see sorcs have insta mezzes, most of them playing now would completely waste all instas and get batted down even harder

for you albs who havent played hibb and think instamezz vs midds is even an option think again. instamezz lasts like 2sec and if you arent heat debuffing the savages instanly it will be the same outcome as not have mezzed at all.

still an advantage

will still last quite a few secs on the 3 healers, skald and maybe the SM's etc now

its better than being mezzed anyway

 

[rvn]

good sorc with +10% cast time, mota3 - 4, 10% range, or so, should NEVER loose over a healer if he spots him at clip range


so its just to avoid milegates, and make sure to cut "hills" in a favor for yourself

 

[Asha]

not really, if you get mezzed you can purge/gp/gp and probably get a cast mez off as bard isn't normall the first target... well it's not our first target, dunno about mids

 

[rvn]

yep, very easy cast with a theurg pet stuck to you

 

[Zzang]

Yes bards and healers never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, win a mez fight now when not using insta's.... They always lose.... Oh wait, at least bard manages to get off a normal mez a lot (if he knows how to play his class)... And healers wherent that bad at it either...

This says more about excals sorcs then about the overpoweredness of instaspells.

 

[Sabu]

Give Hibernia AE stun and lets rock and roll ^^.

 

[rvn]

would love to face aoe stun, especiall with some det tanks in grp, hider free from slam, so dont have to blow purge when i get slammed in box (and not like chanters would kill support while being interrupted from det tanks.)

 

[Killerbee]

I don't want some kinda pac line on clerics, it would mean sorc is what...? Also cleric w/o insta stun/qc/insta ranged mez is going to be at a disadvantage in mez wars. I don't think mids or hibs have some huge upper hand with instas. There is NO reason albs can't use instas too, like on mincer or reaver if you decide to play with one to stop casting - just means you cannot all afk on sorc and expect to win a mez fight. Sorc has its good points, healer and bard have thiers...

What does bother me is that a pac healer can spec high enough pac to be very effective (am not looking up the number) and still have spread heals. They should have to chose, good healer or good CC'er. They should either increase the spec needed in pac for decent pac healers or increase the spec points into mend for the first spread heal or decrease the spec points needed on cleric/druid for first spread heal so that when buff shearing comes we can have a buff shearer w/o giving up a spread heal. Or give clerics 2x spec poinst per level and ability to fly. Which will happen first? :x

Well written post. What annoyed me a bit with mid's insta - the fact, they had 2 healers with them. Ofc the 2nd one (mend/pac healer) with 36 (?) pac isn't that good, but still provide a second chance.

I think before spreadheals, most of the pac healers had 48 in pac (not sure tho), but the spreadheal and the ammount of det tanks in game also made kinda pointless to spec above 44 (and lose spread ).

Despite of this I'm not a big fan of nerfs (had one with my smiter and thanks, that was enough ) - so rather give something to the clerics/druids then remove from healers.

 

[rvn]

and sorc has so poor utility, with dex/qui debuff, dex debuff,str/con debuff, str debuff, root.

if there is someone that can whine about util it should be the bard wich basicly just has mezz and endsong, + interrupts wich is quite easy to avoid by rooting him and moveing outside the 700 range dd

 

[Denisée]

Would adding a 2 second delay (equal to the cast time for a Quickcast spell) to all forms of Insta CC help to create a more level playing field and improve balance between the realms in general RvR?

They gave Ichor 1sec cast time (Shaman/Sorc/Valewalker) and gave it to sorcs. Ain't you happy ?
They removed something that ie. druids get for free (36 nature 10 min timer and 56sec duration) from shamans (Ichor, 14 pts, 15 min timer, 30sec duration), and gave sorcs access to the modified version. And you complain ?
1s timer is faster than your castable mez. You can use it, and then cast mez.

- This RA should never have gone to the main CC class in the realm...! -

With det, resists etc Insta's suck. You got the best CC class there is in the game and you need help to relaice it.