ADSL, networking, and no wires

Clown

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OK.

At the moment, I have three computers here, and I want to buy a laptop. One computer here is the gateway as it has the modem in it, and the other computers connect to the internet, internet sharing thingy.

Now, I'm going to want it so that each computer can access the internet without the gateway being on, but I'll also want them all networked to transfer files and stuff across, and maybe play games. I have some money to spend, but I don't have to/want to splash out on the best of the best for silly money. I just want this stuff to do the job. Except I dunno what stuff to buy :eek:

I was thinking:
3 x PCI wireless network adapter things
1 x PCMCIA wireless thingy
And some sort of ADSL router/switch jobby thingy

This is where you lot come in... Help me please :)
I have no idea what I'm looking at, or talking about (as usual)
 

fatbusinessman

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I would say that there's not a huge amount to choose from in terms of brand, but Netgear are reputable.

PCI Card - £50
PCMCIA Card - £45
ADSL router/access point - £125

That should sort you - you could just get a straight access point and save £30 or so, but that would require setting up a computer as a dedicated gateway.
 

Deadmanwalking

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Indeed, a router is a must i would say.

And don't forget Linksys between them and netgear you will have some nice kit.

Oh and dabs FFS. :(
 

Deadmanwalking

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fatbusinessman said:
Was that in the sense of "FFS, don't use Dabs" or "FFS, make sure you use Dabs"?
As i will get a right munting if i say what i really meant, i will now lie.

I meant Use dabs as they are excellent and customer service is superb :D
 

fatbusinessman

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It should work, yes, although it may require a certain amount of configuration (I haven't personally used Netgear's wireless products, so I can't be certain about this).

The wireless standard that these products support (802.11g) operates at 54 megabits/sec, so it's about half as fast as a wired connection. However, if you've got your devices a long way apart (or happen to have erected a lead-lined concrete block between them) then the bad reception will force your connection down to a slightly slower speed.
 

RandomBastard

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I hasten to point out that transfering stuff over wireless will be slower than a wired equivalent as with wired each pc has its own transmission medium. Over wireless you only have one transmission medium.

Eg to transfer over wireless from one machine to another one has to send to the router over that medium at the same time as the other machine is receiving it from the router at the same time.
 

Clown

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I could just leave stuff running overnight, that aint a problem. I'm more worried about the gaming and people whoring my bandwidth. Could I control the rest of the network from a single computer?

By the way, thanks guys. You lot have made this shit a lot more clearer for me :)
 

RandomBastard

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As for gaming, lan games are no problem over wireless although we tend to have the server wired to the router. Pings when gaming range from 20ms to 30ms which tends to be the fact we were using a laptop to host.

Gaming over the internet is no problem with the router adding a mere 1 or 2 ms to the overall ping.

As for bandwidth wh0ring / controlling the network from your pc. How do you mean? You can restrict access to the wireless by both varying strength ascii or hex keys and/or a mac access / deny address list.

I've never seen a netgear or dlink router that allows bandwidth restriction on a per pc basis tho.
 

Clown

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I meant like completely disable the networking going from router to PC2 and PC3, from PC1. If I really don't like the extra ping in the gaming over the internet, then I could always just connect to the router with a normal wire, right?
 

jaba

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I recently bought me a
Netgear DG834GUK 54Mbps Wireless ADSL Firewall Router linkeh
and a wireless networking card...took no time at all to set up and hasnt caused me any troubles whatsoever, would thoroughly recommend it for what you need
 

fatbusinessman

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Clown said:
If I really don't like the extra ping in the gaming over the internet, then I could always just connect to the router with a normal wire, right?
Should you find that the wireless connection generates lag then yes, pretty much all wireless access points have a wired port on the back. However, I wouldn't think that any noticeable lag would be generated over and above that of a wired connection.
 

Clown

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Yeh, it shouldn't do... the link is waaaaaay faster than the speed of my ADSL.
 

Clown

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jaba said:
I recently bought me a
Netgear DG834GUK 54Mbps Wireless ADSL Firewall Router linkeh
and a wireless networking card...took no time at all to set up and hasnt caused me any troubles whatsoever, would thoroughly recommend it for what you need
I'm really nub with this... If I have the wireless ADSL router, then it will work with whatever computer has the wireless network card? What's stopping people on the road using my internet? :eek:
Also, do these things work as a hub/switch?
 

jaba

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They are routers mate, so they will work as a hub/switch type thing yes...the one i have has lots of nice security features to stop other people using it like thie WEP malarky but the best one/useful in my opinion is the trusted hosts...you enter a list of MAC addresses into a list on the router which then only allows the comuters with those MAC addresses to use it. So for other people on your road to use it they would have to come and nick your network card first :) If i can set the bugger up anyone can!
 

adams901

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You should get...

Zyxel 652 H/HW - Wireless Ready VPN Solution - £171.54 (the PCMCIA Card comes with it)
3 x Netgear MA111 - 11Mbps USB Adaptor - £35.24 Each

From www.broadbandstore.co.uk

This is the set-up I have and have never had any issues with it, I have 2 PCs using the Netgear MA111 adapter and one PC using wire.

The Router also has a Bandwidth monitor which allows you to set bandwidth restrictions on computers using it.
 

adams901

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nothing wrong with USB adaptors i'll have you know. Have had 2 PCs using them for 6 months with no problems what so ever :).
 

Deadmanwalking

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I hate USB network adaptors im afraid :(

But to be fair i suppose adams has got a fairly sound set up there.

*psst* Ignore him *cough*
 

adams901

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Deadmanwalking said:
I hate USB network adaptors im afraid :(
Good Reasoning there :rolleyes:, I prefer USB adaptors for a number of reasons, I dont need to pull my case out, less cards in my PC the better, and I have found them to be just as reliable as PCI Cards.

Deadmanwalking said:
But to be fair i suppose adams has got a fairly sound set up there.
Yes I do :)

Deadmanwalking said:
*psst* Ignore him *cough*
At your own peril
 

Clown

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11Mbps but a little bit cheaper.... aaarrghhh. I don't think all my computers have USB :eek:
 

Insane

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wireless networking, what fun!

have a nosey at http://www.wifi-warehouse.co.uk/ for some kit, its ran by the same team behind DSLWarehouse

a simple option would be a wireless ADSL router with 4 network ports, and leave the 3 computers wired up to the router, then use the laptop with wireless.

Linksys WRT54G 4-Port 54Mbps Wireless Broadband Router
http://www.wifi-warehouse.co.uk/product.asp?pr=WRT54G&pm=298
£75.19 Including VAT at 17.5%

(just in case the laptop doesnt come with wireless already built-in, but if its new thats very unlikely)
Netgear WG511 CardBus 54Mbps Wireless Adapter
http://www.wifi-warehouse.co.uk/product.asp?pr=WG511&pm=566
£51.69 Including VAT at 17.5%

if you do want to do complete wireless. keep with the above but add either 3 of these...
Linksys WMP54G PCI Wireless Adapter
http://www.wifi-warehouse.co.uk/product.asp?pr=WMP54G&pm=562
£42.29 Including VAT at 17.5%

or two of the above, and a USB adaptor.
Netgear WG121 54Mbps Wireless USB 2.0 Adapter
http://www.wifi-warehouse.co.uk/product.asp?pr=WG121&pm=2671
£56.39 Including VAT at 17.5%

(usb is handy for upgrading PCs, or when your signals poor you can change angle and position of it quickly)

Now the complete prices.
for the router, laptop card and x3 PCI cards the cost is:
£259.63 :eek:

for router, laptop card, x2 PCI and a USB is:
£273.73 :eek6:

or the route i prefer, just the router and laptop card:
£132.76 :D

note: thats all 54g wireless kit and mostly linksys/netgear which i know works, because i've used the 11mb netgear WAP and 22mb linksys pcmcia card together with no problems.
 

Clown

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Yeh, I really don't want all these wires going around the house. I think I want that 50Mbps connections because I play games and I have really big files to transfer.

Thank you guys, thanks very much!
 

adams901

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11mbps or 50mbps will give you the same gaming pings as your adsl connection wont be anywhere near as fast as either of those 2.
 

Clown

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Heeh, crud, I meant lanning gaming. Sorry :eek:
Only maybe two of these computers will play games over the net.
 

Covenant

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jaba said:
They are routers mate, so they will work as a hub/switch type thing yes...the one i have has lots of nice security features to stop other people using it like thie WEP malarky but the best one/useful in my opinion is the trusted hosts...you enter a list of MAC addresses into a list on the router which then only allows the comuters with those MAC addresses to use it. So for other people on your road to use it they would have to come and nick your network card first :) If i can set the bugger up anyone can!
Sadly, Wireless is open to wardriving/warchalking, and WEP/MAC authentication ain't all that secure...for instance:



This lets you change the MAC address of your network card, and NetStumbler, when combined with Ethereal, will allow you to sniff out MAC addresses from airbound packets :(

Given that most home users aren't going to be too bothered by people sharing their APs, if they've changed their SSID from the default that comes with the hardware. I could go into channel bleedover and all that malarky, but that's getting too complex.

For gaming, I'd say you'd do fine with off-the-shelf stuff, but if you're conscious of your local machine security, make sure you use good passwords and disable and shares you have that give complete access (such as the Root Drive share, C$, on Microsoft machines).

WEP can be cracked by doing an Ethereal sniff from a WLAN card and analyzing the packet capture for repeated strings and hex-converting them, or using some of the free Perl scripts that crack WEP encryption. Takes about 20 minutes to crack a 40-bit key, and an hour or so for 128-bit.

I could go on forever, but you're probably all bored sh*tless now...
 

Clown

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Not at all. We have some dodgy people living round here :(
 

adams901

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Well look on the bright side to get onto your wireless network they will have to be relatively close to you, so just buy a baseball bat as well as a router.
 

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